CCA request - E mail?

Radar_UK · 1 October 2018 at 7:59PM

Replace ** with www. for pictures.

The link below shows the bad photocopy they sent me, I blacked out my info...

**amazon.co.uk/photos/share/TM33pyhM2F8IvCy8GBiQvl1rhBhDChYrjUKcxmKtbdg

The letter from March...

**amazon.co.uk/photos/share/Ifvl4uSbrfg5ghGbzk0t69YpWjdNim0F7lf2ReLTOgd

The letter now...

**amazon.co.uk/photos/share/gGeomWMfn3ucDDorvpwhHZsj9qCYvsygxihePLXFu27

fatbelly · 1 October 2018 at 8:18PM

Radar_UK wrote: »

Replace ** with www. for pictures.

The link below shows the bad photocopy they sent me, I blacked out my info...

https://www.amazon.co.uk/photos/share/TM33pyhM2F8IvCy8GBiQvl1rhBhDChYrjUKcxmKtbdg

The letter from March...

https://www.amazon.co.uk/photos/share/Ifvl4uSbrfg5ghGbzk0t69YpWjdNim0F7lf2ReLTOgd

The letter now...

https://www.amazon.co.uk/photos/share/gGeomWMfn3ucDDorvpwhHZsj9qCYvsygxihePLXFu27

Done the links for you

fatbelly · 1 October 2018 at 8:33PM

I had a close look at that 'agreement'. Now this is not my specialist area but I'd say that what purports to be a consumer credit act agreement is actually not, as it does not contain any of the prescribed terms (credit limit, interest rate and repayment terms).

Such an 'agreement' was found unenforceable in the case of Santander v Mayhew (our own Just Di) and this article explains:

https://paulatwatsonssolicitors.wordpress.com/2012/05/24/santander-v-mayhew/

It would be interesting to have Di's take on this.

Radar_UK · 6 October 2018 at 12:51PM

I missed a call from PRA yesterday, was at my dads funeral.

Received a call today saying they’ve sent me all the required documents so the account is open and they want it paying.

I explained that what they sent me is the exact same bad photocopy they sent in March, when they deemed the account unenforceable, and nothing more. I also pointed out that I didn’t believe what they had provided was enforceable as it’s missing the terms mentioned by fat belly.

I got put on hold for 5 minutes and when the woman came back on she said she believes what they’ve sent me does make the account enforceable as they just found the document they sent me, she didn’t seem to get that they already had that document and it’s the exact thing they sent me in March when they themselves said it wasn’t enforceable.

I’ve asked them to send me a letter confirming they deem the account to be enforceable, so I can then take advice on the matter.

Can anyone advise on the best way for me to proceed now? Do I just admit defeat and set up a payment plan?

sourcrates · 6 October 2018 at 12:59PM

Radar_UK wrote: »

I missed a call from PRA yesterday, was at my dads funeral.

Received a call today saying they’ve sent me all the required documents so the account is open and they want it paying.

I explained that what they sent me is the exact same bad photocopy they sent in March, when they deemed the account unenforceable, and nothing more. I also pointed out that I didn’t believe what they had provided was enforceable as it’s missing the terms mentioned by fat belly.

I got put on hold for 5 minutes and when the woman came back on she said she believes what they’ve sent me does make the account enforceable as they just found the document they sent me, she didn’t seem to get that they already had that document and it’s the exact thing they sent me in March when they themselves said it wasn’t enforceable.

I’ve asked them to send me a letter confirming they deem the account to be enforceable, so I can then take advice on the matter.

Can anyone advise on the best way for me to proceed now? Do I just admit defeat and set up a payment plan?

You have hit an impasse, you say one thing, they say another.

Clearly this can only be decided now by a court, it depends if they want to risk taking you to court or not, with only an illegible photocopy document as evidence.

My advice is stay off the phone to them, all future contact should be in writing only, send them a letter outlining your position, tell them in writing what you've told us, avoid women on phone in future as they are just call handlers and know nothing of enforcability issues.

Never admit defeat until until all avenues have been explored.

fatbelly · 6 October 2018 at 1:14PM

I think that's good advice from sourcrates. Do not 'admit defeat' when it looks quite likely that it's them who have lost!

You should also get someone more experienced in cca matters to take a look at that agreement - I believe Di works for a firm that specialises, but she's not been online for a few days. You could also try Legal Beagles.

If it does result in a court case (not as scary as it sounds) the end result will always depend on the individual judge that sits on the hearing. So that adds a level of unpredictability on both sides. PRA may not want to risk it.

Your original post indicates that you were trying to soften them up ahead of a F&F deal. That option is still open to you but I would advise to make any offer in writing, use the National Debtline model letter and make sure the heading 'without prejudice' is there.

I've just been involved in a case (not quite the same as yours) where we made an offer of 5p (five) in the pound and it was immediately accepted, to my surprise! Clearly the creditor didn't think they had a very strong case.

Edit: also look at this case Sourcrates just posted on

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=74882166

Radar_UK · 14 October 2018 at 12:58PM

Had a quiet week, waiting for the letter from them confirming they deem the account enforceable, and then this letter showed up.

I didn’t speak to them on the 8th, to raise any query or dispute...

https://www.amazon.co.uk/photos/share/KIRBvHFqtNyQTByoXyKbzYfcMrOF8xlk3QeF09fsFFn

I can only assume they don’t really think it is enforceable?

I am thinking now might be a good time to throw in a lowball full and final, just to get them off my back and this finished once and for all?

Or should I hardball and Just ignore this?

If you think an offer is worth it, how low would you go? Token £100/£200? Higher offer at £300/£400?

Thoughts

sourcrates · 14 October 2018 at 1:18PM

That`s just a standard "account on hold while we investigate your issue" letter, it means nothing.

Radar_UK · 14 October 2018 at 1:47PM

As I was expecting a letter to confirm they now deem the account enforceable, as that’s what they told me when I last spoke to them, maybe they are not so sure in their change of mind.

That’s why I was wondering if now is a good time to throw a low f&f in? Even tho it’s been 7+ months, they might get their hands on what they need in the future?

Just_Di · 21 October 2018 at 4:18PM

Radar_UK wrote: »

a letter to confirm they now deem the account enforceable, as that’s what they told me when I last spoke to them, maybe they are not so sure in their change of mind.

PRA may well deem the account as enforceable but only a judge can do that.

They were wrong in the case of PRA v Diana Mayhew ( me

) but that didn't stop them pursuing it all the way to a three day Trial at the Royal Courts of Justice where they lost and had to pay my legal costs (I work for the firm who acted for me so that was ironical).

I've peeked at the application form which you posted up but it's hard to comment on a redacted document, especially one which is mostly illegible. Is the actually document they sent you equally illegible?

Is that all they sent you or did they produce the Ts & Cs too?

Lawyers have an expression "we don't litigate through correspondence" . PRA keep asking you what's wrong with their documents in the hope that you'll tell them so they can remedy the situation. Don't do their work for them.

If they want to take this further they should send you a Letter Before Claim giving you 30 days to respond before they should issue a claim. At that point you can ask them for more documents such as the Default Notice. Do you recall being served with one, and if so was it from Barclays or from Mercers?

Di

CCA request - E mail?

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