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  • FIRST POST
    • orangesnaps
    • By orangesnaps 15th Nov 18, 3:40 PM
    • 66Posts
    • 52Thanks
    orangesnaps
    Outfox The Market Direct Debit changes
    • #1
    • 15th Nov 18, 3:40 PM
    Outfox The Market Direct Debit changes 15th Nov 18 at 3:40 PM
    MoneySavingExpert.com Insert December 2018:

    You might like to read our latest news story:

    Outfox the Market customers vent fury over energy bill hikes

    Back to the original post...

    We switched from Eon to OTM on late May of this year. Our monthly debit is £100.21, we are currently £370+ in credit. Our monthly bill is £50-70 & that's with the meter reading (no estimates). I've just got an email that they are hiking our DD to £140.29 without any way to decline it. I don't agree with it. Once the bill for this month comes which will be about the same usage from last month, we will be in credit for £400+. How much more do they want?

    We can't switch without avoiding the exit fee as we are in a fixed tariff with them.
    From our experience with Eon, they gave the customer the option to lower the direct debit to a certain point.
    Last edited by Former MSE Andrea; 17-12-2018 at 1:02 PM.
Page 5
    • p00pieb0tt0m
    • By p00pieb0tt0m 16th Nov 18, 11:09 AM
    • 220 Posts
    • 166 Thanks
    p00pieb0tt0m
    I'm not happy about this change to DD and webchatted yesterday with OTM. I was told that I'd be able to leave without exit fees as I'm on a fixed term contract.

    I have looked today at changing supplier but can't find a better deal!

    Looking through this thread and wondering what would happen if they did go bust, I've found this on OFGEM. https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/consumers/household-gas-and-electricity-guide/extra-help-energy-services/ofgem-safety-net-if-your-energy-supplier-goes-out-business

    I'm gonna stay for now, while I'm on this tariff and look again when it runs out.

    I took a screenshot of their terms and conditions, 'Section 7.2, Paying by standard direct debit means:' on 14th November at 20.21 and now 16th Nov 12.42 it has been changed to mention the seasonality. it didn't mention it 2 days ago.
    Last edited by p00pieb0tt0m; 16-11-2018 at 11:44 AM.
    • Alfons
    • By Alfons 16th Nov 18, 11:25 AM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Alfons
    I'm mid-switch - got the bad news just after the cooling off period ended - Currently trying to get switch cancelled as an "erroneous transfer" due to mis-selling. I was going to cancel when I realised it's the same group of Companies behind Fischer Future Heat, and wish I had.
  • archived user
    I'm mid-switch - got the bad news just after the cooling off period ended - Currently trying to get switch cancelled as an "erroneous transfer" due to mis-selling. I was going to cancel when I realised it's the same group of Companies behind Fischer Future Heat, and wish I had.
    Originally posted by Alfons
    Welcome to the forum. Do you have any firm evidence of mis-selling? I think that you are going to struggle to get the supplier to agree that your switch was an erroneous transfer.

    OFTM's terms and conditions state:

    We reserve the right to change your contract at any time and will provide the relevant advance notice where applicable according to our licence conditions.
    14.2

    Please be aware that none of following constitutes a disadvantageous change however this list is not exhaustive and is merely illustrative:

    Changing your payment method.

    Increasing additional charges.

    Moving you automatically onto a variable tariff.

    Changing or withdrawing any benefits in accordance with this contract.
    Increasing the VAT you pay.

    Making changes to the contract if we are required by Ofgemís rules to make them.

    Making any change which we are permitted to and which is within our remit to decide to make.
    Last edited by Hengus; 16-11-2018 at 11:30 AM.
    • Tallulahhogbrown
    • By Tallulahhogbrown 16th Nov 18, 11:45 AM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Tallulahhogbrown
    Only just joined
    I have only just joined after being quoted £59 per month and am now told it will be £104 for 6 months and £45 for the other 6 months of the year. Do they not understand that the reason people pay monthly is so that there are no spikes in monthly payments.

    I have cancelled my direct debit and unless I receive some sort of agreement from them that I can pay one standard monthly fee I will be leaving them.

