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  • FIRST POST
    • MSE Guy
    • By MSE Guy 17th Feb 11, 5:05 PM
    • 1,628Posts
    • 1,255Thanks
    MSE Guy
    MSE News: Treasury sets out new financial watchdog powers
    • #1
    • 17th Feb 11, 5:05 PM
    MSE News: Treasury sets out new financial watchdog powers 17th Feb 11 at 5:05 PM
    This is the discussion thread for the following MSE News Story:

    "Plans to overhaul the regulation structure were revealed today, in a bid to prevent another crisis ..."

Page 1
    • VT82
    • By VT82 17th Feb 11, 5:44 PM
    • 1,038 Posts
    • 877 Thanks
    VT82
    • #2
    • 17th Feb 11, 5:44 PM
    • #2
    • 17th Feb 11, 5:44 PM
    "We now must all hope that by shortening the name, consumer protection doesn't end up in the gutter."
    Originally posted by MSE Dan

    How to ruin an otherwise sound and newsworthy article with a petulant remark. Inflammatory, pessimistic, and most of all, bizarrely illogical.
    Last edited by VT82; 17-02-2011 at 5:51 PM.
    • SnowMan
    • By SnowMan 17th Feb 11, 7:50 PM
    • 3,182 Posts
    • 5,923 Thanks
    SnowMan
    • #3
    • 17th Feb 11, 7:50 PM
    • #3
    • 17th Feb 11, 7:50 PM
    All good stuff for those who are acronymically minded.

    The article didn't mention that FCA were also a Danish football club (FC Amager) which declared themselves bankrupt in 2009.

    On the subject of failure let's hope that FCA doesn't end up standing for Failing Consumers Again.
    I came, I saw, I melted
  • jambosans
    • #4
    • 17th Feb 11, 8:28 PM
    • #4
    • 17th Feb 11, 8:28 PM
    This was highlighted during the depths of the financial crisis in 2007 and 2008, which resulted in the part-nationalisation of two of the largest banks in the world, RBS and HBOS, and the complete nationalisation of Northern Rock.
    by Helen Knapman
    RBS yes, HBOS not really. According to the below article, HBOS was 18th by assets and market value:-
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2009/mar/25/banking-g20#

    I'm being pedantic, I know, but it's a news article, so I expect MSE to get the fundamentals right.
    Anything I post is my opinion, so from time to time I may be wrong. I try to provide answers based in fact, however I don't know everything, so (like all posters on MSE), take what I say with a pinch of salt.
    • Joe_Bloggs
    • By Joe_Bloggs 17th Feb 11, 11:43 PM
    • 4,485 Posts
    • 1,582 Thanks
    Joe_Bloggs
    • #5
    • 17th Feb 11, 11:43 PM
    • #5
    • 17th Feb 11, 11:43 PM
    FPC PRA FCA
    under which cup is the pea ?
    Perhaps you guessed right but now!
    FCA FCP PRA
    under which cup is the pea ?
    Ans: It is an ancient scam.
    The pea will be elsewhere.

    What does the pea represent ?
    Why do we chase it when we know it is a con?

    J_B.
  • Former MSE Dan
    • #6
    • 18th Feb 11, 9:28 AM
    • #6
    • 18th Feb 11, 9:28 AM
    How to ruin an otherwise sound and newsworthy article with a petulant remark. Inflammatory, pessimistic, and most of all, bizarrely illogical.
    Originally posted by VT82
    Hi VT82,

    I'm not sure how the remark is any of those things - a body to help consumers, called "Consumer Protection....." stands a much greater chance of doing its job, in my opinion.

    FCA gives no indication to the man on the street that it is on his side, and may not focus the minds of those who work there on 'consumer protection' (which, for me, should also be their primary objective)

    Thanks for comments though

    Dan
  • jambosans
    • #7
    • 18th Feb 11, 9:52 AM
    • #7
    • 18th Feb 11, 9:52 AM
    I'm not sure how the remark is any of those things - a body to help consumers, called "Consumer Protection....." stands a much greater chance of doing its job, in my opinion.

