London Undergroud - touch in and out at same station

MrChips · 27 April 2015 at 3:52PM

I made a journey at the weekend from a station in zone 5 heading for zone 1. After travelling a few stops I realised I had left my mobile in my car (and on display) near the station so hurriedly got off at the next stop and retraced my steps. Fortunately it was still there and hadn't been stolen. I then returned back to the station to restart my journey an hour or so late.

I'm a regular traveller on the tube so I realised that touching in and out at my original station without touching out at another station in between would confuse the automated system. Indeed I have been charged £10.40 for two incomplete journeys.

I've been reading around on their website and there is some wording about touching in and out at the same station but nothing that quite describes my situation. Before I call tfl to explain what happened, I was wondering what I should have been charged in this circumstance. Should it just be the price of the intended journey (for which I have also been charged), or something extra for the aborted one?

dzug1 · 27 April 2015 at 7:11PM

You should only be charged for the journey you actually made

Elfbert · 27 April 2015 at 11:47PM

I googled and this page seems to make it quite clear:

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/fares-and-payments/touching-in-and-out

'you may be eligible for a refund'. Just explain to them - they can see you touched in, then out again at the same station - then BACK in and out at your destination, so it's not as if you'd been somewhere and then gone off back home.

I'd hope if you called they could sort it out for you. Your story seem reasonable to me. I've called for refunds before and always had them sorted.

MrChips · 27 April 2015 at 11:56PM

Thanks both. I did ring and the person I spoke to suggested I should have touched out at the station where I turned back before commencing my return journey...very helpful! He wanted to update the journey record to turn it into 2 additional journeys. I said I needed to think about it first.

I'll call back tomorrow and hope I get someone more reasonable.

yorkie2 · 28 April 2015 at 8:41AM

MrChips wrote: »

Thanks both. I did ring and the person I spoke to suggested I should have touched out at the station where I turned back before commencing my return journey...very helpful! He wanted to update the journey record to turn it into 2 additional journeys. I said I needed to think about it first.

I'll call back tomorrow and hope I get someone more reasonable.

They're unlikely to give you a free journey, and I am unsure if they can 'resolve' it into a Southgate-Southgate journey (though I do know people I can ask)

Are you based anywhere near one of the outher stations near Southgate, such as Arnos Grove or Oakwood? If so, and it happens again, your best bet would be to touch out at one of those stations, then it would only charge you a Zone 5 single.

agrinnall · 28 April 2015 at 8:48AM

Can you clarify a couple of things?

Did you touch Out at the station where you left the first journey after realising your error?

And if not, did you touch Out and In back at the original station, or just touch once (I've no idea whether it would count this as an In or an Out in this circumstance)?

MrChips · 28 April 2015 at 10:59AM

It was Oakwood I started my journey from. I didn't touch out at the point of turning round - I just legged it off the train and over to the platform going in the opposite direction as I was concerned about the risk of leaving my phone on display in my car! I therefore touched in for my original entry point, and out again at Oakwood half an hour or so later to exit the station and get to my car. My journey record shows I then touched back in again at Oakwood five minutes later to recommence my journey back to central London (where my wife and child were impatiently waiting for me!)

Playing devil's advocate - if I had fallen asleep and missed my stop, woken up at the terminus and had to go all the way back to my intended destination I would still only be charged for one journey from my start to my finish - not for the additional stations I had unintentionally travelled through, so it feels analogous to me that I should only be charged for the one journey I should have made in this case. But then I would say that!

dzug1 · 28 April 2015 at 1:50PM

Having read your more detailed description of your trip I'm no longer confident of my answer and suspect you should have been charged for 3 journeys: Oakwood Park to turning point, turning point to Oakwood Park, Oakwood Park to zone 1

macman · 28 April 2015 at 2:35PM

If you reached the daily zonal cap on all your journeys that day, then an extra two wouldn't have made any difference to the actual total cost anyway.
It has to charge you for an apparently uncompleted journey, because otherwise people could travel to a station without gatelines, having tapped in at the departure station, not tapping in on arrival or on return, and then only tapping out when back at the departure station.

MrChips · 28 April 2015 at 3:13PM

Thanks both - I understand the logic for the system operating as it does, and so I guess my case will rest on some sort of discretion being applied (or not!).

My view is that what I did was little different to taking a very circuitous journey to my ultimate destination. If I was some sort of train spotter, and had an hour to kill, I might journey from Oakwood to central London, but go via a completely different part of the underground just to visit a random station, or travel on a different line for the fun of it. The fare system charges this based on the start and end point only, not the route taken (ok there are a couple of provisos here based on zones travelled through and time taken, but I think the logic stands).

I didn't reach the daily price cap alas, otherwise this would all be academic.

wealdroam · 28 April 2015 at 3:25PM

Read this:

Same Station & Continuation Exits

London Undergroud - touch in and out at same station

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