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  • FIRST POST
    • MysteryMan
    • By MysteryMan 26th Oct 17, 2:17 PM
    • 28Posts
    • 13Thanks
    MysteryMan
    HSL Smart Market System - Any Views?
    • #1
    • 26th Oct 17, 2:17 PM
    HSL Smart Market System - Any Views? 26th Oct 17 at 2:17 PM
    Not sure if this is the right place to ask this question, but, here goes.....

    Has anybody got any experience/views of the HSL Smart Market System? It is a set of software tools for trading shares on stock market.

    Any views would be appreciated and, in particular, if anyone has any idea of how much the system costs to buy into and what is the minimum sort of investments you need to make it worthwhile.

    Yes, I could call them, but, would be helpful to know this without having a hard-sell salesman on the other end of phone!

    Last edited by MysteryMan; 26-10-2017 at 2:19 PM.
Page 8
    • watti1962
    • By watti1962 16th May 18, 11:01 AM
    • 3 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    watti1962
    count me in
    Hi Can you give me the details of facebook page so that I can add my name to the list of unfortunate people that have lost money on this scam.
    Have registered it with action fraud
    Where can I pm you
    cheers
    Iain
    • kidneybo14
    • By kidneybo14 18th May 18, 10:29 AM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    kidneybo14
    Hi All
    I too have been scammed. I paid the 4950 in August last year and have since lost about 300 in trades. Please add me to the FB page. I will register with Action fraud. Any help appreciated
    • LozMall
    • By LozMall 22nd May 18, 2:52 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    LozMall
    Same same
    Same boat guys, scammed by HSL for 4995.00.
    Please tell me how to join the Facebook group as i'd be happy to be part of any group chasing this mob
    • Iand17
    • By Iand17 25th May 18, 1:20 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Iand17
    Just joined this forum after finding this thread. Interested in joining the Facebook group as well as I'm another victim after 5months of dealing with Ethan, an overall loss and nothing now at the point I was about to try get out.
    Will go back through thread and raise relevant fraud request as well.

    Paid 2950 last October. I intentionally paid some of the deposit on a credit card so got a dispute raised and believe I should get a refund under section 75 credit card rules, have other people been refunded or not ? Private message me if preferred.
    Cheers and sorry to hear others have similar or bigger loss than me.
    See you on the Facebook page soon, is it up and running ?


    I'm presuming
    • wally01
    • By wally01 29th May 18, 10:38 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    wally01
    I have also been a victim. Paid 4990 around september time. Also another 799 for the data. Please can someone let me know how I can get on the FB page
    • edminsm
    • By edminsm 5th Jun 18, 12:14 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    edminsm
    Information please
    I have been scammed too. Please can someone send me a link to any groups that are endevouring to get to the bottom of this. Many thanks.
    • clubconsoles
    • By clubconsoles 5th Jun 18, 7:44 PM
    • 42 Posts
    • 18 Thanks
    clubconsoles
    There is a FB group but it seems most people have come to the same conclusion, the money is long gone!
    All the HSL companies director details are made up and they were working out of a virtual office in Canary Wharf but didn't pay the rent on that either!
    Your only realistic hope is if you put down a deposit on a credit card.
    You can do something called a section 75 claim with your CC provider.
    Good luck!
    • PJ1981
    • By PJ1981 6th Jun 18, 5:04 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    PJ1981
    Sadly I have also been scammed. After going though a section 75 I got turned down for a refund saying it!!!8217;s an investment/ gambling so I!!!8217;m not covered by section 75. I disputed the outcome and the bank have still said no. The next step is for me to take it to the financial Ombudsman Service. Any advice before I do would be if great help.
    Thanks in advance
    • BigScot
    • By BigScot 6th Jun 18, 7:42 PM
    • 5 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    BigScot
    Sadly I have also been scammed. After going though a section 75 I got turned down for a refund saying it!!!8217;s an investment/ gambling so I!!!8217;m not covered by section 75. I disputed the outcome and the bank have still said no. The next step is for me to take it to the financial Ombudsman Service. Any advice before I do would be if great help.
    Thanks in advance
    Originally posted by PJ1981
    Sorry to hear that, can you say which bank it is? in case others on here are trying the section 75 claim too
    • Malthusian
    • By Malthusian 7th Jun 18, 12:23 PM
    • 4,473 Posts
    • 7,106 Thanks
    Malthusian
    Sadly I have also been scammed. After going though a section 75 I got turned down for a refund saying it!!!8217;s an investment/ gambling so I!!!8217;m not covered by section 75. I disputed the outcome and the bank have still said no. The next step is for me to take it to the financial Ombudsman Service. Any advice before I do would be if great help.
    Thanks in advance
    Originally posted by PJ1981
    I assume from your post that you have made a formal complaint, the bank has provided a final response and outlined your right to go to the FOS.

