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    • MSE Guy
    • By MSE Guy 19th Dec 11, 11:27 AM
    • 1,628Posts
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    MSE Guy
    MSE News: Co-op cuts energy prices: will the big six follow?
    • #1
    • 19th Dec 11, 11:27 AM
    MSE News: Co-op cuts energy prices: will the big six follow? 19th Dec 11 at 11:27 AM
    This is the discussion thread for the following MSE News Story:

    "Co-operative Energy has become the latest minnow to announce price cuts, but households shouldn't get too excited about cuts from the industry giants ..."

Page 1
    • Ken68
    • By Ken68 19th Dec 11, 1:22 PM
    • 6,497 Posts
    • 4,139 Thanks
    Ken68
    • #2
    • 19th Dec 11, 1:22 PM
    • #2
    • 19th Dec 11, 1:22 PM
    The Co-op still have a daily charge, so not for those that switch off gas in the summer.
    But nice to see an ethical company on board.
  • tightarsey
    • #3
    • 19th Dec 11, 2:33 PM
    Advertising Standards should be notified - Utter lies about price reductions.
    • #3
    • 19th Dec 11, 2:33 PM
    The price reductions are basically complete lies. The have excluded most of their customer base, ones that signed up before 4th Oct 2011, who got different rates.
    My mother signed up to Cooperative Energy between the 13th April and the 31st July 2011, price tariff 2.1. Prices have risen once already, (October 2011) now they have risen again in less than 6 months from signup.

    Since joining her economy 7 tariff has risen 15.1% for daytime and 51% for nighttime, yes 51% increase for nighttime.

    Area: West Midlands, Economy 7
    On joining: Day 10.91 Night 4.64
    From 1st Feb: Day 12.61 (15% increase) Night 7.02 (51% increase)

    The press release is complete lies about a 3% reduction, and (1) excluded customers from this, that prices remain 'lower'

    Cooperative are now far more expensive than Scottish Power even with its 20% increase, the company which she left.
    Last edited by tightarsey; 19-12-2011 at 2:37 PM. Reason: ed
  • MichaelNW
    • #4
    • 19th Dec 11, 7:09 PM
    • #4
    • 19th Dec 11, 7:09 PM
    The Co-Operative Bank makes the same extortionate charges as all the other banks.

    Co-operative grocery shops are as, or more, expensive than their local rivals.

    And, as noted in the preceding post, Co-Operative Energy are no better than the Big Six. Speaking of the Big Six, Co-Operative Energy say on their website "When they make big profits, it’s the shareholders who benefit, not the customers. When we make profits, it’s you who benefits."

    Can anyone tell me just how Co-Operative members actually benefit?
    • t0rt0ise
    • By t0rt0ise 19th Dec 11, 8:02 PM
    • 3,178 Posts
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    t0rt0ise
    • #5
    • 19th Dec 11, 8:02 PM
    • #5
    • 19th Dec 11, 8:02 PM
    Can anyone tell me just how Co-Operative members actually benefit?
    Originally posted by MichaelNW
    Members of the co-op get a share of the profits each year.

    The first customers don't get a reduction because they are already on a lower tariff which will still be lower than those on the later tariffs after the reduction.. apparently.
    Last edited by t0rt0ise; 19-12-2011 at 8:06 PM.
  • MichaelNW
    • #6
    • 19th Dec 11, 8:12 PM
    • #6
    • 19th Dec 11, 8:12 PM
    Members of the co-op get a share of the profits each year.
    Originally posted by t0rt0ise
    True, but whilst any benefit is to be welcomed, in money-saving terms it does not seem very significant.... members get a point for every pound spent.. for the past two years a point has been worth 1.5 pence which can be taken only in vouchers or shares. In effect it's a non-cash discount of 1.5%
    • MillicentBystander
    • By MillicentBystander 19th Dec 11, 8:51 PM
    • 3,450 Posts
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    MillicentBystander
    • #7
    • 19th Dec 11, 8:51 PM
    • #7
    • 19th Dec 11, 8:51 PM
    Whilst I welcome the Co-Op into the awful mess that is the G&E industry at present, I do note that for all their talk of fairness and no gimmicks, they do seem keen on giving new customers a cash incentive to join. I would respectfully ask you to think who may be paying for this marketing 'gimmick'. Got it. Is that really the point of a co-op?
    • t0rt0ise
    • By t0rt0ise 19th Dec 11, 9:25 PM
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    t0rt0ise
    • #8
    • 19th Dec 11, 9:25 PM
    • #8
    • 19th Dec 11, 9:25 PM
    True, but whilst any benefit is to be welcomed, in money-saving terms it does not seem very significant.... members get a point for every pound spent.. for the past two years a point has been worth 1.5 pence which can be taken only in vouchers or shares. In effect it's a non-cash discount of 1.5%
    Originally posted by MichaelNW
    That is not so. I'm a member of the co-op and get cash from them twice a year.

