Flight delay and cancellation compensation, KLM/AF ONLY

blondmark · 21 February 2013 at 2:35PM

cjkeeko wrote: »

I have received the following response from KLM regarding the claim above, relating to two flights booked through KLM and on the one ticket number.

" Having carefully reviewed your claim, I regret to inform you that it is not possible to alter our position. I should explain that in accordance with established caselaw, namely the ruling of the European Court of Justice in the case of Shenkel -v- Emirates, a flight is a unit of carriage for the purpose of EU Regulation 261/04 and not a succession of flights. Subsequently, as your flight KL 430 from Dubai to Amsterdam on the 3rd of January was not delayed by three hours, cash compensation is not applicable. I am sorry for any disappointment this may cause you."

Oh yes? Would that be Emirates Airlines v Diether Schenkel (Case C‑173/07)? That's nothing to do with ongoing flights - it only relates to return flights, so it's completely irrelevant.

Here's what the Fourth Chamber ruled:

Article 3(1)(a) of Regulation (EC) No 261/2004 of the European Parliament and of the Council of 11 February 2004 establishing common rules on compensation and assistance to passengers in the event of denied boarding and of cancellation or long delay of flights, and repealing Regulation (EEC) No 295/91, must be interpreted as not applying to the case of an outward and return journey in which passengers who have originally departed from an airport located in the territory of a Member State to which the EC Treaty applies travel back to that airport on a flight from an airport located in a non-member country. The fact that the outward and return flights are the subject of a single booking has no effect on the interpretation of that provision.

cjkeeko · 21 February 2013 at 8:56PM

marks2spark, centipede100 and blondmark thank you so much for your great advice. Will keep you informed of next step. We travel to Dubai frequently with KLM/airfrance to visit family and have experienced delays and had boarding denied several times however customer service has always been good and we have accepted that sometimes these things happen however it was the appalling customer service we received in January that prompted us to make a complaint to KLM and only then did we see on the website that you could claim for compensation for delay's. The airline seem to be batting away our claim with "questionable honesty" and I have no doubt if I keep pressing the matter re the legislation they would probably then claim extraordinary circumstances so feel best step at this point is to progress legally, didn't realise could do this through MCOL as we live in Scotland and KLM is not a UK company so appreciate your advice. In the original claim we had asked KLM for transportation vouchers because this was the higher value and as I said we travel at least once per year to see family so would definitely use them, will end up costing KLM more if they have to pay cash and costs.

MrTeee · 23 February 2013 at 5:36PM

I just applied to KLM for cancelled flight in July 2005 but the 2nd paragraph of their reply says...Air travel is governed by the international body of law known as the Montreal Convention of 1999. Article 35 of this regulation sets a time limit of two years from the date of the planned or actual arrival of a flight to claim for damages.
They refuse compensation, can I take this claim elsewhere?

Caz3121 · 23 February 2013 at 6:13PM

MrTeee wrote: »

I just applied to KLM for cancelled flight in July 2005 but the 2nd paragraph of their reply says...Air travel is governed by the international body of law known as the Montreal Convention of 1999. Article 35 of this regulation sets a time limit of two years from the date of the planned or actual arrival of a flight to claim for damages.
They refuse compensation, can I take this claim elsewhere?

If you go through the UK courts you have 6 years but you are still out of time

as per the FAQs in post #2

blondmark · 25 February 2013 at 3:33PM

cjkeeko wrote: »

marks2spark, centipede100 and blondmark thank you so much for your great advice. Will keep you informed of next step. We travel to Dubai frequently with KLM/airfrance to visit family and have experienced delays and had boarding denied several times however customer service has always been good and we have accepted that sometimes these things happen however it was the appalling customer service we received in January that prompted us to make a complaint to KLM and only then did we see on the website that you could claim for compensation for delay's. The airline seem to be batting away our claim with "questionable honesty" and I have no doubt if I keep pressing the matter re the legislation they would probably then claim extraordinary circumstances so feel best step at this point is to progress legally, didn't realise could do this through MCOL as we live in Scotland and KLM is not a UK company so appreciate your advice. In the original claim we had asked KLM for transportation vouchers because this was the higher value and as I said we travel at least once per year to see family so would definitely use them, will end up costing KLM more if they have to pay cash and costs.

