Swindled out of inheritance - years ago, but recently discovered.

Here's a bit of a story. Events which took place over 20 years ago are very suspicious, however the evidence of any wrongdoing has only recently become available.

Between September 1991 and December 1993, I was my grandparents' live-in carer. In October 1993, my grandmother died, and a few days later one of my two sisters arrived at the house, asking my grandfather to sign over Power of Attorney so that she could deal with my grandmother's affairs. The suggestion was that she would arrange a funeral on his behalf. He signed the document, which I was not invited to see.

Another month or so passed, and the same sister's husband announced that my grandfather was going to spend some time in a care home. He was upset at the prospect, and in any event was not in need of a care home. He asked me if I could stop this, and I spoke to my brother-in-law to say that he didn't agree to be taken from his home. The following day, both my sisters arrived, with their husbands, and I was manhandled out of the house (which was also my own home). The Police were called, since I had been assaulted. I had already left when an officer attended. and I heard nothing more from them.

Almost two more years passed, and my grandfather died. I thought little about whether there may be any inheritance. I knew he had been encouraged to make a new will, having forgotten which solicitors had his most recently made will. I assumed that either he had remembered everything I had done for him, or that pressure may have been brought on him to cut me out altogether, in which case there would be little I could do about it. He had two surviving children of his own, and my mother had already died leaving four of her own, so if there were no will, I would only see 1/12 of his net estate, which would probably not have been worth the legal costs of challenging. I had no idea what his estate was worth, since his house had been sold privately, and no local estate agent could tell me the sale price.

As well as my two sisters, I have a brother who has learning difficulties. His understanding of details he has heard is not good, and I was unable to question him further when he informed me that our grandfather's new will left everything equally between our two sisters. All I could do was accept that we had both been swindled out of our (small) inheritance.

Well, there was no Internet back then, or at least, it was sufficiently new that few people had access to it. Moreover, I have only recently been aware that there is available online (at probatesearch.service.gov.uk) a means of searching for wills and probate for all people in the UK who died since 1858. I have searched for both my grandparents' names. My grandmother's name appears. Administration was granted (so she had her own savings, presumably, but I don't know how much). My grandfather's name does not appear. Therefore, how can there have been any will? If there was none, how could his property be sold and the proceeds distributed?

I am sure that there has been some dishonesty in this, and I wonder what I should do to have it investigated? The money is of very little concern to me. Much less than the thought that my efforts in caring for my grandparents seem to have been completely forgotten or disregarded. Do I go to the Police? I wonder whether, after over 20 years, I will be taken seriously. If I am advised to go down the Civil route, I will probably spend more in legal fees than I could recover.

What would anyone here suggest?
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Comments

  • Yorkshireman99
    Yorkshireman99 Posts: 5,470 Forumite
    Churchward wrote: »
    Here's a bit of a story. Events which took place over 20 years ago are very suspicious, however the evidence of any wrongdoing has only recently become available.

    Between September 1991 and December 1993, I was my grandparents' live-in carer. In October 1993, my grandmother died, and a few days later one of my two sisters arrived at the house, asking my grandfather to sign over Power of Attorney so that she could deal with my grandmother's affairs. The suggestion was that she would arrange a funeral on his behalf. He signed the document, which I was not invited to see.

    Another month or so passed, and the same sister's husband announced that my grandfather was going to spend some time in a care home. He was upset at the prospect, and in any event was not in need of a care home. He asked me if I could stop this, and I spoke to my brother-in-law to say that he didn't agree to be taken from his home. The following day, both my sisters arrived, with their husbands, and I was manhandled out of the house (which was also my own home). The Police were called, since I had been assaulted. I had already left when an officer attended. and I heard nothing more from them.

    Almost two more years passed, and my grandfather died. I thought little about whether there may be any inheritance. I knew he had been encouraged to make a new will, having forgotten which solicitors had his most recently made will. I assumed that either he had remembered everything I had done for him, or that pressure may have been brought on him to cut me out altogether, in which case there would be little I could do about it. He had two surviving children of his own, and my mother had already died leaving four of her own, so if there were no will, I would only see 1/12 of his net estate, which would probably not have been worth the legal costs of challenging. I had no idea what his estate was worth, since his house had been sold privately, and no local estate agent could tell me the sale price.

