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    • Former MSE Helen
    • By Former MSE Helen 7th Nov 11, 8:36 AM
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    Former MSE Helen
    MSE News: Halifax: House prices up in October
    • #1
    • 7th Nov 11, 8:36 AM
    MSE News: Halifax: House prices up in October 7th Nov 11 at 8:36 AM
    This is the discussion thread for the following MSE News Story:

    "House prices rose by 1.2% last month as the property market continues to weather the economic storm ..."

    Read the full story:

    Halifax: House prices up in October






    This thread is not in the 'discuss house prices and economy board' as that is only open to those logged into the forum so anyone coming from the news story may not be able to see it.

Page 1
    • brit1234
    • By brit1234 7th Nov 11, 8:55 AM
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    brit1234
    • #2
    • 7th Nov 11, 8:55 AM
    • #2
    • 7th Nov 11, 8:55 AM
    That's a bit of a bummer but corresponds with Nationwide figures. With the delay these figures relate to the summer month holidays. This is usually a quiet time for sales. It may have been distorted by the increase in buy to let entering the market again from what I have heard from estate agents.

    However house prices are extremely overvalued and are certain to continue falling to a more sustainable level. The economic situation is bad and is likely to get worse, the housing bubble will continue to deflate.

    Every time we have a big rise in these down turns Halifax figures usually follow with a massive fall.

    Will update sig shortly.
    Scams - Shared Equity, Shared Ownership, Newbuy, Firstbuy and Help to Buy.

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    • ognum
    • By ognum 7th Nov 11, 9:09 AM
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    ognum
    • #3
    • 7th Nov 11, 9:09 AM
    • #3
    • 7th Nov 11, 9:09 AM
    That's a bit of a bummer but corresponds with Nationwide figures. With the delay these figures relate to the summer month holidays. This is usually a quiet time for sales. It may have been distorted by the increase in buy to let entering the market again from what I have heard from estate agents.

    However house prices are extremely overvalued and are certain to continue falling to a more sustainable level. The economic situation is bad and is likely to get worse, the housing bubble will continue to deflate.

    Every time we have a big rise in these down turns Halifax figures usually follow with a massive fall.


    Will update sig shortly.
    Originally posted by brit1234
    From what I can see you are right about the buy to let purchases and around me there seems a flight to tangible assetts like houses from people who do not require mortgages There is a feeling of better money in bricks losing value than in the bank losing value

    Just what I see and feel
  • rickbonar
    • #4
    • 7th Nov 11, 11:35 AM
    • #4
    • 7th Nov 11, 11:35 AM
    At one time (not so long ago) property speculators could fill up their buy 2 lets with asylum seekers fresh out of Somalia or Afghanistan or Wales or Texas USA with large families and for a massive rent and the housing benefits and social security office would pay up to £2000 a week. And the times were good for such landlords.
    Though having watched saints and scroungers on the TV realise that the "Landlord" was in often in cahoots with the tenants and it is very much an elaborate scheme to legally milk the welfare system and remain within the boundaries of law.

    OK now although there is still scope to make on a lesser system as above it presumably has been scaled back by the government restrictions on rent benefit payments.
    However I haven't read any more info on whether this has happened or whether it affects new applicants only or whether people already getting the £2000 a week have been booted off or are still getting this.

    I suppose if you've got the money then it may be a better return than if it's in the bank or building society.

    I'll bet Halifax will be bringing the champagne & bunting to celebrate the Massive return to house price rises this month.
    • Dan:
    • By Dan: 7th Nov 11, 11:46 AM
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    Dan:
    • #5
    • 7th Nov 11, 11:46 AM
    • #5
    • 7th Nov 11, 11:46 AM
    That's a bit of a bummer
    Originally posted by brit1234
    indeed.

    I have followed your prediction history for the last 4 years and i think you safely win the award for being the most far-out .

    • neas
    • By neas 7th Nov 11, 2:19 PM
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    neas
    • #6
    • 7th Nov 11, 2:19 PM
    • #6
    • 7th Nov 11, 2:19 PM
    indeed.

    I have followed your prediction history for the last 4 years and i think you safely win the award for being the most far-out .
    Originally posted by Dan:
    blinded i think would be the term lol.

    Let him wait another 4 years and maybe he will call it rightr one day.
    • HAMISH_MCTAVISH
    • By HAMISH_MCTAVISH 7th Nov 11, 4:48 PM
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    HAMISH_MCTAVISH
    • #7
    • 7th Nov 11, 4:48 PM
    • #7
    • 7th Nov 11, 4:48 PM
    Let him wait another 4 years and maybe he will call it rightr one day.
    Originally posted by neas
    Doubtful. He's not got it right once yet..... His 50% off by Xmas 2009 prediction is legendary.

