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CMS Allege Historical Arrears.

edited 30 November -1 at 1:00AM in Child Support
12 replies 3.2K views
ParatusParatus Forumite
4 posts
edited 30 November -1 at 1:00AM in Child Support
My daughter is almost twenty-one and I have received a letter from the CMS that I owe £2400 in arrears.

I was with the CSA from 2000 to around 2012/13 and, as I worked in the public sector, they calculated the amount to pay and then deducted it at source i.e. they took it from my pay and I got what was left.

Around 2012/13 relations with my ex improved and we informed the CSA that we had come to a private arrangement, with me paying an agreed monthly amount, and the CSA now being no longer required. I made these payments in full without ever once missing one until the September of the year my daughter turned eighteen. My bank statements prove this.

My question is: how the hell am I in arrears? In my time with the CSA payments were decided by them and deducted at source, and in the private arrangement I never missed a payment and can prove it.

Phone calls to the CMS have proved utterly hopeless. I have asked them to prove that I am in arrears and show me the paperwork. They refused, saying that it's not their job to prove I'm in arrears, but my job to prove I'm not. As this case goes back years, my former employers do not keep records that far back to prove that payment was deducted at source. They've told me that they will recover the 'arrears' whether I like it or not, as they can take it directly from my pension payments.

I have not at any point missed or tried to avoid any maintenance payment. I can't possibly have. So where have these 'arrears' come from?

Somebody help, please.
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Replies

  • DUTRDUTR Forumite
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    Did the csa write to you and confirm the closure of the case?
    If not then you should have been transferring the monies via the csa as originally agreed, it should make no odds to you as it still reaches it's intended destination.

    So,yes you may have to pay the arrears.
  • Jessy07Jessy07 Forumite
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    Will your ex partner confirm you were paying her direct? If so will she phone them?
  • pmdukpmduk Forumite
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    Are they suggesting the case was in arrears when it was transferred from CSA to the CMS?
  • So,yes you may have to pay the arrears. Arrears? What arrears? Payments to the CSA were deducted by them at source. I fail to see how I can be in arrears.

    Will your ex partner confirm you were paying her direct? If so will she phone them? No, she probably won't. However, my bank records show all the monthly payments made to her account.

    Are they suggesting the case was in arrears when it was transferred from CSA to the CMS? Yes, they've said that the private arrangement between me and my ex is not what they're concerned with. They said that the 'arrears' accrued whilst I was with the CSA. As the amount was decided by them and deducted at source I fail to see how there could be 'arrears'.
  • DUTRDUTR Forumite
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    Paratus wrote: »
    So,yes you may have to pay the arrears. Arrears? What arrears? Payments to the CSA were deducted by them at source. I fail to see how I can be in arrears.

    Will your ex partner confirm you were paying her direct? If so will she phone them? No, she probably won't. However, my bank records show all the monthly payments made to her account.

    Are they suggesting the case was in arrears when it was transferred from CSA to the CMS? Yes, they've said that the private arrangement between me and my ex is not what they're concerned with. They said that the 'arrears' accrued whilst I was with the CSA. As the amount was decided by them and deducted at source I fail to see how there could be 'arrears'.

    The arrears of the figure you mentioned in the opening post.
    I and others I know were getting annual schedules which shown what was due for the year against what was paid, in an instant one could see if they were or not in arrears and if so, how those arrears (or over payments) accrued.

    It matters not that YOU fail to see, you have to accept that there is a possibility for a variety of reasons why there may be arrears.

    The payments to your ex needs to be agreed with the CSA, the liability isn't with the PWC it is with the CSA/CMS.

    Your bank statements may show you paid so n so some money (who knows it wasn't just a gift)
    How are you so sure the ex called them? Or they agreed to a private agreement?
    Yet you are sure the ex wouldn't call them again.
  • I and others I know were getting annual schedules which shown what was due for the year against what was paid Lucky you. I certainly didn't get anything like that.

    you have to accept that there is a possibility for a variety of reasons why there may be arrears. No I don't have to accept it. How do I know if the 'arrears' are genuine. If they are genuine then why won't they prove it by providing me the relevant documentation. Once again, I fail to see how I have accrued arrears when the amount was decided by the CSA and deducted at source.

    Your bank statements may show you paid so n so some money (who knows it wasn't just a gift)
    How are you so sure the ex called them? Or they agreed to a private agreement?
    If she didn't call them then why did they cease the deduction from earnings? I can prove that I made monthly payments to my ex. Those payments were more than the CSA recommended I pay. The CSA, also at that time, ceased the deductions from my pay. So what do you think the monthly payments were for?
  • DUTRDUTR Forumite
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    Paratus wrote: »
    I and others I know were getting annual schedules which shown what was due for the year against what was paid Lucky you. I certainly didn't get anything like that.

    you have to accept that there is a possibility for a variety of reasons why there may be arrears. No I don't have to accept it. How do I know if the 'arrears' are genuine. If they are genuine then why won't they prove it by providing me the relevant documentation. Once again, I fail to see how I have accrued arrears when the amount was decided by the CSA and deducted at source.

    Your bank statements may show you paid so n so some money (who knows it wasn't just a gift)
    How are you so sure the ex called them? Or they agreed to a private agreement?
    If she didn't call them then why did they cease the deduction from earnings? I can prove that I made monthly payments to my ex. Those payments were more than the CSA recommended I pay. The CSA, also at that time, ceased the deductions from my pay. So what do you think the monthly payments were for?

    Already answered in the 1st post, guilty until proven innocent, the case you manage yourself, it doesn't just run on he said she said.
    Keep things in writing, so when you ex allegedly phoned them did the csa write to you to confirm the new arrangement?
    At the end of the day, it's no use trying to pick a debate here as we are not the ones that levied or will exonorate the monies .
    It doesn't matter what I think the money was for , as law it could simply be a gift, it's not for us to prove.
  • Jessy07Jessy07 Forumite
    33 posts
    10 Posts First Anniversary
    Have you spoke to CMS? If you have evidence of payments send it in. Why do you think your ex will not confirm you were paying her direct?
  • pmdukpmduk Forumite
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    You need to ask why they are only now raising the issue.

    AIUI, a full account breakdown is undertaken by the CSA (when transferring cases to the CMS) which looks at the amount of support that should have been paid. They then check the amount received and compare the 2 figures. They do not analyse where arrears have arisen, nor are they required to.

    It can be enormously difficult to find individual points at which smallish arrears arise, a figure of £2400 I suspect may come from a period when you were either paying the PWC directly or the wrong amount deducted from your wages.
  • Thanks everyone for trying to help with this matter. My MP is now involved and has passed the case on to the Parliamentary Group responsible for investigating this kind of thing. I'll see how it goes.
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