    FCA gives no indication to the man on the street that it is on his side, and may not focus the minds of those who work there on 'consumer protection' (which, for me, should also be their primary objective)
    Originally posted by MSE Dan
    What an odd thing to say. I would give a little more credit to those who work for the Bank of England that they understand their job role beyond the organisations title.

    Perhaps we should rename First ScotRail, Trains That Run With A Wee Bit Of Snow On The Tracks, in the hope it will focus the minds of those who work there.

    Or, perhaps, we should not get caught up in the superficial irrelevancies of an organisation, and judge them by what they do, not what they are called.
    Anything I post is my opinion, so from time to time I may be wrong. I try to provide answers based in fact, however I don't know everything, so (like all posters on MSE), take what I say with a pinch of salt.
  • Former MSE Dan
    • #8
    • 18th Feb 11, 10:51 AM
    • #8
    • 18th Feb 11, 10:51 AM
    Or, perhaps, we should not get caught up in the superficial irrelevancies of an organisation, and judge them by what they do, not what they are called.
    Originally posted by jambosans
    Yep I totally agree with that, and really hope they do a grand job.

    However, I see no logic in, having already chosen a working title that did include Consumer Protection, then getting rid of it at this stage - would actually love to hear the reasoning

    Dan
    • Alpine Star
    • By Alpine Star 18th Feb 11, 11:38 AM
    • 1,259 Posts
    • 611 Thanks
    Alpine Star
    • #9
    • 18th Feb 11, 11:38 AM
    • #9
    • 18th Feb 11, 11:38 AM
    Yep I totally agree with that, and really hope they do a grand job.

    However, I see no logic in, having already chosen a working title that did include Consumer Protection, then getting rid of it at this stage - would actually love to hear the reasoning

    Dan
    Originally posted by MSE Dan


    ''The government decided to rename the Consumer Protection and Markets Authority the Financial Conduct Authority to emphasise the new focus on the way banks, brokers and individuals behave.
    “This is a conduct body. Whether you are buying an insurance policy from a high street broker or you are trading high finance, the FCA is your conduct regulator,” Mr Hoban said. “It does what it says on the tin.”



    FT.com / Markets - Sharper teeth for financial watchdogs

    In my view the decision to drop 'consumer' from the title makes it less likely that consumers will actually know that the organisation is a body set up in their interest.

    I can only hope that the inclusion of the word 'conduct' will reflect the growing calls for a regulator with a more interventionist and pro-active approach.
    • SnowMan
    • By SnowMan 18th Feb 11, 2:09 PM
    • 3,182 Posts
    • 5,923 Thanks
    SnowMan
    ...However, I see no logic in, having already chosen a working title that did include Consumer Protection, then getting rid of it at this stage...
    Originally posted by MSE Dan
    Just received the weekly newsletter from Paul Lewis (the Radio 4 Moneybox presenter). He makes a similar point about the name change which I quote below

    I am slightly less pleased that the word ‘consumer’ is no longer in the FCA’s title and that consumers are kept as the third out of four tasks of the FCA (the same place consumers now occupy in the list of the FSA’s objectives). Ahead of consumers are enhancing confidence in the UK financial system and facilitating efficiency and choice in services............

    For those interested the full proposal document can be accessed via the HM Treasury website at

    http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/d/consult_newfinancial_regulation170211.pdf
    Last edited by SnowMan; 19-02-2011 at 10:00 PM.
    I came, I saw, I melted
    • Joe_Bloggs
    • By Joe_Bloggs 19th Feb 11, 7:56 PM
    • 4,485 Posts
    • 1,582 Thanks
    Joe_Bloggs
    @Snowman
    Why did the document have £20.75 printed on the first page ?
    • peterbaker
    • By peterbaker 20th Feb 11, 11:01 AM
    • 2,429 Posts
    • 1,076 Thanks
    peterbaker
    Dan's article and this thread fill me with mirth and dread in turns.

