Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@. Skimlinks & other affiliated links are turned on

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • JadedAngel88
    • By JadedAngel88 19th May 19, 7:30 AM
    • 43Posts
    • 104Thanks
    JadedAngel88
    Disability, work and possible dimissal.
    • #1
    • 19th May 19, 7:30 AM
    Disability, work and possible dimissal. 19th May 19 at 7:30 AM
    I have tried CAB, Acas and Disability law service to find answers to my questions but all have given different answers.


    I have posted this on here as it is to do with my employer but not sure if the disability forum would be better so I'll leave it here for now.


    I have been diagnosed with a illness that is not curable, I'm sorry for the vagueness but I didn't want to give identifiable information, I am on a course of treatment which is, I don't think,working.



    Now my employer is supposed to make reasonable adjustments so that I can stay in my job, they haven't made any. Also i am on the understanding that if I can not do my job they should redeploy me to a role I can do. ( Acas say its a legal requirement, DLS say not necessarily, CAB are on the fence) I have also been told by my employer that they can dismiss me, reason capability. But have also been told by Acas etc, that this should be the last resort and a legal requirement and duty of care?. Employer say not necessarily.


    I have a meeting with my employer next week, as I'm currently off sick because without the adjustments, I can not do my job and was in a lot of pain and discomfort trying to do it. I did have a meeting with my boss and HR and I did explain to them I would be off sick from that day till either reasonable adjustments where in place or I was redeployed to a role I could do.


    I have given my boss literature with regards to my condition and have seen work OT regularly, who sends report to my boss with what adjustments to make and he never read them. Just said to me you know what you can do, just do that.



    I really can not be arsed to fight this, I am in constant pain, bad fatigue and I don't sleep very well either but would like to see if anyone can give me any help. The other reason for this post is I suffer with fatigue fog and can only remember snippets of information given to me by CAB, Acas anf DLS, and seeing stuff written down means I can take notes.



    Really sorry for the long post and thanks if you can help me.
    Removed by Forum Team
Page 1
    • nicechap
    • By nicechap 19th May 19, 7:41 AM
    • 1,742 Posts
    • 3,164 Thanks
    nicechap
    • #2
    • 19th May 19, 7:41 AM
    • #2
    • 19th May 19, 7:41 AM
    I have tried CAB, Acas and Disability law service to find answers to my questions but all have given different answers.


    I have posted this on here as it is to do with my employer but not sure if the disability forum would be better so I'll leave it here for now.


    I have been diagnosed with a illness that is not curable, I'm sorry for the vagueness but I didn't want to give identifiable information, I am on a course of treatment which is, I don't think,working.



    Now my employer is supposed to make reasonable adjustments so that I can stay in my job, they haven't made any. Also i am on the understanding that if I can not do my job they should redeploy me to a role I can do. ( Acas say its a legal requirement, DLS say not necessarily, CAB are on the fence) I have also been told by my employer that they can dismiss me, reason capability. But have also been told by Acas etc, that this should be the last resort and a legal requirement and duty of care?. Employer say not necessarily.


    I have a meeting with my employer next week, as I'm currently off sick because without the adjustments, I can not do my job and was in a lot of pain and discomfort trying to do it. I did have a meeting with my boss and HR and I did explain to them I would be off sick from that day till either reasonable adjustments where in place or I was redeployed to a role I could do.


    I have given my boss literature with regards to my condition and have seen work OT regularly, who sends report to my boss with what adjustments to make and he never read them. Just said to me you know what you can do, just do that.



    I really can not be arsed to fight this, I am in constant pain, bad fatigue and I don't sleep very well either but would like to see if anyone can give me any help. The other reason for this post is I suffer with fatigue fog and can only remember snippets of information given to me by CAB, Acas anf DLS, and seeing stuff written down means I can take notes.



    Really sorry for the long post and thanks if you can help me.
    Originally posted by JadedAngel88
    Simple answer is donít, your health is more important than spending your time & energy on a fight youíre not interested in. Move on. Legal arguments are a side issue for you.
    Originally Posted by shortcrust
    "Contact the Ministry of Fairness....If sufficient evidence of unfairness is discovered youíll get an apology, a permanent contract with backdated benefits, a ĎLetís Make it Fair!í tshirt and mug, and those guilty of unfairness will be sent on a Fairness Awareness course."
    • elsien
    • By elsien 19th May 19, 7:50 AM
    • 19,239 Posts
    • 48,837 Thanks
    elsien
    • #3
    • 19th May 19, 7:50 AM
    • #3
    • 19th May 19, 7:50 AM
    I suppose the starting point is whether your illness currently qualifies as a disability under the equality act.
    And if it does, is there a suitable role to redeploy you to available now, because they don't have to create one just for you.
    Would your preferred option be redeployment or reasonable adjustments and how much adjustment would be required - again, doing this is not an absolute and depends on business needs.

    I take it you're not in a union?
    All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well.