    They estimate that I would get about 30 quid a year if I took gas and electric from them. Still doesn't make them the cheapest for me but the question asked was what do members get.. the answer is.. cash.

    Edit: I see where the mistake has arisen. It's not shares, it's a share account which is like a building society account where you get a pass book and so on.
    Last edited by t0rt0ise; 19-12-2011 at 9:56 PM.
    • t0rt0ise
    • By t0rt0ise 19th Dec 11, 9:29 PM
    • 3,178 Posts
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    t0rt0ise
    • #9
    • 19th Dec 11, 9:29 PM
    • #9
    • 19th Dec 11, 9:29 PM
    Whilst I welcome the Co-Op into the awful mess that is the G&E industry at present, I do note that for all their talk of fairness and no gimmicks, they do seem keen on giving new customers a cash incentive to join. I would respectfully ask you to think who may be paying for this marketing 'gimmick'. Got it. Is that really the point of a co-op?
    Originally posted by MillicentBystander
    What gimmick? They've lowered their prices. That seems to me to be well in the spirit of a co-operative.
    • MillicentBystander
    • By MillicentBystander 19th Dec 11, 10:07 PM
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    MillicentBystander
    What gimmick? They've lowered their prices. That seems to me to be well in the spirit of a co-operative.
    Originally posted by t0rt0ise

    Of course and i agree with you on that. But they often offer financial, cash incentives to attract new customers. This incentive MUST at least in the most part be borne by their existing customers. That is in no way acting in the spirit of a true co-operative. That is acting like the Big 6.
    Last edited by MillicentBystander; 19-12-2011 at 10:10 PM.
  • MichaelNW
    They estimate that I would get about 30 quid a year if I took gas and electric from them. Still doesn't make them the cheapest for me but the question asked was what do members get.. the answer is.. cash.
    Originally posted by t0rt0ise
    The question was how Co-Op members actually benefit ... you're a member of the Co-Op, but will you be signing up for their energy?
    • Mr_Crunch
    • By Mr_Crunch 20th Dec 11, 1:09 AM
    • 97 Posts
    • 56 Thanks
    Mr_Crunch
    Co-op Energy's price tariffs are bonkers. I signed up on the v2.1 tariff West Midlands. I had a price increase w.e.f. 3 Nov, which meant that electricity was increased to 10.83p per kwh and Gas was 3.75p per kwh. Ok, I did my sums and it was just about ok.

    Now the v2.1 tariff is showing that w.e.f. 1 Feb electricity will be 11.49p although gas will be the same at 3.75p. That is a price increase of 6% on electricity and no change on gas. Just trying to work out by what stretch of the imagination that equates to a 3% decrease! And I have yet to receive notice of such a price increase!!

    At least they now provide the old prices on each tariff version so that one can keep track of changes - prevously they were overwritten so unless you had downloaded and retained copies of the previous tariffs it was impossible to know what was going on.

    Fred Karno's Army reincarnated. A complete shambles.
    Last edited by Mr_Crunch; 20-12-2011 at 4:41 PM.
  • meggsy
    Why not just keep the email they send out - i.e.,
    my email of end September advised my increase would be
    from 11.76 to 13.49 and 3.20 to 3.87 and I now expect to receive an email giving new rates of 12.92 and 3.77 according to their website for the South West area. I signed up on 21st July.
    Last edited by meggsy; 20-12-2011 at 7:27 PM.
    • callum9999
    • By callum9999 20th Dec 11, 9:44 PM
    • 3,950 Posts
    • 2,408 Thanks
    callum9999
    Of course and i agree with you on that. But they often offer financial, cash incentives to attract new customers. This incentive MUST at least in the most part be borne by their existing customers. That is in no way acting in the spirit of a true co-operative. That is acting like the Big 6.
    Originally posted by MillicentBystander
    How is that at all "not in the spirit" of a co-operative? I take it BOGOFs at CO-OP supermarkets are the same then? There is nothing anti-cooperative about it, it attracts new customers making the cooperative stronger and more profitable - and therefore giving more back.
    • Mr_Crunch
    • By Mr_Crunch 20th Dec 11, 9:48 PM
    • 97 Posts
    • 56 Thanks
    Mr_Crunch
    Why not just keep the email they send out - i.e.,
    my email of end September advised my increase would be
    from 11.76 to 13.49 and 3.20 to 3.87 and I now expect to receive an email giving new rates of 12.92 and 3.77 according to their website for the South West area. I signed up on 21st July.
    Originally posted by meggsy
    Why not just keep the email they send out? Because they did not send me a price increase email at all. I found out about the November increase only when they requested a meter reading, referring to an earlier price increase notification email which they never sent. It didn't end up in spam, either, because I check that daily.

