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  • FIRST POST
    • MSE Guy
    • By MSE Guy 12th Oct 10, 10:44 AM
    • 1,628Posts
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    MSE Guy
    MSE News: University fees could rocket after funding review
    • #1
    • 12th Oct 10, 10:44 AM
    MSE News: University fees could rocket after funding review 12th Oct 10 at 10:44 AM
    This is the discussion thread for the following MSE News Story:

    "Students could be forced to pay thousands of pounds more, with the prospect institutions could charge 12,000 a year ..."

Page 1
  • farso
    • #2
    • 12th Oct 10, 11:19 AM
    • #2
    • 12th Oct 10, 11:19 AM
    Worrying news for students. All the articles I have read have looked at the way it will change lives for prospective students, does anyone know what will change to the current students? Will our fees increase for next year? Will our repayments for student loans be affected? (Despite of our current agreement for the loan)

    It would be good to know what these plans mean if they come into law.

    Many thanks
    • neas
    • By neas 12th Oct 10, 11:29 AM
    • 3,673 Posts
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    neas
    • #3
    • 12th Oct 10, 11:29 AM
    • #3
    • 12th Oct 10, 11:29 AM
    As an ex studetn with approx 12k student loan on graduation this seems horrible. I believe it is unfair that students get saddles with this debt... yet when they start to earn the big bucks from this HUGE risk that they have to shoulder.... they have to pay more tax than rest of country.... and their student loan repayments...

    SOunds like a double whammy to me
    • Dylanwing
    • By Dylanwing 12th Oct 10, 11:33 AM
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    Dylanwing
    • #4
    • 12th Oct 10, 11:33 AM
    • #4
    • 12th Oct 10, 11:33 AM
    What it means-
    The rich kids will still go to Uni.
    The poor kids won't.
    A lot of bright kids won't want to go and be saddled with debt.
    The UK will miss out on a lot of intellectual capital.
    A lot of graduates will move overseas to avoid taxes and repayments.
    A lot of graduates will be saddled with far too much debt creating problems with loans/ mortgages.
    Owning property will be restricted to the rich.
    Once loans are 30 years old, the Government will have a huge problem with unpaid student debt.
    So in brief, an absolutely ludicrous plan, bad for the majority, bad for the UK, but at least the rich can keep the top jobs for themselves, without having to compete with a far more intelligent oik.
    • Lokolo
    • By Lokolo 12th Oct 10, 11:36 AM
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    Lokolo
    • #5
    • 12th Oct 10, 11:36 AM
    • #5
    • 12th Oct 10, 11:36 AM
    I don't think it would stop the poor from going to uni, as the loans (and assumingly grants) would still be available. I just think it would slow the number of graduates.
    • sarahs999
    • By sarahs999 12th Oct 10, 11:39 AM
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    sarahs999
    • #6
    • 12th Oct 10, 11:39 AM
    • #6
    • 12th Oct 10, 11:39 AM
    It will also mean that the less vocational courses die a death. Education should be about learning for learning's sake, not just to set you up for a particular career. I studied philosophy at uni and it is a hugely important and valuable discipline, but as it doesn't lead automatically to a job I would have never chosen to do it if I thought I would have to pay off 36,000 at the end, as I don't come from a rich family. Nor am interested in a high-paying job (I work in the media!) so I would be saddled paying off the debt for the rest of my life.

    So incredibly sad to think our children won't have the same choices. Education should be the backbone of a country.
    Debt cleared! 13,128 0!!!
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    • worried jim
    • By worried jim 12th Oct 10, 11:44 AM
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    worried jim
    • #7
    • 12th Oct 10, 11:44 AM
    • #7
    • 12th Oct 10, 11:44 AM
    Maybe rather than going to university to study sports psychology or media they could go to a technical college and train as a plumber then we wouldn't need to import 1000's of Polish workers because the UK workforce was qualified and fit for task. If we have to start importing sports psychologists form Poland in the future I'll change my opinion.
    "Only two things are infinite-the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not so sure about the universe"
    Albert Einstein
    • malc_b
    • By malc_b 12th Oct 10, 11:52 AM
    • 1,018 Posts
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    malc_b
    • #8
    • 12th Oct 10, 11:52 AM
    • #8
    • 12th Oct 10, 11:52 AM
    A lot of graduates will move overseas to avoid taxes and repayments.
    Originally posted by Dylanwing
    On the current system they chase you if you move aboard so I don't think a new system would have such a loop hole. Of course, what the rules are and what happens in practice might be 2 different animals but I know the get pretty shirty straight off the bat and SLC have more powers than HMRC.
  • pig_let_cool
    • #9
    • 12th Oct 10, 2:59 PM
    • #9
    • 12th Oct 10, 2:59 PM
    Maybe rather than going to university to study sports psychology or media they could go to a technical college and train as a plumber then we wouldn't need to import 1000's of Polish workers because the UK workforce was qualified and fit for task. If we have to start importing sports psychologists form Poland in the future I'll change my opinion.
    Originally posted by worried jim
    So instead of doing what you want to do we should all give up and work as plumbers just because the country needs it?!

    Can i ask what you do? doubting your just working as a plumber.