    The chapter and verse of section 75 is [my emphasis]:

    If the debtor under a debtor-creditor-supplier agreement falling within section 12(b) or (c) has, in relation to a transaction financed by the agreement, any claim against the supplier in respect of a misrepresentation or breach of contract, he shall have a like claim against the creditor, who, with the supplier, shall accordingly be jointly and severally liable to the debtor.
    So your complaint needs to be as follows:

    1) You used your credit card to pay HSL for software that promised to improve the returns you could get from the stockmarket.
    2) In reality you have never been able to obtain any investment returns from the software. Nobody who bought HSL software has made a return as a result, as proved by the numerous complaints on the Internet (link to this thread). HSL has now disappeared which is further proof that you haven't just been unlucky; the claims on which the software was sold were bogus and fraudulent from outset.
    3) HSL claimed that this software would allow you to obtain an investment return and this has proved to be a misrepresentation.
    4) As the software was sold on the basis of a misrepresentation, HSL is liable to return the money you paid for the software. As HSL is liable, under section 75 your card issuer is also liable.

    Points 3) and 4) apply equally to any further money you handed over for "the data required to run the system". This data was sold to you on the basis it would allow you to make money on the stockmarket, these claims were bogus, HSL is liable to repay what you paid for them, so is your card issuer.

    It is absolutely crucial that you were purchasing software from HSL, not investing or gambling with them. As proof of point 1) you can point to HSL's website (archived here) where their goods are sold under the heading "software".

    If you did invest any money in shares as a result of claims made by HSL, and lost money, then you will need to write it off.

    The FOS may well still take the view that the money you handed to HSL was an investment rather than a purchase of software and not subject to section 75, but IMO the above is your best chance.

    I assume it was in fact a credit card? If it was a debit card then you are looking at a chargeback, not section 75, and different rules apply.
    • DoaM
    • By DoaM 7th Jun 18, 12:41 PM
    • 4,572 Posts
    • 4,599 Thanks
    DoaM
    (Not reading back through the whole thread) ... How much was the software and how much was the "database"? Each needs to be 100+ for S75 to apply.

    Unless the poster is still within 120 days (I think) from initial purchase then chargeback is not an option.
    Diary of a madman
    Walk the line again today
    Entries of confusion
    Dear diary, I'm here to stay
    • Malthusian
    • By Malthusian 7th Jun 18, 4:27 PM
    • 4,473 Posts
    • 7,106 Thanks
    Malthusian
    (Not reading back through the whole thread) ... How much was the software and how much was the "database"? Each needs to be 100+ for S75 to apply.
    Originally posted by DoaM
    Both were well above that. You don't have to read back through the whole thread, plenty of posters on this page say how much they paid.

    Unless the poster is still within 120 days (I think) from initial purchase then chargeback is not an option.
    Not correct. It's 120 days from when you could reasonably have been aware there was a problem. It's less clear-cut than I thought - MSE and Which contradict each other on this point. (MSE says the date of purchase and Which says the date you became aware of a breach of contract.) Chargebacks are less clear-cut than Section 75 because it's based on the card provider's policy, not UK law. I tried to find Visa's official policy but had no luck.

    In any case PJ1981 said he was using a section 75 claim, not chargeback, so it's not relevant anyway. With section 75 claims the only time limit is a six-year long stop and that's not anywhere near applicable.
    Last edited by Malthusian; 07-06-2018 at 4:38 PM.
    • DoaM
    • By DoaM 7th Jun 18, 6:03 PM
    • 4,572 Posts
    • 4,599 Thanks
    DoaM
    Regarding chargeback, I was responding on that because YOU raised it in post #150.

    I don't know for sure, but any time I've seen anyone comment about chargeback time limits they've all said it is from date of purchase. But you're right - it's entirely up to the provider's policy. This link suggests it's from receipt of goods (if delivery is later than purchase) - see VCR Dispute Reason Code 13.3 Time Limit Modifiers.
    Diary of a madman
    Walk the line again today
    Entries of confusion
    Dear diary, I'm here to stay
    • BigScot
    • By BigScot 15th Jun 18, 9:08 PM
    • 5 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    BigScot
    Has anyone any updates as I am not on facebook?
    • clubconsoles
    • By clubconsoles 16th Jun 18, 8:01 PM
    • 42 Posts
    • 18 Thanks
    clubconsoles
    there are updates but this is an open forum so anyone can view this thread, good guys and bad guys!!
    I suggest you pm the members here whom situation is comparable to you own, ie what method of payment you used!
    • simonbf
    • By simonbf 1st Jul 18, 8:39 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    simonbf
    Me Too
    I only found this forum after Googling "HSL" as I too have paid for software and for the lifetime data package from LSE. 3,995 + 899 = 4,894. Ironically, when I first couldn't get through to the analysts, I started working out my own trades. Can you guess which ones turned a small profit? Yep, my own trades... All that has stopped too, as the data downloads aren't available now...
    • simonbf
    • By simonbf 1st Jul 18, 8:40 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    simonbf
    I meant to ask... "What is the next step if I paid by debit card?
    • clubconsoles
    • By clubconsoles 4th Jul 18, 9:07 PM
    • 42 Posts
    • 18 Thanks
    clubconsoles
    you need to pm Owena1 on this thread, he will direct you from there, that's all i can say as anyone can read stuff posted here!!
    • Bloomfield48098
    • By Bloomfield48098 9th Jul 18, 6:12 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Bloomfield48098
    I've been slow to find this the thread as i thought all was lost when everything went quiet a couple of months ago. If others believe a section 75 claim can work i'm interested to understand the process. I'm happy to join facebook page or whatever to find a resolution. Thanks,
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