Charging Order? The myth

Land_Registry · 2 July 2014 at 10:39AM

Thanks eggbox but as mentioned the wording is crucial here as is the type of restriction, be it standard or non-standard. The reasoning being that certain restrictions are applied for to protect an interest under a trust for example Forms A, B, C, J, K, Q and JJ should be overreached.

The extract provided does not confirm the exact detail.

As far as our view re your other question is concerned the wording is quite clear - we need the written confirmation of the creditor and not confirmation from the buyer/seller that they have notified the creditor. The nuances are important here as different restrictions are applied for in differing circumstances and to protect different interests.

wembley14 may need to clarify things further or contact us and we can check the specific details and perhaps share some additional but general info in the thread for others to refer to etc?

eggbox · 2 July 2014 at 11:03AM

Land_Registry_representative wrote: »

The nuances are important here as different restrictions are applied for in differing circumstances and to protect different interests.

Hi LRR, as ever, thank you for the information.

Is it possible you can expand on the differing circumstances to protect different interests part of your reply?

I ask as from the posters who have said they have the "Creditor must give confirmation" type of Restriction do not, it would seem, have a debt any different to those posters with standard Form K? (ie, they are consumer credit card/loan debts and a CO has been made on the BI)

What different interests are we talking about here?

Land_Registry · 2 July 2014 at 11:40AM

eggbox - our online guidance, which you will have seen already, seeks to cover the issues around third party interests in general and includes not only a list of our standard restrictions but also a very useful section on some of the most common examples of interests and how they are protected on the register.

I cannot comment on any differing circumstances around specific debts or types of debt as that is not always something which is revealed when applying for a restriction. wembley14's restriction appears on the face of the limited extract provided to be a non-standard restriction so may not easily fit a given set of circumstances

wembley14 · 2 July 2014 at 10:23PM

HI Eggbox/LR Rep.

I have just read replies and becoming more and more perplexed with the nuances of these restrictions. The joint owned property with sole debtor has now been sold to a buyer who paid value. So how can any restriction entered on the proprietorship register only, be able to remain when it was in my name (beneficial interest) and not in charges register(equitable charge over the legal estate.)

The new buyers and their mortgage lenders must now be able to register their new property without being encumbered with creditors restriction from previous owners.

What has happened with the overreaching?

The exact wording of restriction registered on title deeds :

NO DISPOSITION OF THE REGISTERED ESTATE IS TO BE COMPLETED BY REGISTRATION WITHOUT A CERTIFICATE SIGNED BY OR ON BEHALF OF

OR ITS SOLICITORS THAT WRITTEN NOTICE OF THE DISPOSITION WAS GIVEN TO THE SAID

AT LEAST 14 DAYS PRIOR TO THE DISPOSITION (THE SAID FINANCIAL SERVICES BEING THE PERSON WITH THE BENEFIT OF AN INTERIM CHARGING ORDER ON THE BENEFICIAL INTEREST OF MR

BY THE

COUNTY COURT UNDER CLAIM

OR WITHOUT A FURTHER ORDER OF THE COURT WHICH ORDERED THIS RESTRICTION.

Is this a standard FORM K RESTRICTION.????

eggbox · 3 July 2014 at 6:52AM

Hi Wembley,

I share your perplexion on this matter as it's obvious your creditor has been notified of the sale but, it seems, is refusing to acknowledge this fact. it would be different if they hadn't been notified.

Hopefully, LRR can shed more light now but can I ask what the actual debt was for?

wembley14 · 3 July 2014 at 11:38AM

HI Eggbox
the debt was the result of being guarantor for my son purchasing a new car in 2003 and him unable to pay remainder of finance. The car was then repossessed and sold at auction. He and I was unable to pay the shortfall when sold. That amount was then added to CCJ and then progressed to restriction order. 11 years down the line the amount has nearly quadrupled.

I should add though that my son has for the last 2 years been paying monthly payments off this debt that was agreed with the finance company. The solicitors engaged by this company are the one's that are pursuing with this restriction order and it seems are not taking this arrangement into consideration.

eggbox · 3 July 2014 at 12:09PM

Hi Wembley

To me it's just another consumer credit debt and I can't see why any special reason this Restriction wouldn't be overreached?

Hopefully LRR will advise, shortly?

wembley14 · 3 July 2014 at 6:47PM

Cheers Eggbox for reply,
Hopefully LRR can shed some light on the wording I have previously posted.
After nearly six weeks since completion, registration of new buyer at LR still not done as I have not heard from my solicitor, he is supposed to be keeping me informed.
Thanks again for your input.

eggbox · 4 July 2014 at 9:48AM

No problem, wembley and hopefully LRR will be along to explain what the situation is?

Land_Registry · 4 July 2014 at 10:54AM

eggbox and wembley14 - apologies for slow responses on this one.

I did ask you to email me with the specific property details in my earlier post but I have received nothing as far as I am aware? At the moment I can add nothing to the discussion as I need to understand what has happened from our perspective and whether there is a wider issue involved.

As you already appreciate we will not be aware of or involved in the court process so how the order came about and what has happened since would have no bearing on the registration process.

You can compare the wording with a form K via our online guidance

Charging Order? The myth

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