    I as the first response said, would like to know where current students stand on this, and when this is likely to take effect etc whilst it is terrible for prospective students im much more concerned with my own immediate financial future....
    The Money Saving Wannabe

  • oompahloompah
    I've also been looking to see when any changes will come into affect as I have 3 DSs, the eldest going to Uni in 2011, then the next in 2013 and finally the youngest in 2015, but can find nothing setting a date. All my children will need university degrees for their chosen occupations, so there is no avoiding it. It would also be handy to know what is happening in Scotland, where students do not currently repay tuition fees, but AFAIK this isn't even at the discussion stage yet!


    • olly300
    • By olly300 12th Oct 10, 4:27 PM
    • 14,312 Posts
    • 13,632 Thanks
    olly300
    Maybe rather than going to university to study sports psychology or media they could go to a technical college and train as a plumber then we wouldn't need to import 1000's of Polish workers because the UK workforce was qualified and fit for task. If we have to start importing sports psychologists form Poland in the future I'll change my opinion.
    Originally posted by worried jim
    What technical colleges?

    Also there are times when courses like plumbing are full. Why? Because of the number of adults who had office jobs retraining.
    I'm not cynical I'm realistic

    (If a link I give opens pop ups I won't know I don't use windows)
    • Stryder
    • By Stryder 12th Oct 10, 9:31 PM
    • 1,057 Posts
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    Stryder
    Money saving hint....

    Don't go to University ...

    Clegg went to Cambridge University; Cameron went to Oxford University ... neither paid.... Now are both wealthy enough to pay for their children to go.

    Now put a hat on me and call me Susan, but does anyone think that this has any influence on how they perceive this issue?



    Clegg is a joke

    Students of the world Unite

    EDUCATION IS A RIGHT, AND NOT A PRIVILEGED

    SCRAP TUITION FEES, REINSTATE GRANTS FOR THOSE UNABLE TO AFFORD LIVING COSTS AND STOP BLAMING THOSE UNDER 18 FOR THE PROBLEMS AND POLICIES CAUSED BY THOSE (AND THOSE WHO VOTED FOR THEM) WHO ARE ALL OVER 18

    SCRAP TUITION FEES, SCRAP CLEGG!
    ............... Have you ever wondered what
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    • welshmoneylover
    • By welshmoneylover 12th Oct 10, 9:51 PM
    • 2,847 Posts
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    welshmoneylover
    Money saving hint....



    EDUCATION IS A RIGHT, AND NOT A PRIVILEGED
    Originally posted by Stryder
    WML hint........ at least spell the word PRIVILEGE CORRECTLY

    No wonder some of our students are not ready to enter the workplace
    Be happy, it's the greatest wealth
    • Dylanwing
    • By Dylanwing 12th Oct 10, 9:52 PM
    • 1,948 Posts
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    Dylanwing
    Some bald t0sser on Newsnight trying to justify it. The more he opens his mouth, the worse it sounds, it seems that money-sharking is also part of the deal.
    The effects of this lunacy will really hit in about 10 years time as the majority cannot afford to buy a house, graduates will avoid paying the debt, there will be a shortage of people doing the 'longer' degrees, and social mobility will be low. Then in 30 years time, another crisis as the debts get written off, so our children pay once again for the folly of a bunch of half-wits.
    • Stryder
    • By Stryder 12th Oct 10, 10:01 PM
    • 1,057 Posts
    • 1,478 Thanks
    Stryder
    WML hint........ at least spell the word PRIVILEGE CORRECTLY

    No wonder some of our students are not ready to enter the workplace
    Originally posted by welshmoneylover
    I am self employed - a student (OU) doing my 3rd degree and slightly dyslexic... cheers for that little dig

    I think you are soooo cool

    PS it was a typo and an error in tense- not in fact spelling, you !!%$&*$$%
    ............... Have you ever wondered what
    OO O[] Martin would look like
    _______ In a washing machine
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    • Stryder
    • By Stryder 12th Oct 10, 10:05 PM
    • 1,057 Posts
    • 1,478 Thanks
    Stryder
    Next step - Children should all bring a 5 a day into school to pay there teachers. If your poor you get the teachers who do not charge much (if your lucky as no one will bother bothering going to uni to get a degree in teaching)- great market economy!

    Lib Dem Educational Policy - Sponsored by Encarta - the next Generation of Computer-Human teaching software.
    ............... Have you ever wondered what
    OO O[] Martin would look like
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    • Stryder
    • By Stryder 12th Oct 10, 10:24 PM
    • 1,057 Posts
    • 1,478 Thanks
    Stryder
    Some bald t0sser on Newsnight trying to justify it. The more he opens his mouth, the worse it sounds, it seems that money-sharking is also part of the deal.
    The effects of this lunacy will really hit in about 10 years time as the majority cannot afford to buy a house, graduates will avoid paying the debt, there will be a shortage of people doing the 'longer' degrees, and social mobility will be low. Then in 30 years time, another crisis as the debts get written off, so our children pay once again for the folly of a bunch of half-wits.
    Originally posted by Dylanwing
    "But when confronted today, Mr Cable admitted the pledge would have to be abandoned. He said: "Let me just finally confront this issue of the pledge, the promise, which I and my colleagues undertook to implement.
    "Under current economic circumstances we cannot implement that."

