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county court claim - civil enforcement
stansmum
Posts: 40 Forumite
Hi there
Back in February my mum parked in a private car park and later received a letter from civil enforcement limited for a 'parking charge notice', who later passed the 'debt' on to debt recovery plus and zenith collections. My mum ignored all of the letters and did not complain earlier (from reading threads I see this isn't advisable) and hasn't sought the SAR information - Again not advisable but we are what we are. She has now received a claims form from the courts.
I have since read the newbies thread and many of the links included. She has acknowledged service and will defend the whole claim. Her intended arguments are that : -The amount claimed has been inflated over time, starting at £100 originally, then to £140, then to £170, and now the claim letter adds additional costs for inflation. These increases appear unnecessary for passing an invoice around parts of the same company - signage is unclear. She has taken pictures of the car park and none of these signs can be reasonably read from a passing car, - there is very poor lighting in the car park, meaning at night, which is when she parked there, the signs are almost entirely invisible (she has pictures) The bays are barely visible, meaning it cannot be reasonably assumed that it is in fact a car park - it simply appears as an unused piece of land, which has been the case for some years beforehand (another reason she didn't notice it was now a car park)
She needs to file her defence by Sunday 30th Nov. I would be most grateful if the helpful people on this forum could support us in drafting a defence based on the above points
Many thanks
Back in February my mum parked in a private car park and later received a letter from civil enforcement limited for a 'parking charge notice', who later passed the 'debt' on to debt recovery plus and zenith collections. My mum ignored all of the letters and did not complain earlier (from reading threads I see this isn't advisable) and hasn't sought the SAR information - Again not advisable but we are what we are. She has now received a claims form from the courts.
I have since read the newbies thread and many of the links included. She has acknowledged service and will defend the whole claim. Her intended arguments are that : -The amount claimed has been inflated over time, starting at £100 originally, then to £140, then to £170, and now the claim letter adds additional costs for inflation. These increases appear unnecessary for passing an invoice around parts of the same company - signage is unclear. She has taken pictures of the car park and none of these signs can be reasonably read from a passing car, - there is very poor lighting in the car park, meaning at night, which is when she parked there, the signs are almost entirely invisible (she has pictures) The bays are barely visible, meaning it cannot be reasonably assumed that it is in fact a car park - it simply appears as an unused piece of land, which has been the case for some years beforehand (another reason she didn't notice it was now a car park)
She needs to file her defence by Sunday 30th Nov. I would be most grateful if the helpful people on this forum could support us in drafting a defence based on the above points
Many thanks
0
Comments
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Hello and welcome to the forums.
What is the Issue Date on the County Court Claim Form?
Is your mother the Defendant named on the Claim Form?1 -
Have her email a SAR to the DPO at the PPC asap , attaching a copy of the claim form and a copy of the V5C (or a redacted recent utility bill) as proof of I D under the GDPR law
Post the issue date below as KeithP asked for , plus confirm that she is named as defendant1 -
Look at any other CEL defence thread - they are all about unclear signs and so easy to copy and adapt! ONLY look at recent CEL threads from this month.PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD1 -
Hello and welcome to the forums.
What is the Issue Date on the County Court Claim Form?
Is your mother the Defendant named on the Claim Form?
Thanks. The issue date is 30 October, making the day of service 4 November, and the date for the defence to be lodged 2 December I think.
Yes, she is the named defendant.0 -
Then she must email the SAR with proof of I D
She must login to the government gateway and do the AOS online
You can assist , you can also help her draft the Defence , which she must email to the CCBC as a signed and dated pdf attachment
As it's in her name , ensure that it's all done in her name , you are a helper , an assistant , but you cannot take over , people here will assist you to help her
It's important that you understand this
Her defence deadline is not a Sunday , it's a weekday by 4pm
What date was the AOS completed ?1 -
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams, so consider complaining to your MP after the election, it can cause the scammer extra costs and work.
Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, many of whom are former clampers, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.
Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.