    I am old enough to remember IMRO LAUTRO and P-something, big bangs, little fizzes, GISC, IBRC, ABI, BIBA->BIIBA, Lloyd's Correspondents Department (now that's a long one and they were correspondingly fierce!), Lloyd's regulating itself, Lloyd's and London Insurance Markets taking a break from all this regulation malarky 10 years ago and sitting on the back garden fence whilst GISC knocked on the front door, Insurance Ombudsmen, Banking Ombudsmen, BBA's Angela Knight as a tasty looking bird, and fair play.

    How times have changed (well some have not!).

    I suspect Dan may have seen a lot of water under the bridge too.

    His comment "We now must all hope that by shortening the name, consumer protection doesn't end up in the gutter." is actually pretty astute ... after all is said and done, what is in a name? (And what most pointedly now is not?).

    PS That part about AK is pure fantasy and I think part concocted from reminiscensces of those halcyon days when Ronald Reagan was reputed to have quite fancied Margaret Thatcher

    PPS Reading Snowman's observation that FCA once stood for FC Amager who were a bankrupted Danish Football Club makes me shiver a bit as just two weeks or so ago a bank of the same name (Amager) also went bust. There's actually nothing new under the sun, eh?
    Last edited by peterbaker; 20-02-2011 at 11:12 AM.
  • harryhound
    Well at least we seem to have the BoE back in charge and a proposed structure something like I was advocating back in the gathering storm following the Northern Rock collapse.

    Remember the 1970's secondary banks life boat ? Organised by locking the chairmen & chief executives in the basement of the BoE until they signed on the dotted line late on a Friday night?

    Come to think of it that property collapse was triggered by unexpected changes in the oil supply - Keep an eye on the "Middle East".
    Those were the days when casino banks were called "Merchant Banks" and had a reputation for knowing what they were doing.
    The secondary banks, fronted by the likes of Jeremy Thorpe, grew up in an inflationary economy, where fortunes could be made getting change of use on existing buildings/sites financed by borrowed money. The iconic example was the deliberately empty "Centre Point" sky scraper office development.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centre_Point

    I think there are a few too many parallels with today's situation - just put "Jeremy Thorpe" bank into Google and you will see what I mean.
    • stevepett
    • By stevepett 23rd Feb 11, 4:15 PM
    • 78 Posts
    • 29 Thanks
    stevepett
    Is there any chance that the new, no doubt more expensive, Regulators will lead from the front, not merely blame everyone else for their and their predecessors failings and deceits?
    Will they, unlike the FSA, have the countries best interests at heart, not their own empire building? After all, it hardly makes sense to replace over 250,000 lost financial advisers with civil servants, but that is the FSAs second best achievement (well, they have done the first part successfully, and are working on replacing them.)
    Their greatest achievement (with their predecessors) was being the greatest financial disaster ever for the UK, no mean achievement in 20 short years. They screwed up the economy, messed up with Equitable Life, Pension Transfers, cut the value of endowments by 30% single handed, lied to consumers and advisers alike.
    Maybe the new lot will be an improvement, but I suspect it will be the same staff misguided by the same doctrinaire and ignorant senior staff who despise the industry and will only interact with the rich and powerful where job prospects are potentially on offer.

    Not that I am cynical (or a financial advise)!
    • Milarky
    • By Milarky 23rd Feb 11, 6:19 PM
    • 6,290 Posts
    • 2,209 Thanks
    Milarky
    They.. cut the value of endowments by 30% single handed
    Originally posted by stevepett
    How'd they do that one - are you referring to the time the FSA ''didn't'' make Standard Life dump their shares in early 2004 ['Operation Jasmine']?
    .....under construction....
  • harryhound
    Steve is a will writer if I remember the "monica" correctly?

    I think in some ways we are suffering from a mixture of too little regulation and too much.
    The sheeple need massive protection so they cannot flood MP's surgeries complaining about being greedy and then being ripped off.
    Meanwhile the casino banks were though to be able to look after themselves and the regulations were removed.
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