    Hmmm I thought a pledge was "implemented" the moment it was signed/made. I think the word he was looking for was honoured (although maybe the word "betrayed" was stuck in his mind instead). Who would have thought the Cablemeister would have cracked so soon.... tut tut

    I looks like Clegg has learnt from Cameron that its good to have someone more gullible to take the fall for betraying your voters. Whats so annoying is that by the time Clegg faces the electorate he will undoubtedly be wearing a blue tie and sitting on Cameron's lap
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/education/education-news/vince-cable-bears-brunt-of-tuition-fee-anger-2104207.html

    NEW TORY LOGO:

    Last edited by Stryder; 12-10-2010 at 10:38 PM.
    ............... Have you ever wondered what
    OO O[] Martin would look like
    _______ In a washing machine
    (())
    --------
    ''''''''''''""""""
    • irishwench69
    • By irishwench69 12th Oct 10, 11:00 PM
    • 794 Posts
    • 5,634 Thanks
    irishwench69
    It will also mean that the less vocational courses die a death. Education should be about learning for learning's sake, not just to set you up for a particular career.

    I studied philosophy at uni and it is a hugely important and valuable discipline, but as it doesn't lead automatically to a job I would have never chosen to do it if I thought I would have to pay off 36,000 at the end, as I don't come from a rich family. Nor am interested in a high-paying job (I work in the media!) so I would be saddled paying off the debt for the rest of my life.

    So incredibly sad to think our children won't have the same choices. Education should be the backbone of a country.
    Originally posted by sarahs999
    Really?

    Ever consider that actually as you're studying the course, you have an obligation to pay fees? Why should other people subsidise you doing a course you freely admit doesn't lead to a job / career?

    The world isn't fair - not everyone gets to go to university or do exactly what they want. It is reasonable enough to assume you would choose a university course based at least in part on getting a job afterwards!

    Nor do you have to be rich - that's what grants etc are for (yes, they might be less common but they do still exist!), or you have other options, such as studying part time while working.

    What has changed fundamentally? Students still need to pay fees, they will pay it back after their course (as is the case now) - yes it will be more, but the threshold at which payments starts is going up - so if you make 10,000 / yr, you wouldn't be making payments back anyway!

    There is a huge funding gap - the money has to come from somewhere - where else do people think it should come from? I think having students pay back for their own education is fairer than all taxpayers paying for it via increases elsewhere!

    (Of course ideally the number of universities / certain departments would drop, and this would help fund the gap, but that's not likely to happen sadly......)

    Oh and before people jump on me, I paid tuition fees, and got through uni without being rich - just good old SLC and part-time work like so many others.

    Also, I did a scientific degree - it really riles me seeing so many people doing degrees that have no real value. I would have had no problem doing a vocational course if that had been what I wanted to do (two of my siblings went this route as it suited what they wanted to do).

    But frankly lots of people are going to uni because they can't (or won't) get a job, they're not sure of what to do next, or just fancy the social scene. Is it really fair that other funding is cut or taxpayers pay the burden for people like this?

    IW x
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    Remember the MoneySaving mantras!

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    • sarahs999
    • By sarahs999 13th Oct 10, 9:54 AM
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    sarahs999
    Yes, really. Teaching people to think is immeasurably useful. Sadly this doesn't seem to be on the syllabus of most courses.

    It's the thinkers of the future who will hopefully find a way to get the country out of the mess it's in.
    Debt cleared! 13,128 0!!!
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    'Eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants.' Michael Pollan
    • The One Who
    • By The One Who 13th Oct 10, 11:19 AM
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    The One Who
    EDUCATION IS A RIGHT, AND NOT A PRIVILEGED
    Originally posted by Stryder
    No. Compulsory schooling is a 'right', but further and higher education should be for those with the academic ability. I agree that it should not be about the ability to pay, but it is most certainly not a 'right'.

    Also, I did a scientific degree - it really riles me seeing so many people doing degrees that have no real value. I would have had no problem doing a vocational course if that had been what I wanted to do (two of my siblings went this route as it suited what they wanted to do).

    But frankly lots of people are going to uni because they can't (or won't) get a job, they're not sure of what to do next, or just fancy the social scene. Is it really fair that other funding is cut or taxpayers pay the burden for people like this?
    Originally posted by irishwench69
    What constitutes real value? Who decides that? Also, a lot of people are at university because it is what is expected for them, they don't know of other options and because they think it's a golden ticket to a high-paying job.

    I think university should be about education for education's sake, universities are not graduate-factories. The government are really doing everything in their power to destroy UK universities. Blue-skies research can lead to some amazing discoveries, but now research funding is being applied through a framework of 'policy-relevance' and 'impact' in the short-term. This is a huge blow to the arts and humanities, which will impact on future students with departments like history and English literature (two of the most popular courses) really suffering.

    This shouldn't discourage poorer students, as loans will still be available. If they want to go to university, then they still can. Everyone might just need to justify it to themselves more than they do currently.
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