[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]
Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.[/FONT]You never know how far you can go until you go too far.0 -
Yes, if the Acknowledgment of Service was filed by Monday 18th November, you are right with the target filing date, but there might be something useful here...The issue date is 30 October, making the day of service 4 November, and the date for the defence to be lodged 2 December I think.
With a Claim Issue Date of 30th October, and having done the Acknowledgment of Service in a timely manner, you have until 4pm on Monday 2nd December 2019 to file your Defence.
That's nearly two weeks away. Plenty of time to produce a Defence, but please don't leave it to the last minute.
When you are happy with the content, your Defence could be filed via email as suggested here:-
Print your Defence.
- Sign it and date it.
- Scan the signed document back in and save it as a pdf.
- Send that pdf as an email attachment to CCBCAQ@Justice.gov.uk
- Just put the claim number and the word Defence in the email title, and in the body of the email something like 'Please find my Defence attached'.
- No need to do anything on MCOL, but do check it after a few days to see if the Claim is marked "defence received". If not, chase the CCBC until it is.
- Do not be surprised to receive an early copy of the Claimant's Directions Questionnaire, they are trying to keep you under pressure. Just file it.
- Wait for your DQ from the CCBC, or download one from the internet, and then re-read post #2 of the NEWBIES FAQ sticky thread to find out exactly what to do with it.
Of course everywhere I have written 'you' or 'your' I mean the named Defendant.2 - Sign it and date it.
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Then she must email the SAR with proof of I D
She must login to the government gateway and do the AOS online
You can assist , you can also help her draft the Defence , which she must email to the CCBC as a signed and dated pdf attachment
As it's in her name , ensure that it's all done in her name , you are a helper , an assistant , but you cannot take over , people here will assist you to help her
It's important that you understand this
Her defence deadline is not a Sunday , it's a weekday by 4pm
What date was the AOS completed ?
Thank you. She filed the AOS on 13 November, so in plenty of time before the deadline for this. I understand the need for all correspondence to come from her and I am just assisting her through the process
Yes, if the Acknowledgment of Service was filed by Monday 18th November, you are right with the target filing date, but there might be something useful here...
With a Claim Issue Date of 30th October, and having done the Acknowledgment of Service in a timely manner, you have until 4pm on Monday 2nd December 2019 to file your Defence.
That's nearly two weeks away. Plenty of time to produce a Defence, but please don't leave it to the last minute.
When you are happy with the content, your Defence could be filed via email as suggested here:-
Print your Defence.
- Sign it and date it.
- Scan the signed document back in and save it as a pdf.
- Send that pdf as an email attachment to CCBCAQ@Justice.gov.uk
- Just put the claim number and the word Defence in the email title, and in the body of the email something like 'Please find my Defence attached'.
- No need to do anything on MCOL, but do check it after a few days to see if the Claim is marked "defence received". If not, chase the CCBC until it is.
- Do not be surprised to receive an early copy of the Claimant's Directions Questionnaire, they are trying to keep you under pressure. Just file it.
- Wait for your DQ from the CCBC, or
Of course everywhere I have written 'you' or 'your' I mean the named Defendant.
Thank you for such concise advice. (I quoted your response but as a newbie to threads the system won’t let us post links so have deleted the URLs). We appreciate this hugely. We will draft her proposed defence and post it here in the next few days - we are both new to all of this and there is a lot of information to familiarise ourselves with. We have filed the SAR this evening, but I note that they have one month to reply, so this may not come in time to provide us with additional info for our defence. Is there a way we can push for this earlier given we already have a claim in process? Thanks0 - Sign it and date it.
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No , but it's of more use in several months time for her WS plus exhibits plus costs schedule1
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As Redx says, wait and see if the SAR info comes first, but if it doesn't, no matter.
This stage is simple - copy another CEL defence & adapt it and show us. People have done this even when they know nothing at all about the signs, car park or allegation.
You will see, when you look at how we word defences as a catch-all.PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD1
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