Help with UKPC / DBLegal County Court Claim Form. 22 February at 10:43PM in Parking tickets, fines & parking 7 replies 120 views

Philypow

Good evening all. 

Firstly I’d like to say, what a fantastic resource this forum is. What a wealth of information. 

I have read a lot of threads including the NEWBIES thread. I’m still getting my head around everything but I think I’m understanding. 

Into the detail: 

My wife attended a retail park in Leeds back in May 2019 where she shopped at 6-7 locations, (transaction history at 3) including a coffee shop and lunch at a restaurant. 

She stopped in the Mothercare cafe to breast feed our son who was a newborn at the time which resulting in her returning to the car over the allotted 3 hour limit for the retail park. (Not a pay and display site) 

We got the usual PCN Invoice which we (wrongly) ignored. We’ve since received several letters and threats and continued to ignore resulting in a letter through the post yesterday for a County Court Claim for £300 by DB Legal on behalf of UKPCL. 

Having read the advice on this forum we will not be paying and will be following the instruction and advice which I understand as following: 

1. The issue date on the letter is 17th Feb. 

2. We should file an Acknowledgement of Service on the MoneyClaimOnline website by the 8th March? 

3. We should then request the SAR from UKPCL by emailing the contact email address? 

4. We then have until Wednesday 22nd March to file a defence which should be done by email. 

Assuming I have understood the above correctly I have a few questions if someone clued up could help? 

A) My wife overstayed her allotted time due to having to breastfeed a newborn baby. Whilst I acknowledge that this is not a valid excuse. Are there any defence ideas which would help our cause? 

If this goes to court and we lose, I understand that the maximum fine typically is around £200? Is this correct or just an average? Could this be more than the current £300 invoice? 

C) My wife spoke to Citizens Advice and they told her that if she lost in court she would receive an automatic CCJ, however reading this forum it suggests that she would only get a CCJ if she didn’t pay within 30 days? Can anyone clarify? 

D) My wife has proof of purchases in the shops at the retail park and will be writing letters of complaint to each retailer as well as the land owner, the retail park company and writing to both the MP of the location of the retail park (Leeds) and our local MP. Is this worth doing or is this a waste of time now it is at Court Claim Stage?

The retail park is “Crown Point” in Leeds. If anyone has any experience or advice regarding this retail park as well as any possible statements we could include in our defence it would be much appreciated. 

Hope to hear from some of the experts here soon! 

Regards

P. 

KeithP

Philypow said:

We got ... a letter through the post yesterday for a County Court Claim for £300 by DB Legal on behalf of UKPCL. 

1. The issue date on the letter is 17th Feb. 

2. We should file an Acknowledgement of Service on the MoneyClaimOnline website by the 8th March? 

4. We then have until Wednesday 22nd March to file a defence which should be done by email. 

Hello and welcome.

Yes, you are right with your dates but there might be something useful here...

With a Claim Issue Date of 17th February, you have until Wednesday 8th March to file an Acknowledgment of Service but there is nothing to be gained by delaying it. 

To file an Acknowledgment of Service, follow the guidance in the Dropbox file linked from the second post in the NEWBIES thread.

Having filed an Acknowledgment of Service in a timely manner, you have until 4pm on Wednesday 22nd March 2023 to file your Defence.

That's four weeks away. Plenty of time to produce a Defence, but please don't leave it to the last minute.

To create a Defence, and then file a Defence by email, look again at the second post on the NEWBIES thread - immediately following where you found the Acknowledgment of Service guidance.

Don't miss the deadline for filing an Acknowledgment of Service, nor that for filing a Defence.

Do not try and file a Defence via the MoneyClaimOnline website. Once an Acknowledgment of Service has been filed, the MCOL website should be treated as 'read only'.

Philypow said:

C) My wife spoke to Citizens Advice and they told her that if she lost in court she would receive an automatic CCJ, however reading this forum it suggests that she would only get a CCJ if she didn’t pay within 30 days? Can anyone clarify?

Technically CA are correct but if the payment is made within the timescale specified by the Judge then the CCJ will be removed and no trace of it will remain.
But that's enough talk about losing.  

Philypow

Thanks Keith that’s helpful. 

Do you have any comment / suggestion on our defence and if my wife breastfeeding our newborn would be a sufficient “reason” to exceed the 3 hour maximum stay? 

Also, with over a dozen shops, a restaurant and a cafe, is there an arguement that it would be impossible to use the retail park fully without exceeding the 3 hours? 

Or an arguement which identifies the 3 hour limit is clearly there as a deterrent to prevent people parking up and going in to Leeds for the day shopping. But it’s clear from my wife’s transactions that she was at the retail park, spending money therefore there was no “loss of profit” and therefore the “invoice” is wholly immoral and unjustified? 

Any other ideas for a defence? 

Coupon-mad

Sounds a bit like this case:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6342366/updated-14-02-court-date-imminent-have-received-witness-statement-and-dont-understand-any-of-it/p2

A retail park with lots of shops and (although the family can't recall who was driving) they have included in their WS that it may have been due to queueing for a space, or breastfeeding or dealing with the children, or even a double visit in one day (ANPR only shows the 'first in last out' ANPR images in a 24 hour period).

Be aware that case is NOT at defence stage (the latest document posted is a WS and evidence, ready for a hearing that probably won't ever happen because DCBLegal discontinue) but if you read it to the end you might find some similarities and wording you can copy into your defence.

Umkomaas

I thought I'd draw your attention to this fairly recent thread which you might have not yet seen. You must keep going through all the necessary court procedure phases, but the hope is that your case will follow the same pattern as all those detailed in the thread. 

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6377263/dcb-legal-record-of-private-parking-court-claim-discontinuations/p1

Philypow

Thanks for your comments so far! 

Philypow

Umkomaas said:

I thought I'd draw your attention to this fairly recent thread which you might have not yet seen. You must keep going through all the necessary court procedure phases, but the hope is that your case will follow the same pattern as all those detailed in the thread. 

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6377263/dcb-legal-record-of-private-parking-court-claim-discontinuations/p1

Wow yeah I really hope it goes that way! 

But from what I’ve read even if it goes to court and we lose, it’s less of a payment than the £300 they are asking for now? 

Coupon-mad

Yes, unless you get a bad Judge it would be c£200 if you lose - but we don't expect you to even teach a hearing.