    As well as my two sisters, I have a brother who has learning difficulties. His understanding of details he has heard is not good, and I was unable to question him further when he informed me that our grandfather's new will left everything equally between our two sisters. All I could do was accept that we had both been swindled out of our (small) inheritance.

    Well, there was no Internet back then, or at least, it was sufficiently new that few people had access to it. Moreover, I have only recently been aware that there is available online (at probatesearch.service.gov.uk) a means of searching for wills and probate for all people in the UK who died since 1858. I have searched for both my grandparents' names. My grandmother's name appears. Administration was granted (so she had her own savings, presumably, but I don't know how much). My grandfather's name does not appear. Therefore, how can there have been any will? If there was none, how could his property be sold and the proceeds distributed?

    I am sure that there has been some dishonesty in this, and I wonder what I should do to have it investigated? The money is of very little concern to me. Much less than the thought that my efforts in caring for my grandparents seem to have been completely forgotten or disregarded. Do I go to the Police? I wonder whether, after over 20 years, I will be taken seriously. If I am advised to go down the Civil route, I will probably spend more in legal fees than I could recover.

    What would anyone here suggest?
    After this time you have no chance of getting anything done. Forget it.
  • TonyMMM
    TonyMMM Posts: 3,379 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary
    edited 5 July 2018 at 7:55AM
    A possible scenario ...
    Churchward wrote: »
    ... one of my two sisters arrived at the house, asking my grandfather to sign over Power of Attorney so that she could deal with my grandmother's affairs.

    You can't have a Power of Attorney for someone who has died - far more likely it related to managing your grandfather's affairs.

    Your grandmother's assets ("administration being granted" means she didn't leave a will) would have passed to him.
    Churchward wrote: »
    grandfather was going to spend some time in a care home. ...........

    Almost two more years passed, and my grandfather died.

    If he spent two years in a care home, that would use up a great deal of any funds he may have had
    Churchward wrote: »
    how could his property be sold and the proceeds distributed?

    Probably using the POA, before he died - check the Land registry to see exactly when it was sold.
  • Keep_pedalling
    Keep_pedalling Posts: 16,620 Forumite
    First Anniversary First Post Name Dropper Photogenic
    The absence of any probate records is not evidence of any wrong doing. If the estate with simple with no property involved then probate is often not required.
  • Margot123
    Margot123 Posts: 1,116 Forumite
    While the passage of time may have made a lot of evidence 'disappear', if you suspect fraud then you must act.

    In the first instance, consult with a solicitor; many offer free 20 minute advice sessions. You will soon be told if there is any chance of civil or criminal action.
  • badmemory
    badmemory Posts: 7,788 Forumite
    First Anniversary Name Dropper First Post
    I would be suspecting fraudulent use of a POA, with the will as a side issue just in case they have missed anything. I would suspect that any money was long gone before he died.


    If your sisters have children it will be interesting to see how those children deal with their parent's finances.
  • Margot123
    Margot123 Posts: 1,116 Forumite
    badmemory wrote: »
    I would be suspecting fraudulent use of a POA, with the will as a side issue just in case they have missed anything. I would suspect that any money was long gone before he died.


    If your sisters have children it will be interesting to see how those children deal with their parent's finances.

    Unfortunately, when the sponsor of the POA is deceased, there is never any investigation by the Office of the Public Guardian or any other authority.
  • Dox
    Dox Posts: 3,116 Forumite
    First Anniversary Name Dropper First Post
    Churchward wrote: »
    Well, there was no Internet back then, or at least, it was sufficiently new that few people had access to it. Moreover, I have only recently been aware that there is available online (at probatesearch.service.gov.uk) a means of searching for wills and probate for all people in the UK who died since 1858. I have searched for both my grandparents' names. My grandmother's name appears. Administration was granted (so she had her own savings, presumably, but I don't know how much). My grandfather's name does not appear. Therefore, how can there have been any will? If there was none, how could his property be sold and the proceeds distributed?

    Your grandfather's name won't appear if probate was never granted - and presumably it didn't need to be.

    Is that your 'recent discovery'? If so, I think it's a case of disappointment rather than dishonesty.