It's always a blessing when the airline is based in another European state because you have the choice of avoiding having a hearing and still win your claim. And who actually wants to go to court?

To do this you complete Form A of the European Small Claims Procedure, hand it in to your local county court and ask them to serve it on KLM in Holland. Tick the box saying no hearing required, and the entire claim is paper-based.

Same claim, same money, no hearing.

twix72 · 25 February 2013 at 5:03PM

Centipede100 wrote: »

Firstly, please never post in capitals again!

Secondly, outbound flight you were delayed in reaching your final destination by more than 3 hours and therefore are entitled to 600 euros per passenger compensation.

Thirdly, inbound flight meant you were also delayed in reaching your final destination by more than 3 hours so again are entitled to 600 euros in compensation.

This is the reply I got this morning.....please HELP!!!!:(

Thank you for your recent communications regarding the disruption to your flight KL565 from Amsterdam to Nairobi on22nd March 2005 and about which you had already contacted us on I am sorry for any inconvenience the disruption to your journey may have caused.

I can assure that this in no way reflects the standard of service we aim to provide.

Your flight was delayed as a result of technical problems. We took all the reasonable measures we could under these particular circumstances and every effort was made in order to offer you the best possible care and assistance.

According to EU recommendations, airline passengers are entitled to claim compensation dating back no longer than 6 years. I appreciate your comments that you have previously written to us before the recent changes, unfortunately as your flights are out of the 6 year time limit we are not liable for compensation in this instance.

Your choice of airline for your trip is appreciated, and I understand you will consider this incident when planning future trips. I hope that you will not judge us on the basis of this experience and will elect to give us another try. We look forward to the opportunity of welcoming you on-board again and regaining your confidence in us.

Yours sincerely

twix72 · 25 February 2013 at 5:12PM

I have been writing to them since 2005 through letters, emails and even phone calls... Surely the law should cover this

blondmark · 25 February 2013 at 5:31PM

twix72 wrote: »

I have been writing to them since 2005 through letters, emails and even phone calls... Surely the law should cover this

It does; you have six years from the date of the delay to lodge your claim. For whatever reason you have failed to do this so your right to claim has regrettably expired.

Moral of the story - stop writing to airlines and start your court claim.

TallArnie · 26 February 2013 at 2:44PM

We were recently delayed by 5 hours, but KLM argued that we weren't entitled to any compensation because the cancellation was announced more than 14 days before departure (see note below) and because we arrived at our final destination on the same day on a later flight. We were therefore stuck at Amsterdam Airport for 5 hours (with an 8-month old) without any compensation.
Writing to KLM Customer Services just gave the same outcome: They announced the cancellation more than 14 days in advance and they got us from A to B as they were required, so no compensation. Are they actually correct?

(Note: I don't recall receiving the announcement, but there's no way for me to prove or disprove this.)

beverley43 · 27 February 2013 at 12:16AM

On 7 Sept 2008 I flew Humberside - AMS - Moscow. The ticket was bought on the KLM website and the paperwork received by email had the complete itinerary listed and all flights had KL numbers. The AMS - SVO flight was KL3104. I flew to AMS and discovered that the AMS - SVO leg was code share and would be flown by Aeroflot under flight number SU0230. This flight was delayed 6 hours due to a technical fault. Should I send my claim to KLM or Aeroflot?
Many thanks for any help.

Flight delay and cancellation compensation, KLM/AF ONLY - Page 6

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Flight delay and cancellation compensation, KLM/AF ONLY

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