    Anyway, back to topic.

    The Nationwide index is now positive Year on Year. The Halifax Year on Year decline has halved in the last couple of months and is heading the same way. Only a matter of time til Land Registry catches up and goes positive.

    There's now a reasonable prospect that this year will end up with prices flat or slightly positive on average. Similar to last year, and after the big gains of 2009.

    In the meantime of course, rents have soared to new record highs and other than the usual couple of months of decline mid winter, there's no sign of this slowing any time soon.

    And mortgage holders continue to take advantage of record low interest rates, saving themselves a fortune and cutting years off the mortgage.

    The financial losses for renters (versus buying) since 2009 are now getting very large indeed..... On average of course.

    And eve those who bought at absolute peak in 2007 have now broken even or gone positive versus renting, on average.

    It very much looks like the last few years and the next few as well will turn out to be one of the best times in history to buy a house with a mortgage, and one of the worst to rent.
    “The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie – deliberate, contrived, and dishonest – but the myth, persistent, persuasive, and unrealistic.

    Belief in myths allows the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought.”
    -- President John F. Kennedy”
    • MiserlyMartin
    • By MiserlyMartin 8th Nov 11, 3:08 PM
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    MiserlyMartin
    • #8
    • 8th Nov 11, 3:08 PM
    • #8
    • 8th Nov 11, 3:08 PM

    It very much looks like the last few years and the next few as well will turn out to be one of the best times in history to buy a house with a mortgage, and one of the worst to rent.
    Originally posted by HAMISH_MCTAVISH
    Nothing could be further from the truth. Still desperately ramping eh Hamish?
    • HAMISH_MCTAVISH
    • By HAMISH_MCTAVISH 8th Nov 11, 10:09 PM
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    HAMISH_MCTAVISH
    • #9
    • 8th Nov 11, 10:09 PM
    • #9
    • 8th Nov 11, 10:09 PM
    Nothing could be further from the truth.
    Originally posted by MiserlyMartin


    It's quite clear to everyone.

    This is the best time in history to have a mortgage.

    The savings from low rates and the low margins available to pre-crash buyers have now exceeded the fall in house prices, on average.

    Furthermore rents have soared to new record highs, making the decision to delay purchase quite foolish in the majority of areas.

    Still desperately ramping eh Hamish?
    Still desperately looking for the crash that ended 2 years ago, eh Martin.
    “The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie – deliberate, contrived, and dishonest – but the myth, persistent, persuasive, and unrealistic.

    Belief in myths allows the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought.”
    -- President John F. Kennedy”
    • brit1234
    • By brit1234 8th Nov 11, 11:19 PM
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    brit1234
    Nothing could be further from the truth. Still desperately ramping eh Hamish?
    Originally posted by MiserlyMartin
    He is getting more and more desperate since we have had another set of year on year figures with negative house prices. He keeps seizing on any figure to prove his theory of limitless house price rises an then ignores them the next month when they are negative.

    He just can't understand the economics of it and forced onto here as he has been banned from other forums.

    You have to feel sorry for him as desperate ramping and Homes under the hammer is all he has got left.

    Scams - Shared Equity, Shared Ownership, Newbuy, Firstbuy and Help to Buy.

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    • HAMISH_MCTAVISH
    • By HAMISH_MCTAVISH 9th Nov 11, 7:45 AM
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    HAMISH_MCTAVISH
    more and more desperate
    Originally posted by brit1234
    Heh heh, obviously not as desperate as someone who predicted 50% off prices by Xmas 2009, only to see both prices and rents soar since then.


    another set of year on year figures with negative house prices.
    Halifax is slightly negative year on year. Nationwide is slightly positive year on year.

    However in both cases, and when combined with ultra-low mortgage rates and soaring rents, homeowners are continuing to make out like a bandit compared to renters.

    theory of limitless house price rises
    No such thing.

    The house price cycle continues just like it always has. What you fail to grasp is that you've just had a crash bigger than the 90's, and the crash is over. This is the "bump along the bottom" phase.

    Prices will rise soon enough.

    the economics of it
    Are those the same economics that you understand so well they inspired you to put a "50% falls by Xmas 2009" claim in your sig?



    Or the same economics that have inspired you to claim rents would fall as they soared to new highs?



    feel sorry for him .
    Good heavens no Brit, save your pity for anyone daft enough to have followed your advise.

    They're the ones who are in trouble now, sadly.
    “The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie – deliberate, contrived, and dishonest – but the myth, persistent, persuasive, and unrealistic.