    I'm very new to this forum and I see lots of posts but there doesn't seem to be any answers!!!!!!
    Last edited by Tallulahhogbrown; 16-11-2018 at 11:46 AM. Reason: mistake in typing
    • MadMat
    • By MadMat 16th Nov 18, 1:04 PM
    • 259 Posts
    • 119 Thanks
    MadMat
    I'm also affected by this. my direct debit has gone up from £138 to £194. not impressed at all.

    and the only reason i'm in Debt is because last time they changed the DD they skipped a months payment!
    • MadMat
    • By MadMat 16th Nov 18, 1:24 PM
    • 259 Posts
    • 119 Thanks
    MadMat
    The webchat is offline and no reply to an email sent yesterday. I'm tempted to start a switch and see if they bother to contact me then!
    • Alfons
    • By Alfons 16th Nov 18, 1:48 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Alfons
    Thanks for the welcome. I'm not an expert in consumer law, but I think the information I was given to help me choose, including what the direct debit would be and how calculated trumps the small print. The new calculation both costs more for the next few months, and more over the course of a year since payments go up in winter by far more than they go down in summer.
    • Megalodon
    • By Megalodon 16th Nov 18, 1:53 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Megalodon
    I'm with Fischer Energy, which appears to operate from the same premises as OTM. My DD is also rising by around £50 per month over winter. Tried calling but "all lines are busy". No reply from emails yet. Previous energy suppliers have not worried about building up a surplus.
    Wonder if my bank can refuse the rise if I ask them?
    • Smartiedriver
    • By Smartiedriver 16th Nov 18, 2:50 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Smartiedriver
    Hi everyone.
    My concern is that this will become industry practice. A few people have mentioned other companies that have gone to seasonal direct debits. If we switch to another company will we find ourselves in the same position again in a few months time?
    Surely we should be given the option to decide whether we want a seasonal DD or a fixed DD.
    Do the banks still do standing orders? This would give us control back.

    The latest email I’ve had from them says they want to ensure “every customer pays for their actual annual energy consumption”. Surely that’s the point of paying monthly in the first place.

    Next they will be charging us for what we use each month, like they do for our phones. But that would mean that they don’t have our large credit surpluses to sit on all through the summer. Hmmm
    Last edited by Smartiedriver; 16-11-2018 at 2:50 PM. Reason: Typo
    • DouglasRankine
    • By DouglasRankine 16th Nov 18, 3:03 PM
    • 55 Posts
    • 46 Thanks
    DouglasRankine
    I switched to outfoxthemarket a month or so ago. They have now written to me saying that I have to move over to a new direct debit regime, which entails me increasing my payments to £135 a month from £78 from now until next April, and then dropping it to approx £55 a month for a few months. As a senior citizen on a fixed pension, I can't afford it, so I have written to them complaining. They sent out another email, saying anyone who wished to complain had to submit a photo of their meter readings, and then they would assess the credit. I have since written another complaint saying that my electricity meter is too high up for me to reach and I would need a step ladder and use both hands. I am a bit disabled and am very unstable on my legs. I could submit a meter reading using a torch and writing it down. I am awaiting their reply. I am very worried about this because it seems to me that the company is getting desperate for money, and is not taking into consideration the needs and requirements of its customers. I have asked them for their advice on what I should do...
    Jennie Rankine
    • Frustation
    • By Frustation 16th Nov 18, 3:40 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Frustation
    40% increase in Direct Debit by Outfox the market
    First post so may get lost...
    I like others on this thread have also received an email stating an increase of 40% to my DD for winter so I've emailed them back stating that I find this un-exceptable because
    1 I was quoted a fixed monthly rate not a variable rate DD (New quotes now 2 separate rates )
    2 I am £250+ in credit (built up since May 2018) and want to remain in credit so I don't suffer from 'Winter shock' which is what this is about
    3 Energy prices have risen but not by 40% (Price rise notice appears to have been removed from website)
    I have requested that I stay on my current rate and not to refund me,
    No answer yet but will keep you posted as and when.
    If this doesn't work I do (hopefully) have other ammunition to try but will keep them in reserve for the moment
    • RichGit
    • By RichGit 16th Nov 18, 3:40 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    RichGit
    I have spoken to an advisor at OFGEM. They have had a LOT of calls regarding this six-month division/change.
    I am on a fixed price/term contract and I am told they cannot make this change for my supply.
    They have a department dealing with this specific issue - hooray! But in the meantime I have been advised to write to the parent company Foxglove and get them to fix it.
    Good luck everybody.
    • markipad
    • By markipad 16th Nov 18, 4:07 PM
    • 54 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    markipad
    I see OTM have posted something on Facebook:


    https://www.facebook.com/Outfoxthemarket/
    Last edited by markipad; 16-11-2018 at 4:12 PM.
    • Frustation
    • By Frustation 16th Nov 18, 4:26 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Frustation
    Just noticed MSE just posted on the blog that not only are we got the inconvenience of (illegal?) variable rate DD but they are also sneaking in a price rise too��
    • Merlin139
    • By Merlin139 16th Nov 18, 4:29 PM
    • 5,588 Posts
    • 21,560 Thanks
    Merlin139
    I'm with Fischer Energy, which appears to operate from the same premises as OTM. My DD is also rising by around £50 per month over winter. Tried calling but "all lines are busy". No reply from emails yet. Previous energy suppliers have not worried about building up a surplus.
    Wonder if my bank can refuse the rise if I ask them?
    Originally posted by Megalodon
    Fisher Energy is the are the owners of OFTM
    • bye bye band G
    • By bye bye band G 16th Nov 18, 4:35 PM
    • 160 Posts
    • 110 Thanks
    bye bye band G
    As I'm in credit to the tune of £252 while, like others, they want to increase my DD from £82 to £143, I intended just to cancel my Direct Debit and use up some of this credit, after all , they can't cut off my supply. My first question on web chat therefore was - is there a charge for a failed DD?
    I was surprised that the answer is yes - £5.
    Not sure what to do now. I don't have any faith I'll see my credit of £252 returned to me any time soon, they must be swamped with people asking for their credit back. And I actually can't even pay them £143 without the return of that credit - I'm a pensioner.
    • redfox
    • By redfox 16th Nov 18, 4:36 PM
    • 14,116 Posts
    • 37,922 Thanks
    redfox
    the MSE article on this can be found here https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/2018/11/outfox-the-market-hikes-energy-bills-a-third-time-and-increases-/
    I'm a Board Guide on the Quick Grabbit, Food Shopping & Groceries, Shop but don't drop, Loans and Cutting Tax boards which means I volunteer to help get your forum questions answered and keep the forum running smoothly. Pease remember, board guides don't read every post. If you spot an illegal or inappropriate post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com (it's not part of my role to deal with this) Any views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.

    • grumbler
    • By grumbler 16th Nov 18, 4:42 PM
    • 51,710 Posts
    • 21,932 Thanks
    grumbler
    (illegal?) variable rate DD
    Originally posted by Frustation
    Variable rate DD is perfectly legal as long as they inform you about the amount in advance.
    We are born naked, wet and hungry...Then things get worse.

    .withdrawal, NOT withdrawel ..bear with me, NOT bare with me
    .definitely, NOT definately ......separate, NOT seperate
    should have, NOT should of
    .....guaranteed, NOT guarenteed
    • Pete99
    • By Pete99 16th Nov 18, 4:52 PM
    • 51 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    Pete99
    I wonder if people would have a claim for compensation if OutFox take the massively increased DD from someone's account putting it in overdraft, there doesn't seem to be any way to stop them taking the money because it takes around 21 days to switch to another supplier and they've given us 10 working days, and there also doesn't appear to be any limit as to how much they can take, this doesn't just apply to OutFox as other smaller suppliers seem to be doing the same thing.
    • Pete99
    • By Pete99 16th Nov 18, 4:59 PM
    • 51 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    Pete99
    I wonder if Ofgem are aware and what they think about the practice, and wouldn't they also be regulated by the Financial Services Authority as to what they can and can't do with customers money.
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