    Pedant alert - it's could have, not could of.
    • theoretica
    • By theoretica 19th May 19, 10:35 AM
    • 5,855 Posts
    • 7,259 Thanks
    theoretica
    • #4
    • 19th May 19, 10:35 AM
    • #4
    • 19th May 19, 10:35 AM
    Could you do your job with reasonable adjustments? Have you asked for any and do you know what they would be? It reads to me as though maybe there aren't reasonable adjustments to be made because you mention redeployment to a job you can do. If adjustments won't help it isn't reasonable for them to be made.


    Does your employer have roles you could do and are any of them vacant?
    But a banker, engaged at enormous expense,
    Had the whole of their cash in his care.
    Lewis Carroll
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 19th May 19, 10:51 AM
    • 18,809 Posts
    • 11,629 Thanks
    motorguy
    • #5
    • 19th May 19, 10:51 AM
    • #5
    • 19th May 19, 10:51 AM
    I suppose the starting point is whether your illness currently qualifies as a disability under the equality act.
    And if it does, is there a suitable role to redeploy you to available now, because they don't have to create one just for you.
    Would your preferred option be redeployment or reasonable adjustments and how much adjustment would be required - again, doing this is not an absolute and depends on business needs.


    I take it you're not in a union?
    Originally posted by elsien
    I think thats key - where they can they should, however they dont have to create a role nor do they have to displace someone in a role to facilitate the O/P.
    "We have normality. I repeat, we have normality. Anything you still can't cope with is therefore your own problem."
    • Gavin83
    • By Gavin83 19th May 19, 1:56 PM
    • 5,948 Posts
    • 10,188 Thanks
    Gavin83
    • #6
    • 19th May 19, 1:56 PM
    • #6
    • 19th May 19, 1:56 PM
    Now my employer is supposed to make reasonable adjustments so that I can stay in my job, they haven't made any.
    Originally posted by JadedAngel88
    Can they make reasonable adjustments that allow you to stay in the job? It's hard to comment without knowing your disability or job but are you actually still able to do the job in any way?

    Also i am on the understanding that if I can not do my job they should redeploy me to a role I can do.
    Originally posted by JadedAngel88
    As others have said they aren't required to create a role for you so does a role exist? You also have to be qualified and able to do the job, you won't just walk into an empty directors role because you've got a disability for example.

    They are required to consider your disability and make reasonable adjustments but this often doesn't stretch as far as some imagine.
    • JadedAngel88
    • By JadedAngel88 19th May 19, 5:44 PM
    • 43 Posts
    • 104 Thanks
    JadedAngel88
    • #7
    • 19th May 19, 5:44 PM
    • #7
    • 19th May 19, 5:44 PM
    Answer to questions


    nicechap - Maybe I should have chosen a different word, I suppose I just don't have the energy to argue the toss with my employer, but then I do love my job and don't want to be unemployed.


    elsien - My illness qualifies as a disability. There have been vacancies for roles that I would be able to do ie: admin, reception. I'm not expecting them to create a job for me, I would just like them to help me. I am not in the union.


    theoretica - I could do my job with adjustments, adjustments have been asked for by myself and written in the OT reports with their recommendations. It was at my last meeting with the OT when they said about redeployment, also mentioned by Acas, CAB and DLS.


    motorguy - probably answered above, appreciate your input, thank you.


    Gavin83 - They can make adjustments, they have for another person that works in the same place I do, although their disability is different to mine. I don't want to say what I do or what my disability is as this would identify me and where I work.
    The vacancies that my employer has/had were both advertised as no experience required, training given. I would love the directors job, probably do a better job than they do at the moment but jokes aside, I wouldn't be expecting that. I would prefer to stay in the job I do because I do love my job, the people I work with and the people I work for.

    It's like they don't want to help, I have worked there a long time and HR have always been garbage, they weren't much help when my daughter was diagnosed with cancer, I could have had compassionate leave while she was having chemo but they didn't tell me this when I asked. I found out about 2 years after her treatment ended that I was entitled to compassionate leave.


    Thanks for the answers so far, I do appreciate it.
    Removed by Forum Team
    • lincroft1710
    • By lincroft1710 19th May 19, 5:52 PM
    • 11,941 Posts
    • 10,433 Thanks
    lincroft1710
    • #8
    • 19th May 19, 5:52 PM
    • #8
    • 19th May 19, 5:52 PM
    If things are as you say (and bear in mind we have only heard your side of the story), it seems that your employer does not hold you in high esteem and would be quite happy to see you go. They may have good reason for this or they may just be being awkward and uncaring.

    Regarding HR, they are not your friend, they work on behalf of the employer.
    • jonnygee2
    • By jonnygee2 19th May 19, 8:44 PM
    • 1,353 Posts
    • 1,409 Thanks
    jonnygee2
    • #9
    • 19th May 19, 8:44 PM
    • #9
    • 19th May 19, 8:44 PM
    My illness qualifies as a disability.
    There have been vacancies for roles that I would be able to do
    I could do my job with adjustments, adjustments have been asked for by myself and written in the OT reports with their recommendations.
    If this is all true then you would have a very strong case at an employment tribunal. I don't know what CAB have advised, but put very simply if you have a disability, and the adjustments that would allow you to do your job are reasonable ( changing your work shifts or lowering your targets would normally be reasonable for example).