    See a solicitor if it makes you feel better, but in the absence of hard facts (including written evidence), there won't be anything they can do.
  • Brynsam
    Brynsam Posts: 3,643 Forumite
    First Anniversary Name Dropper Combo Breaker First Post
    Churchward wrote: »
    Here's a bit of a story. Events which took place over 20 years ago are very suspicious, however the evidence of any wrongdoing has only recently become available. What evidence - and why were events 'suspicious'?

    Between September 1991 and December 1993, I was my grandparents' live-in carer. In October 1993, my grandmother died, and a few days later one of my two sisters arrived at the house, asking my grandfather to sign over Power of Attorney so that she could deal with my grandmother's affairs. The suggestion was that she would arrange a funeral on his behalf. He signed the document, which I was not invited to see. POA cannot be assigned once the donor is dead. Why would your grandfather need to sign over anything if he was of sound mind - he could simply give his granddaughter (your sister) his blessing to arrange the funeral.

    Another month or so passed, and the same sister's husband announced that my grandfather was going to spend some time in a care home. He was upset at the prospect, and in any event was not in need of a care home. He asked me if I could stop this, and I spoke to my brother-in-law to say that he didn't agree to be taken from his home. The following day, both my sisters arrived, with their husbands, and I was manhandled out of the house (which was also my own home). The Police were called, since I had been assaulted. I had already left when an officer attended. and I heard nothing more from them. So why didn't you pursue it, not least to ensure you grandfather wasn't ejected from his home?

    Almost two more years passed, and my grandfather died. I thought little about whether there may be any inheritance. I knew he had been encouraged to make a new will, having forgotten which solicitors had his most recently made will. I assumed that either he had remembered everything I had done for him, or that pressure may have been brought on him to cut me out altogether, in which case there would be little I could do about it. He had two surviving children of his own, and my mother had already died leaving four of her own, so if there were no will, I would only see 1/12 of his net estate, which would probably not have been worth the legal costs of challenging. I had no idea what his estate was worth, since his house had been sold privately, and no local estate agent could tell me the sale price.

    As well as my two sisters, I have a brother who has learning difficulties. His understanding of details he has heard is not good, and I was unable to question him further when he informed me that our grandfather's new will left everything equally between our two sisters. All I could do was accept that we had both been swindled out of our (small) inheritance. That's a rather drama queen type of statement - especially with no evidence that you had been swindled. Maybe your grandfather was so upset that you didn't act to stop him being put in a home that he didn't want to leave you anything?

    Well, there was no Internet back then, or at least, it was sufficiently new that few people had access to it. Moreover, I have only recently been aware that there is available online (at probatesearch.service.gov.uk) a means of searching for wills and probate for all people in the UK who died since 1858. I have searched for both my grandparents' names. My grandmother's name appears. Administration was granted (so she had her own savings, presumably, but I don't know how much). My grandfather's name does not appear. Therefore, how can there have been any will? If there was none, how could his property be sold and the proceeds distributed? Quite easily if probate wasn't required. The property might well have been sold already. Have you checked the Land Registry records to see what the sale history is?

    I am sure that there has been some dishonesty in this, and I wonder what I should do to have it investigated? The money is of very little concern to me. Much less than the thought that my efforts in caring for my grandparents seem to have been completely forgotten or disregarded. So what would you achieve by trying to have this investigated - who is going to acknowledge your efforts? Do I go to the Police? I wonder whether, after over 20 years, I will be taken seriously. If I am advised to go down the Civil route, I will probably spend more in legal fees than I could recover.

    What would anyone here suggest? Unless you have much stronger evidence than the fact your grandfather's name doesn't appear on the list of wills/probate granted, where's your evidence? Hurt feelings may be very real, but they don't support your argument.

    Sorry this is a chain of negatives, but it could save you a trip down a frustrating and possibly expensive blind alley.
  • Yorkshireman99
    Yorkshireman99 Posts: 5,470 Forumite
    Brynsam wrote: »
    Sorry this is a chain of negatives, but it could save you a trip down a frustrating and possibly expensive blind alley.
    The bottom line is that after all this time the the OP has no realistic chance whatsoever of proviung or recovering anything.
  • Margot123
    Margot123 Posts: 1,116 Forumite
    The bottom line is that after all this time the the OP has no realistic chance whatsoever of proviung or recovering anything.

    And this is why a 20 minute freebie session with a local solicitor would be time well-spent for them.
    In fact it probably wouldn't even take the full 20 minutes.
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