    Belief in myths allows the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought.”
    -- President John F. Kennedy”
    • neas
    • By neas 9th Nov 11, 11:33 AM
    • 3,673 Posts
    • 9,814 Thanks
    neas
    He is getting more and more desperate since we have had another set of year on year figures with negative house prices. He keeps seizing on any figure to prove his theory of limitless house price rises an then ignores them the next month when they are negative.

    He just can't understand the economics of it and forced onto here as he has been banned from other forums.

    You have to feel sorry for him as desperate ramping and Homes under the hammer is all he has got left.

    Originally posted by brit1234

    Brit... the data clearly shows a stagnate market... whether said market will rise or fall in the next 5 years... who knows but the fact we have low interest rates and an increasing population.... is an indicator of HPI... and the economic situation is a plus for HPC... they are balancing one another out at the moment.

    I feel sorry for you mate and Hamish.. your both the ying and Yang of house price crach/inflation stupidity. Just look at the data unbiased... Overally inflation will return things for people to get on market easier...

    The system as it stands is funny... BTLers are maintained through individuals like you brit.. renting.. paying their mortgages for them.. as there are X amount of people and only Y amount of houses whether some of X people rent some of Y houses and some of X own some of Y houses... people still need roof over their head.

    Glad i didnt listen to either of your predictions and just bought in July 2010, 1 year 4 months of enjoyment of my home... Kitchen done, bedroom skimmed, baby on the way.. Basically i moved on with my life... providing a safe home for my family.

    1 year turned to 2, 2 to 3, and now 3 to 4, soon it will be 4 to 5 years. 5 years is the length of fix most people take on mortgage.. long time to wait innit gov?
    • MiserlyMartin
    • By MiserlyMartin 10th Nov 11, 8:04 PM
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    MiserlyMartin


    It's quite clear to everyone.

    This is the best time in history to have a mortgage.

    The savings from low rates and the low margins available to pre-crash buyers have now exceeded the fall in house prices, on average.

    Furthermore rents have soared to new record highs, making the decision to delay purchase quite foolish in the majority of areas.



    Still desperately looking for the crash that ended 2 years ago, eh Martin.
    Originally posted by HAMISH_MCTAVISH
    Personally I have been a homeowner since the 90's so have no bias in looking for a cheap home. (They were reasonably priced then) You however, are a buy to let speculator in it for your own personal gain, coming on here trying to talk the market up and gloating about how expensive houses are and how expensive rents are. Wishing misery to the have nots. Its people like you who have priced out todays FTBs and caused many of the problems that lead to the 2007 crash, which is still playing out now and has only partly corrected house prices through zero base rates. But, as is with happening with the Eurozone debt problems, this can only be disguised and delayed for so long, eventually the market will return to fair value, but probably made far worse a crash than it needed to be by mega propping up.

    You my friend are deluded - even with the props, housing is still falling in nominal terms and far more when inflation is taken into consideration. More again when priced in anything but the UK £.

    There is only one way for UK house prices, the quicker it gets there is all the better for the suffering teens to 20 somethings who have a pretty bleak future ahead economically and financially.
    Last edited by MiserlyMartin; 10-11-2011 at 8:09 PM.
    • pinkshoes
    • By pinkshoes 10th Nov 11, 8:54 PM
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    pinkshoes
    I very much doubt house prices are going to rise or fall much over the next 5 years, so I'd say now is an excellent time to buy given the excellent deals on mortgages!
    Should've = Should HAVE (not 'of')
    Would've = Would HAVE (not 'of')

    No, I am not perfect, but yes I do judge people on their use of basic English language. If you didn't know the above, then learn it! (If English is your second language, then you are forgiven!)
    • HAMISH_MCTAVISH
    • By HAMISH_MCTAVISH 10th Nov 11, 9:46 PM
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    HAMISH_MCTAVISH
    You however, are a buy to let speculator
    Originally posted by MiserlyMartin
    False.

    I don't own any BTL, and never have.

    housing is still falling in nominal terms
    False again.

    House prices rose last month on both Nationwide and Halifax.

    Nationwide has also now gone year on year positive.


    far more when inflation is taken into consideration. More again when priced in anything but the UK £.
    And yet, still cheaper than renting, even including the falls in price.

    There is only one way for UK house prices,.
    True.

    A period of minor fluctuations as we bump along the bottom, followed by the next boom and then the next bust as the cycle repeats like it always does.
    “The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie – deliberate, contrived, and dishonest – but the myth, persistent, persuasive, and unrealistic.

    Belief in myths allows the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought.”
    -- President John F. Kennedy”
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