Private PCN on residential estate

squire1234 · 6 August 2018 at 4:33PM

Hi all,

I live in a large estate where each resident has their own parking space. There are also 4 visitor spots but these are almost always taken by residents with second vehicles. There are undesignated areas within the estate, alongside curbs, which residents regularly use for additional parking and these do not cause any obstruction to traffic, but are obviously against the T&Cs of parking in the estate. Unfortunately, there is no way to pay for additional parking permits anywhere in my area so residents, including myself, continue to do so out of necessity.

Whenever I have a visitor, I will allow them to park in my bay (with my permit) and I will move my car to one of the undesignated areas. Unfortunately, I have received 3 parking tickets over the past 12 months as a result. I have followed the advice on this forum and waited for the NTK in each case and then appealed to the PPC, not admitting liability. The photographic evidence that the PPC have does not clearly confirm whether I was even parked in an undesignated area in any of the cases. Obviously, the appeals were all rejected.

I have now received a LBC from Gladstones and was hoping for some reassurance that I am doing the right thing by not paying and guidance on what to do next. I am currently making my way through the newbies thread. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

P.S. I cannot attach an image of the letter and the signage in the estate as a new user but I can PM if it helps.

Umkomaas · 6 August 2018 at 4:52PM

I have now received a LBC from Gladstones and was hoping for some reassurance that I am doing the right thing by not paying and guidance on what to do next. I am currently making my way through the newbies thread. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

The NEWBIES FAQ sticky, post #2 covers the court processes, from LBC through to the hearing.

P.S. I cannot attach an image of the letter and the signage in the estate as a new user but I can PM if it helps.

No need for PMs - do this:

To upload a photo/scan link, you first need to host it on a free photo hosting site (like Dropbox, Imurg or Tinypic), copy the URL, paste it here, but change the http to hxxp and we'll do the conversion. Newbies can't directly upload links to photos/scans until they've got a few posts under their belt.

The_Deep · 6 August 2018 at 5:07PM

Read this

https://parking-prankster.blogspot.com/2016/11/residential-parking.html

If you park where the landowner or his agent say you should not park then you may be breaking the terms of your lease/AST and cannot use primacy of contract as a defence.

However, Gladstones are low bottom end solicitors with scammers as clients, and usually muck up the paperwork in court, google "You've been Gladstoned" to see
what I mean,hat I mean. Also, complain to your MP.

This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of contracts for alleged parking offences, aided and abetted by a handful of low-rent solicitors.

Parking Eye, CPM, Smart, and another company have already been named and shamed, as has Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (these two law firms take hundreds of these cases to court each year). They lose most of them, and have been reported to the regulatory authority by an M.P. for unprofessional conduct

Hospital car parks and residential complex tickets have been especially mentioned.

The problem has become so rampant that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers. Watch the video of the Second Reading in the House of Commons recently

http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/2f0384f2-eba5-4fff-ab07-cf24b6a22918?in=12:49:41 recently.

and complain in the most robust terms to your MP. With a fair wind they will be out of business by Christmas.

Half_way · 6 August 2018 at 5:08PM

Forget the Ts&Cs on the parking sign and the permits, the critical part is what does the lease/rental/etc say about parking?
what gives the parking company rights to operate on the land?

squire1234 · 7 August 2018 at 5:15PM

Thanks for the replies. I have included the gladstone letter and estate signage links below.

hxxps://postimg.cc/image/4rl3fagh3/

hxxps://google.com/search?q=linkparking+sign&client=safari&rls=en&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjj4ryVqtvcAhUICcAKHdqHAR4Q_AUICigB&biw=1440&bih=816#imgrc=PL6Vlss1nQv-FM:

the critical part is what does the lease/rental/etc say about parking?

So I have been reading through my AST contract and there is absolutely no mention of parking in it. The contract was through openrent. What does this mean?

KeithP · 7 August 2018 at 5:24PM

https://postimg.cc/image/4rl3fagh3/

Yes, as you say, that's definitely a Letter Before Claim and you need to respond to it.

Umkomaas has already referred you to post #2 of the NEWBIES thread where you will find sample robust responses.

You google images link does not produce the result you were hoping for.

NeilCr · 7 August 2018 at 5:47PM

There might be something in your landlord's lease about parking

What, specifically, were you told by the landlord/Openrent about parking when you started the tenancy?

How did you get the permit? How do you know the Ts and Cs of the parking "rules"?

squire1234 · 7 August 2018 at 11:56PM

Umkomaas has already referred you to post #2 of the NEWBIES thread where you will find sample robust responses.

Thank you, I have been making my way through this thread already actually! I presume it is not worth me paying the charge at this point? And are there additional court costs if I were to lose?

What, specifically, were you told by the landlord/Openrent about parking when you started the tenancy?

How did you get the permit? How do you know the Ts and Cs of the parking "rules"?

To be honest, the landlord just handed me her permit when I moved in and told me which spot was mine. I have tripled checked my openrent AST agreement and there certainly isn't anything in it. As you say, there is probably further information in the landlord's lease agreement, which I do not have currently.

The T&Cs are displayed around the carpark on various poles/lamp posts. I tried to link this earlier but posted the wrong link. This is the correct one:

hxxp://legalbeagles.info/forums/filedata/fetch?id=1172741

Thank you all so much for your help once again.

KeithP · 8 August 2018 at 12:11AM

http://legalbeagles.info/forums/filedata/fetch?id=1172741

The first thing that strikes me about that sign is how prominent the £100 charge is - or isn't.

Compare your sign with the Beavis sign as can be seen on The Parking Prankster's site:
http://parking-prankster.blogspot.com/2016/01/new-popla-staying-cases-to-consider.html

Read the PP's blog - there is good info in there.

NeilCr · 8 August 2018 at 6:42AM

Others on here have far more knowledge than me about signs etc.

Half Way has it. It would be helpful to know how Link came to be on the estate. Who appointed them, who are the parties to the contract and what authority was used. Are you friendly enough with the landlady to have a chat with her about the background to their introduction. She might have some paperwork. And sight of her lease would be good - or at least information on what is contained in it.

ETA

Think this is quite a common problem on modern estates. We have one visitor parking space for sixty nine properties. I know the builder and he wanted to put in more but the local council wouldn't let him. We have an access road where it is possible to park in certain areas. We are okay with that (residents own the freehold) but had to put up no parking signs on other parts because of selfish parking. It really is amazing how badly some folks can park!

squire1234 · 22 August 2018 at 11:06AM

The first thing that strikes me about that sign is how prominent the £100 charge is - or isn't.

Thank you for this, very helpful.

Half Way has it. It would be helpful to know how Link came to be on the estate. Who appointed them, who are the parties to the contract and what authority was used. Are you friendly enough with the landlady to have a chat with her about the background to their introduction. She might have some paperwork. And sight of her lease would be good - or at least information on what is contained in it.

I asked for the lease but, unfortunately, the landlady has not given me anything

I am very new to this process, is the claim by Gladstones done electronically or do I need to appear in court to present my case?

Private PCN on residential estate

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