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  • FIRST POST
    • Snowedunder
    • By Snowedunder 14th Sep 19, 5:10 PM
    • 193Posts
    • 43Thanks
    Snowedunder
    Log on details just becoming silly!!!
    • #1
    • 14th Sep 19, 5:10 PM
    Log on details just becoming silly!!! 14th Sep 19 at 5:10 PM
    OK, so, whilst not a techie have been a basically able computer user, and during my many years have had a few online accounts, including banking.

    During a recent revamp of finances I decided to set up a Direct Debit for HSBC Credit Card - previously I had had problems because they kept locking my account and telephone access because I kept putting in the wrong info, so went to a branch and got the whole thing set up again, with a family member whom I trust, confirming everything. Got home and tried to get on - you guess it - locked out again for incorrect information. Wrote to them only way left to communicate and got a shirty letter telling me I MUST have got it wrong and they could no longer help! So have no Direct Debit and have to pay by standing order which I thought I had set up with Santandar.

    So, checking payment to HSBC had gone out on 2nd on this month, and finding it had not, sent a money transfer which, of course, arrived a day late on the 3rd and now my Statement of the 10th of the month from HSBC shows 'payment 3rd September' and all is ok, but at the bottom of the statement YOU HAVE MISSED A MINIMUM PAYMENT. but of course cannot get into HSBC in any way to sort this out.

    Decided to once more set up a Standing Order with Santander, carefully putting in all information, after 3 attempts locked Out of Santander. Had to reset password, and try again - twice, locked out again so not tried a third time.

    My moan is that they all call different numbers by differing names, I do not know that my Santander Pin Number is, on some forms called a Security Code, etc. etc. and on and on with my customer number which is called by some other name as well.

    Does anyone else find HSBC and Santander confusing, or is it me, and should I just excuse myself from life as I cannot keep up, and cannot telephone or even send an e-mail without remembering numbers, which are sometimes codes, or Accounts reference, or pin numbers of security codes, access info and it goes on.

    As a by the way for all this security nonsense, in a Post Office Queue earlier, two youngsters were purchasing Euro Money Cards - I now know their dates of birth, post codes and e mail addresses, where they are going and when - all information they had to give over the counter!!!
Page 1
    • Robin9
    • By Robin9 14th Sep 19, 5:21 PM
    • 4,976 Posts
    • 3,245 Thanks
    Robin9
    • #2
    • 14th Sep 19, 5:21 PM
    • #2
    • 14th Sep 19, 5:21 PM
    You are not alone - I can get in a twist and I know its not good but I write the passwords down.

    One that irritates me is Halifax where the Username is actually a sequence of numbers.
    Never pay on an estimated bill
    • giraffe69
    • By giraffe69 15th Sep 19, 9:13 AM
    • 2,771 Posts
    • 2,406 Thanks
    giraffe69
    • #3
    • 15th Sep 19, 9:13 AM
    • #3
    • 15th Sep 19, 9:13 AM
    I agree that businesses have some arcane security procedures but one motive is to keep money (our money) safer.
    You can keep things like passwords and user names in either a special piece of software or even in a password protected spreadsheet (hint don't forget the password for this!) to help. I think I have over 100 items of this nature to remember and without some electronic help would never manage especially as I also try to remember for both the Mrs and ageing MIL.
    Last edited by giraffe69; 15-09-2019 at 11:52 AM.
    • JReacher1
    • By JReacher1 15th Sep 19, 10:33 AM
    • 3,225 Posts
    • 4,493 Thanks
    JReacher1
    • #4
    • 15th Sep 19, 10:33 AM
    • #4
    • 15th Sep 19, 10:33 AM
    Use keypass. It’s free software which solves all these problems.
    • tempus_fugit
    • By tempus_fugit 15th Sep 19, 10:24 PM
    • 765 Posts
    • 723 Thanks
    tempus_fugit
    • #5
    • 15th Sep 19, 10:24 PM
    • #5
    • 15th Sep 19, 10:24 PM
    You are not alone - I can get in a twist and I know its not good but I write the passwords down.

    One that irritates me is Halifax where the Username is actually a sequence of numbers.
    Originally posted by Robin9
    Mine isn't, it's normal text.
    Retired at age 56 after having "light bulb moment" due to reading MSE and its forums. Have been converted to the "budget to zero" concept and use YNAB for all monthly budgeting and long term goals.

    Pedant point: There is no such word or construction as "I's", the word to use is "my".
    • forgotmyname
    • By forgotmyname 16th Sep 19, 3:45 AM
    • 29,470 Posts
    • 12,113 Thanks
    forgotmyname
    • #6
    • 16th Sep 19, 3:45 AM
    • #6
    • 16th Sep 19, 3:45 AM
    You are not alone - I can get in a twist and I know its not good but I write the passwords down.

