Intrum are taking me to court and I could do with help breaking this down

WhenIam64 · 7 October 2019 at 6:32PM

Was called away before I could finish this

How far can I push this? What is the best solution for me given that I want to avoid a CCJ? What should my next steps be?

There is no "best solution" as you have the facts and you know your own tolerances. You can roll the dice and take it all the way to the court. If you lose (you may win) and pay the judgment within 1 month the CCJ is removed from your record.

So option 1 is to take it all the way and risk the £1500 +interest plus costs of about £200. They don't want to go to court as much as you. What you have to understand is that these debts are sold as there is usually a flaw in the paperwork. If you can spot it, and most can't, then you pay nothing. If the judge spots it, you pay nothing but there is a risk it is not spotted.

So the your decision is almost a gambling one, which is what Intrum are doing.

If we come to an agreement must I still file a defence?

You should file a defence until such times as the send a Notice of Discontinuance. Sometimes they promised to drop it and the paperwork gets lost. The defendant then ends up with a CCJ and no way out other than paying the full amount within 1 month.

If you can stand the £1500 + and want to see how the court process works then take it all the way. If you are of a nervous outlook then you can pay in full; go for the Tomlin Order; or negotiate like mad over the next few days.

they will have an amount in mind they may be willing to take, but they likley wont tell you what that is.

Sourcrates sums it up succinctly.

zippygeorgeandben · 7 October 2019 at 8:45PM

How lucky we are to have some well education folk perusing these pages.
I'm sure the OP is extremely grateful!

Mikeyg123 · 8 October 2019 at 2:48PM

Thanks for the detailed information, it's really helping and I'm very grateful.

I would ideally like to resolve the issue outside of court - and avoid a CCJ.

I called Intrum back today and doubled my offer (£400), they declined and said they were hoping I'd offer £1100-£1200 which I cannot afford. This wasn't a formal offer and the lady I spoke with closed the call by saying they won't accept anything less than £1300.

I will keep calling and will try and negotiate to the best I can.

Regarding the paperwork, I cannot spot any obvious mistakes though as I described I have not received or seen a default notice.

I'm conscious that I must start working on my defense and given that I've not got much to go off can you help guide me on where to look for a guide on how best to write one as it's not something I've done before. Are there any glaring points I should include in it?

Mikeyg123 · 11 October 2019 at 10:38AM

Hi all,

Any further advice on what to include in my defense would be really appreciated.

sourcrates · 11 October 2019 at 1:20PM

Well what is your defence ?

You idealy need as many strings to your bow as possible, so take a look at whats happened.

(1) They have failed to provide any evidence of your liability in the form of an executed agreement.

(2) Failed to provide a copy of the default notice, or notice of assignment.

(3) You dispute the amount of interest they are asking for.

As WhenIam64 says, its all a game of bluff to see who will crumble first, the longer you can string it out, the better your chances, if they don`t have any evience, its more than likley they will discontinue, but they will carry on right up until that point just to make you sweat.

Mikeyg123 · 11 October 2019 at 2:15PM

Thanks for the reply - I really appreciate it and now I understand what sort of points I need to include.

Regarding the particulars I received which included:

A copy of the page a signed when I took out the credit agreement

Copies of credit card statements

A copy of a letter sent to me notifying me that Lloyds has assigned the debt to 1st credit (finance) limited

A copy of a letter from 1st credit notifying me that Lloyds has assigned the debt to them

A copy of the direct debit agreement between my bank and 1st credit along with a statement of account showing several (four) payments I made

A copy of the certificate of incorporation on change of name

Is this substantial enough evidence for them to win? Or is there anything I should look out for in the paperwork which may help my case?

There are a couple of points I previously mentioned which I was wondering if I could include in my defense? These are:

There isn't proof of postage to confirm these documents were ever sent to me
I have not received a copy of the default notice
Not all bank statements have been provided
The name change (1st credit to Intrum) was not communicated to me

Please let me know if these points are applicable and if there's anything else you believe I should mention let me know.

Thanks again everyone!

Mikeyg123 · 15 October 2019 at 5:33PM

Hi all,

I'm just working on my defence now which is due by 18th Oct. I was just want to follow up on my previous post.

I was also wondering if there is anything I should look out for in the paperwork which may help my case which I can put down?

Also, should I refer to any cases in my defence?

WhenIam64 · 15 October 2019 at 7:22PM

Bare in mind that the burden of proof is on them. They have to be able to weave a story around the paperwork they are in possession of. They were not the lenders so anything they say is second hand. Your job is not to fill in the gaps for them.

What you have to do is to go carefully through the paperwork and see if the story stacks up and show where, in your opinion, their story falls down.

There is a temptation with defences to blurt out everything when all that is needed is to create sufficient doubt that they either drop it or the judge decides they haven't proven their case.

As was mentioned before, Intrum buys these as there is a flaw. You just have to find it. Alternatively just go for the 3 issues that appear to indicate their assignment paperwork is not in order.

Once your defence goes in, the claim goes into a long queue to allow you to contact Intrum again with another F&F. They are playing a game with the court's time. You can do the same. They will settle before it goes in front of a judge as they won't know what a judge might find.

Mikeyg123 · 16 October 2019 at 3:03PM

Hi all,

I've just finished writing my defence and was wondering if I could get your opinion on it before I send it off tomorrow morning? Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

1. The Claimants statement of case fails to give adequate information to enable me to properly assess my position with regards the claim.

2. The Claimant's statement of case states that the account was assigned from Lloyds to Intrum on XXXXX. The Defendant does not recall receiving notice of this assignment.

3. It is denied that Lloyds served any Default notice on the Defendant pursuant to s87 Consumer Credit Act 1974. The Claimant is required to prove that a compliant Default Notice was served upon the Defendant.

4. On the XXXXX I sent a request for inspection of documents mentioned in the claimant's statement of case under Civil Procedure Rule 31.14 to the claimant. I requested the Claimant provide copies of the Agreement, Default Notice and Notice of Assignment.

5. The claimant has not sent the default notice to me, nor did I receive the full agreement.

6. On the XXXX I sent a formal request for a copy of the original agreement to Intrum pursuant to section [77 or 78] of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 along with the statutory £1 fee.

7. The Claimant has failed to comply with [s77 (1) / s 78 (1)] Consumer Credit Act 1974 and by virtue of [s77 (4) / s 78 (6)] Consumer Credit Act 1974 cannot enforce the agreement.

8. I request the court orders the Claimants to provide the necessary documentation in order for me to fully plead my case else the Claim should stand struck out.

9. In the event that the relevant documents are received from the Claimants I will then be in a position to amend my defence, and would ask that the Claimants bear the costs of the amendment.

10. I dispute the amount of interest the claimant is asking for.

fatbelly · 16 October 2019 at 7:24PM

Credit cards are s78 so you can delete the s77 references. Otherwise that seems all pretty standard.

Intrum are taking me to court and I could do with help breaking this down

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