    I don't think, though, you should be looking at staying in your job. If your employer wants to get rid of you then they will get rid of you. Arguing with them will just make your work life extremely difficult even if you are successful.

    So your options are either walk away and take the dismissal on the chin, or fight it in an employment tribunal for compensation. Personally I would go for the latter, or at least speak to an employment solicitor in a free consultation to find out what you might be entitled to (and to double check your quoted claims for accuracy). Successfully fought disability cases can be extremely expensive for employers.
    • nicechap
    • By nicechap 19th May 19, 9:09 PM
    • 1,742 Posts
    • 3,164 Thanks
    nicechap

    .....
    Now my employer is supposed to make reasonable adjustments so that I can stay in my job, they haven't made any. Also i am on the understanding that if I can not do my job they should redeploy me to a role I can do. ( Acas say its a legal requirement, DLS say not necessarily, CAB are on the fence) I have also been told by my employer that they can dismiss me, reason capability. But have also been told by Acas etc, that this should be the last resort and a legal requirement and duty of care?. Employer say not necessarily.


    ... I suffer with fatigue fog and can only remember snippets of information

    .....
    Originally posted by JadedAngel88

    As you suffer with fatigue fog and can only remember snippets, I suspect you may be picking on the bits you want to hear and making assumptions about other things.

    If you are considering an Employment tribunal you need to appreciate how much effort is involved, how long it will take, and how your admissions here would be heard by a board.

    Assuming you have a disability under the Equality Act, your employer only has to CONSIDER reasonable adjustments - it is quiet easy to come up with arguments against. Likewise, they only have to consider you for alternative roles.

    Many employers do much more than this but what a multi national, or government organisation can do may not be practical or reasonable for a small or medium enterprise.

    Ultimately, in either scenario you need to be a productive member of staff, and if you don't want to be unemployed, then that is the thing to focus on. Take on board what the OH have said and make positive suggestions to your manager about how to make it happen. If your manager is already saying just do what you can, it sounds like the door is open to be pushed. No one on the internet can do it for you.

    My previous advice still stands if you do not have the !!!! or energy to make it happen.
    Originally Posted by shortcrust
    "Contact the Ministry of Fairness....If sufficient evidence of unfairness is discovered youíll get an apology, a permanent contract with backdated benefits, a ĎLetís Make it Fair!í tshirt and mug, and those guilty of unfairness will be sent on a Fairness Awareness course."
    • jonnygee2
    • By jonnygee2 19th May 19, 9:17 PM
    • 1,353 Posts
    • 1,409 Thanks
    jonnygee2
    Assuming you have a disability under the Equality Act, your employer only has to CONSIDER reasonable adjustments
    This is very misleading advice. If reasonable adjustments would allow the person back to work they have to make them. Not just consider them.

    You have made it sound like there's basically nothing a disabled person can do if their employer refuses to make legal adjustments. That's just not the case.
    • Takeaway_Addict
    • By Takeaway_Addict 20th May 19, 1:28 PM
    • 6,030 Posts
    • 6,990 Thanks
    Takeaway_Addict
    Thank you for your message, I was nice in my reply, I can't see where I was being rude. Also I have that signature since I signed up to mse years ago and it's only just been noticed. I used to like this forum, won't be posting on it anymore, and it's funny how the person that I was replying to had swearing in his post but you haven't removed that.
    Originally posted by JadedAngel88
    A tad precious perhaps?
    Don't trust a forum for advice. Get proper paid advice. Any advice given should always be checked
    • TBagpuss
    • By TBagpuss 20th May 19, 1:29 PM
    • 7,347 Posts
    • 9,582 Thanks
    TBagpuss
    This is very misleading advice. If reasonable adjustments would allow the person back to work they have to make them. Not just consider them.

    You have made it sound like there's basically nothing a disabled person can do if their employer refuses to make legal adjustments. That's just not the case.
    Originally posted by jonnygee2

    I don't think that is quite correct.

    They have to make reasonable adjustments, but in considering what is reasonable, the employer is allowed to take into account things such as cost, business needs etc.

    So there may be things which OH or the employe suggest as adjustments, but which the employer considers and determines are not reasonable because of the needs of the business, the cost of making the adjustment etc.

    OP, has your employer responded to your requests, and have they given any explanation as to why they can't or won't make the adjustments you have suggested?

    Similarly, with a suitable role - theydon't have to create one for you, but if there are other roles you could do, either without needing adjustments or with reasonable adjustments then it is appropriate for them to consider offering the new role to you.
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

36Posts Today

3,140Users online

Martin's Twitter
  • RT @IsabelHardman: This is really good. For all the stuff about noisy rows over the past few days, it?s worth remembering that a lot of abu?

  • This is why I wrote the guide to financial abuse. It's tough to know when it's happening to you. It's also worth? https://t.co/XGI2sI7hOU

  • RT @David_Challen: Really happy @MartinSLewis is raising awareness of economic/financial abuse. My mother cleaned her cousins home for poc?

  • Follow Martin