    One that irritates me is Halifax where the Username is actually a sequence of numbers.
    Originally posted by Robin9
    My Halifax login is characters only and very few of them also.


    First Direct on the other hand require a blood sample for each login
    OK maybe not quite that far (yet) but close.
    Punctuation, Spelling and Grammar will be used sparingly. Due to rising costs of inflation.

    My contribution to MSE. Other contributions will only be used if they cost me nothing.

    Due to me being a tight git.
    • tealady
    • By tealady 16th Sep 19, 5:03 AM
    • 3,142 Posts
    • 4,091 Thanks
    tealady
    • #7
    • 16th Sep 19, 5:03 AM
    • #7
    • 16th Sep 19, 5:03 AM
    I keep a notebook with a page for each organization.
    I write down clues to what the password is. Otherwise I wouldnt have a clue!
    Proud to be an MSE nerd
    Judge people by their achievements, not by their mistakes
    • jackieblack
    • By jackieblack 16th Sep 19, 5:39 AM
    • 8,950 Posts
    • 14,742 Thanks
    jackieblack
    • #8
    • 16th Sep 19, 5:39 AM
    • #8
    • 16th Sep 19, 5:39 AM
    You are not alone - I can get in a twist and I know its not good but I write the passwords down.

    One that irritates me is Halifax where the Username is actually a sequence of numbers.
    Originally posted by Robin9
    Mine isn't, it's normal text.
    Originally posted by tempus_fugit
    Mine too ...
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    • DCFC79
    • By DCFC79 16th Sep 19, 11:47 AM
    • 35,066 Posts
    • 22,164 Thanks
    DCFC79
    • #9
    • 16th Sep 19, 11:47 AM
    • #9
    • 16th Sep 19, 11:47 AM
    Mine too ...
    Originally posted by jackieblack

    Mines a mix of letters and numbers.
    • Snowedunder
    • By Snowedunder 16th Sep 19, 11:47 AM
    • 193 Posts
    • 43 Thanks
    Snowedunder
    Thanks for your comments, it is good to know that I am really not alone, indeed I have a password manager and a notebook and a piece of paper in my handbag - all disguised with a simple algorithm, but it is particularly irritating when the banks etc. call the same piece of information by differing names within one company, this is where I get most angry, if a pin number is just that then why change its' name to something else within a login, ie security code, when trying to access information on line, it is my pin number when using my card so why is it not my pin number when trying to set up something online!

    Also, when using the telephone and not at first trying anything more secure than giving my name and date of birth say, it would be nice to talk to a person (slowly becoming extinct) to explain my problems without causing any risk to the security of my account, but forget your telephone "code" and its goodbye.

    Usually, when you come upon a problem you become flustered/angry because the reason you wish to access your information is urgent and you are more likely to get in a muddle.
    • DCFC79
    • By DCFC79 16th Sep 19, 11:57 AM
    • 35,066 Posts
    • 22,164 Thanks
    DCFC79
    That's why I write down what each bank call each piece of info eg customer number or PIN then the corresponding password next to them.
    • engineer amy
    • By engineer amy 16th Sep 19, 12:13 PM
    • 744 Posts
    • 1,277 Thanks
    engineer amy
    and as frustratingly - the number of passwords and differing rules around caps, numbers, symbols etc.


    you go on to a website and enter a password that you think is correct - sorry, these log in details are incorrect. so you try a few more variations, with still no luck. Finally you click on the "forgot password" link and go to reset your password. You enter maybe the first password that you had guessed at, only to be told "sorry, your new password cannot be the same as your old password"
    if it was my old password, then why wouldn't it let me in!!!!!!
    Mortgage = £113,495 (May 2009) £67462.74 Jun 2019
    • mksysb
    • By mksysb 16th Sep 19, 12:50 PM
    • 87 Posts
    • 53 Thanks
    mksysb
    Another problem is when the just ask for certain parts of the password, so you have to count along the letters. So now in my password manager i keep the password with the numbers underneath, such as

    P a s s w o r d
    1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8

    Makes it much easier to get the right characters first time, to avoid lockouts
    • Gavin83
    • By Gavin83 16th Sep 19, 1:42 PM
    • 6,229 Posts
    • 10,734 Thanks
    Gavin83
    The issue is the bank is liable if you lose all your money and therefore they'll do everything they can to protect it, primarily making the security as challenging to break as possible.

    If it was possible for you to sign away your rights in return for a weaker login process I'm sure they'd offer the option. However I'm sure we'd soon see you on here, writing a topic about how you've been robbed of £20k from your account and the bank won't help.

    Strong security might seem like an inconvenience but it would be a whole lot more inconvenient to have your account emptied.

