Agricultural Occupancy Condition

1356728

Replies

  • poppysarahpoppysarah Forumite
    11.5K Posts
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Just to update on this thread, for anyone that cares... lol... my advice above is wrong. From recent conversations I've been having at work with our planning solicitors, it appears that provided one partner works in the locality in agriculture, a couple can live in a property with an AOC attached to it, even if the partner earns a greater living from a non-agricultural job. There's an important appeal decision which was taken to the High Court which confirms this and provides the relevant case law for similar examples. Apologies!

    Thanks! That could be useful!
  • Just to update on this thread, for anyone that cares... lol... my advice above is wrong. From recent conversations I've been having at work with our planning solicitors, it appears that provided one partner works in the locality in agriculture, a couple can live in a property with an AOC attached to it, even if the partner earns a greater living from a non-agricultural job. There's an important appeal decision which was taken to the High Court which confirms this and provides the relevant case law for similar examples. Apologies!

    do you happen to know what the name of this case was? or where I can find some more information about it? as this applies to me at the moment.

    Thanx
  • perrowperrow Forumite
    3 Posts
    Just to update on this thread, for anyone that cares... lol... my advice above is wrong. From recent conversations I've been having at work with our planning solicitors, it appears that provided one partner works in the locality in agriculture, a couple can live in a property with an AOC attached to it, even if the partner earns a greater living from a non-agricultural job. There's an important appeal decision which was taken to the High Court which confirms this and provides the relevant case law for similar examples. Apologies!
    Could you provide me with information on this case law since it is very important. Many thanks
  • benjobenjo Forumite
    482 Posts
    our local council insist that in order to buy a property with an Agricultural tie you must be able to prove that 50% of your income is generated via agriculture.
  • poppysarahpoppysarah Forumite
    11.5K Posts
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    benjo wrote: »
    our local council insist that in order to buy a property with an Agricultural tie you must be able to prove that 50% of your income is generated via agriculture.

    Unless you're growing gold that's probably not that easy - if you've got to actually afford some of the overpriced places I've looked at.
  • Richard_WebsterRichard_Webster Forumite
    7.6K Posts
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    ✭✭✭✭
    I'd be interested in Planning_Officer's comments on the case I cited. This was an 8 acre holding with a 1970s bungalow with an ag-tie. The bungalow was actually a replacement for a 200 year old house that was past economic repair where there was obviously no ag-tie. So first thing was not sure why ag-tie imposed in first place. This didn't worry the person who built it as he was a farmer.

    The property has been sold so it is now up to the buyers what they do with it.

    However I'd be interested to know if these factors would be sufficient in themselves to allow removal of the ag-tie without the tedious business of advertising for 12-18 months etc:
    1. It being a replacement dwelling for one with no ag-tie;
    2. Being on a holding of only 8 acres and therefore of dubious viability - don't they reckon now that you need 200-300 acres to have a viable unit(?);
    3. Not being in an area where there are farms that employ agricultural workers (other than immediate family); and
    4. Being in an area of relatively cheap housing (by no means an area for tourists, natural beauty or second homes etc) so no particular need to provide a pool of affordable housing for agricultural workers.

    The LPA had a policy document which referred in general terms to showing that the condition no longer had a purpose but actually sent a very detailed list of what they required in terms of advertising and noting interest over a period of 12-18 months, which I thought wasn't justified by their stated policy. Other nearby authorities had much more detailed polices actually setting out the advertising requirements in their policies.

    (I used to be a planning solicitor with an urban planning authority years ago so I understand the law, but not necessarily all the rural practice!)
    RICHARD WEBSTER

    As a retired conveyancing solicitor I believe the information given in the post to be useful assuming any properties concerned are in England/Wales but I accept no liability for it.
  • kcs41kcs41 Forumite
    3 Posts
    Hi
    This is my first post on a site like this asking for advice & the first time I have come up against an Agricultural tie.I am self employed and rent a unit to store spare parts that I use in my Business so decided to try to move and put the rent into a house with a unit in the grounds , however we then found the property with the Agricultural tie that would be ideal for my business.
    90 % of my business is done on my customers own sites & the other 10 % is paperwork at home & storage only of my spares
    The property already has an existing fish farm that uses only half of the unit on site & has to be run by the occupant of the house , this is the tie.I contacted local planning who said as long as my wife runs the business then we would fulfill the tie & I as her husband could live there. I asked what about the storage of my spare parts for my business , am I able to store these at the new house & have been told that I would need to apply for planning approval as it is not agricultural but would prob be refused.
    As I intend only to store parts at my home and no actual work is done there does anyone agree or disagree with my local planning officer.

    Any advice or information would be appreciated.

    Thanks
  • Richard_WebsterRichard_Webster Forumite
    7.6K Posts
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    ✭✭✭✭
    Problem on last post is that in the country a lot of people get away with an awful lot without the Council knowing.

    Probably the spare parts storage would require planning permission, but unless last poster had difficult neighbours or he was inconsiderate in his use of the property, he would probably get away with it if he hadn't asked! Ten years like that and a lawful use certificate could be obtained for the storage. After a few years and no obvious problems with neighbours, etc, it becomes more difficult for the Council to take enforcement action because the mere fact of the unnoticed and therefore low key nature of the use argues that it can't be a problem and therefore permission ought to be granted on an appeal against an enforcement notice.
    RICHARD WEBSTER

    As a retired conveyancing solicitor I believe the information given in the post to be useful assuming any properties concerned are in England/Wales but I accept no liability for it.
  • lostinrateslostinrates Forumite
    55.3K Posts
    I've been Money Tipped!
    ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Richard, we are looking at properties including ones with ag ties. I notice in my searches a lot of properties in south east with very small acrages have small acrages, or simply no land further to a large garden. I understand the history of this is not that the house shall be able to provide profitable land or employ, but rather that employees in agriculture or, crucially, those retiring from agriculture shall be able to afford a house in the locality. In anycase, some are very dear!
  • Richard_WebsterRichard_Webster Forumite
    7.6K Posts
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    ✭✭✭✭
    Yes, obviously there will be some people who will take the risk, but a house with an ag-tie and hope the Council won't have time to check. If there are agricultural workers in the area who genuinely can't afford local house prices (which oculd be the case in the South East, Cotswolds, Yorhsire Dales, etc,) then there might be a reason for keeping the ag-ties.

    Also Councils understandably get cross with farmers who come up with long sob stories about how they need their grown up son to live on the farm as his presence is really vital (and a luxurious home is built for him) and a few years later he goes off somewhere else and leaves farming altogether. The story suddenly changes to one where there isn't a need for a replacement employee and the house is surplus and can we sell it without the ag-tie? Council reasonably considers that was the plan all along.

    Or you get "I've bought this small area for intensive market gardening and I was running it from my home a mile away, but we have had so much vandalism I need to be on site for security purposes. Can I station a mobile home here please?" Gets temporary/personal permission for that. A few years later: "Can I build a permanent house?" Ag-tie quite naturally imposed.
    RICHARD WEBSTER

    As a retired conveyancing solicitor I believe the information given in the post to be useful assuming any properties concerned are in England/Wales but I accept no liability for it.
This discussion has been closed.
Latest MSE News and Guides

54 ways to ‘DIY it’

According to the MSE Forum

MSE Team Blog

£10 Christmas bonus

For benefits recipients

MSE News

Lidl '£10 off £40 spend' voucher

Via Metro or Daily Mail. Excludes NI

MSE Deals