    The issue here is that the Co-op have sent out press releases bragging about a 3% decrease for 'most customers'; which says that the decrease won't apply to earlier sign-ups; but they fail to mention that those earlier sign-ups will actually have a price increase on 1 Feb; and the media has swallowed those press releases hook line and sinker on the basis that the little guy is reducing prices. And so far I have not had any communication from them that my tariff will increase on 1 Feb - I only found out by looking at the price lists, which had been changed. What they are doing is levelling all their tariffs, having attracted people in.

    Why are people so tolerant of behaviour which in reality is reminiscent of that of the Big 6, but which is cloaked in the rhetoric of so-called fairness and competitiveness?

    The dividend is worth peanuts, the concept of mutuality is appealing but meaningless, and if the Coop are not competitive after Feb 1 then if I can find a fixed price tariff which is worthwhile then I will switch to it because life is too short to keep wasting time in this dysfunctional energy 'market'.
  • jack spratt
    the concept of mutuality is appealing but meaningless,
    Tell that to the local communities who have benefit to the tune of 3.2 million in donations last year alone from the local communities fund !
    • Mr_Crunch
    • By Mr_Crunch 21st Dec 11, 9:02 AM
    • 97 Posts
    • 56 Thanks
    Mr_Crunch
    Tell that to the local communities who have benefit to the tune of 3.2 million in donations last year alone from the local communities fund !
    Originally posted by jack spratt
    the concept of mutuality is appealing but meaningless, obviously in the context of energy supply. Why take the comment out of context??
  • jack spratt
    I presume you are with Co-op Energy why do you stay with them ? I believe they do not charge an exit fee for leaving like most other energy providers .

    I would think you and other customers compared prices at the time of there switch maybe you did not and as I have pointed out you are free to leave if you believe that the co-operative energy does not meet your needs or do not like its trading principles ??
    • Mr_Crunch
    • By Mr_Crunch 21st Dec 11, 9:38 AM
    • 97 Posts
    • 56 Thanks
    Mr_Crunch
    I presume you are with Co-op Energy why do you stay with them ? I believe they do not charge an exit fee for leaving like most other energy providers .

    I would think you and other customers compared prices at the time of there switch maybe you did not and as I have pointed out you are free to leave if you believe that the co-operative energy does not meet your needs or do not like its trading principles ??
    Originally posted by jack spratt
    And I will leave them in February if there are other deals which are more competitive in the round, which is rather sad because I am actually a member of the Co-op, my wife's father worked for them for years, and mutuality is, as I said, appealing. But their shenanigans in the energy market makes them little different to the others.

    What I cannot abide is partial publicity, implying that prices will go down or not be affected, when in reality according to the tariff lists they are going up by 6% in my case for electricity - and they have not actually told me that yet, either!
    • kar999
    • By kar999 21st Dec 11, 4:24 PM
    • 639 Posts
    • 247 Thanks
    kar999
    Co-op Energy's price tariffs are bonkers. I signed up on the v2.1 tariff West Midlands. I had a price increase w.e.f. 3 Nov, which meant that electricity was increased to 10.83p per kwh and Gas was 3.75p per kwh. Ok, I did my sums and it was just about ok.

    Now the v2.1 tariff is showing that w.e.f. 1 Feb electricity will be 11.49p although gas will be the same at 3.75p. That is a price increase of 6% on electricity and no change on gas. .
    Originally posted by Mr_Crunch
    Isn't V2.1 post Feb 2012 Region 14 electrictiy exactly the same at 10.83?

    (some other regions showing decreases)

    http://www.cooperativeenergy.coop/assets/documents/price-list-v2.1.pdf
    If the ball had gone in the net it would have been a goal.
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