    Also, I don't wish to point out the obvious here but your login problems are 100% your fault. You should be more careful with your typing.
    • amberhen49
    • By amberhen49 16th Sep 19, 10:14 PM
    • 29 Posts
    • 28 Thanks
    amberhen49
    I don't know how anyone copes without some kind of password manager these days. 2 factor authentication can be a pain sometimes too but I'd still rather have it turned on if it's available.
    • boo_star
    • By boo_star 17th Sep 19, 12:41 AM
    • 2,628 Posts
    • 1,967 Thanks
    boo_star
    Thanks for your comments, it is good to know that I am really not alone, indeed I have a password manager and a notebook and a piece of paper in my handbag - all disguised with a simple algorithm, but it is particularly irritating when the banks etc. call the same piece of information by differing names within one company, this is where I get most angry, if a pin number is just that then why change its' name to something else within a login, ie security code, when trying to access information on line, it is my pin number when using my card so why is it not my pin number when trying to set up something online?
    Originally posted by Snowedunder
    Because your PIN is for your card and your security code isn't?

    If you were asked to "Enter your PIN" you'd enter your debit card PIN, not the (hopefully) different "security code."

    That'd create far more confusion than a few people not knowing that their PIN and security code aren't the same thing.
    • AndyPix
    • By AndyPix 17th Sep 19, 8:18 AM
    • 4,428 Posts
    • 3,980 Thanks
    AndyPix
    I use Santander - have done for 10 years and have never had a locked account.


    Are you sure you didn't have caps lock on, or num lock off etc ??
    Running with scissors since 1978
    • Snowedunder
    • By Snowedunder 18th Sep 19, 3:19 PM
    • 193 Posts
    • 43 Thanks
    Snowedunder
    Because your PIN is for your card and your security code isn't?

    If you were asked to "Enter your PIN" you'd enter your debit card PIN, not the (hopefully) different "security code."

    That'd create far more confusion than a few people not knowing that their PIN and security code aren't the same thing.
    Originally posted by boo_star
    Thats just the problem, they are - I had no idea what my security code was when trying to set up a Direct Debit, so I clicked the little red question mark and up came "sometimes known as your pin number!!!"
    Last edited by Snowedunder; 18-09-2019 at 3:20 PM. Reason: making additions
    • Snowedunder
    • By Snowedunder 18th Sep 19, 3:29 PM
    • 193 Posts
    • 43 Thanks
    Snowedunder
    I use Santander - have done for 10 years and have never had a locked account.


    Are you sure you didn't have caps lock on, or num lock off etc ??
    Originally posted by AndyPix
    I logged into Santander as usual, and attempted to set up a Standing Order, the information they required was quite extensive, with several 'codes' required, customer number, security code, etc. and this is where I kept getting it wrong, so 3 attempts and I was locked out (this was the first time ever).

    So, I had to re-set my password and I was good to go, took time researching which number etc. was called what and very carefully entered them, and twice it said the information was incorrect, so did not try again and gave up on the idea.

    I know I am getting on in years, but I am a trained 'old-fashioned' touch typist and because I worked at The Bank of England, and taught by them, numbers were included in the touch tying lessons. However, because of age, and arthritis in my hands, I have reverted to double checking everything I type and input. I realize of course that no one is above making mistakes and at the end of making my attempts I had a family member (whom I trust) watch over me and checked everything. It was all as it should be!
    • Snowedunder
    • By Snowedunder 18th Sep 19, 3:39 PM
    • 193 Posts
    • 43 Thanks
    Snowedunder
    The issue is the bank is liable if you lose all your money and therefore they'll do everything they can to protect it, primarily making the security as challenging to break as possible.

    If it was possible for you to sign away your rights in return for a weaker login process I'm sure they'd offer the option. However I'm sure we'd soon see you on here, writing a topic about how you've been robbed of £20k from your account and the bank won't help.

    Strong security might seem like an inconvenience but it would be a whole lot more inconvenient to have your account emptied.

    Also, I don't wish to point out the obvious here but your login problems are 100% your fault. You should be more careful with your typing.
    Originally posted by Gavin83
    I totally understand this and you are quite correct: however:

    In one of my posts I mentioned that a little less automation and a way to speak to an actual person should, in my opinion, be available, perhaps just name and date of birth to confirm I could be a customer, would give us a chance to ask what might be wrong, or, more likely, what I am doing wrong, if that is too insecure then at least listen to my problem, and try to help ie advising differing names of codes, would not be insecure? or risk anyone's account. Even advising an e mail address that could be used if you are unable to access 'Secure Mail' from within the account which is not accessible at that time.

    Another point is that we are always being told never to write it down, well with how difficult they make it I bet 50% of people just have to do that in this day and age.
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