Right of Way and legal obligations - what can I do?

crazycatlady1984

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

I'm wondering why they would think of wedging the gate open on the one hand but demand you fix the lock if it's broken on the other hand. That sounds odd - though I note you say they are illogical people basically.

Have you paid the cost/used your husbands time for free to repair the gate any time they have caused it to break? It does sound as if you have.

I don't know how Scottish law might differ to the rest of the country - but my understanding of a ROW to use a road, for instance, means that the ROW user (ie the dominant tenement) has no right to demand that the road-owner keeps the road in good repair. However, the law allows the road-user to do the maintenance work and pay for it themself as I understand it.

So - I can't demand the road-owner in my road fixes it - but I could pay to do the job myself if I chose to.

I would have thought the same sort of logic would apply to the gate/lock on gate - ie that they could pay to fix the broken lock themselves if they like but they can't demand you pay (or use your time) to fix it.

Personally - I would be inclined to give them a bill for it every time they cause the lock to be broken and say "You want it fixed - you pay to fix it". I certainly wouldnt have my hubby giving his time for free to fix it.

It does sound like they are trying to drive you out before your child is born. Ignore them. Time will solve that problem for you....:cool:

Yes, understand what you are saying and it makes sense to me.

Yes, my husband has already repaired ( or built from scratch) everything, at no expense to them. They are either skint or ridiculously frugal (their house is horrendous, really lets the rest of the street down) so we knew they would not pay for anything. Husband is handy with tools so have done things in order just to get things done and also in an attempt to be neighbourly.

It is odd that they insist on locks etc and then leave them open, but that is just them - that's exactly what I'm dealing with.

Agree, I think all we can do is ignore them. They thrive on drama and putting nasty notes through doors etc, in days away from giving birth and just not interested in it. The gate thing is galling as they have just started it and is clearly in response to us telling them we are having a baby (they were clearly furious and pretty much shut the door in my face :rotfl:). It will be years before an open garden gate is an issue for a child, but in the meantime it leaves them very exposed. There is no getting into our property (upper flat, three huge big sets of doors to get through) but her bedroom window and also his bedroom window (separate bedrooms) (single glazed and panes all but falling out the frames) are right next to the gate and very vulnerable in my opinion - and also theirs, which is why they have previously made such a fuss about the gate. So if we don't react, hopefully they will realise they're really just compromising their own security and start locking it again.

Mojisola

crazycatlady1984 wrote: »

days away from giving birth

Congratulations! Hope all goes well.

Ignoring them will probably be for the best. With a little one in the house, you'll be too busy anyway.

crazycatlady1984

They are trying to make things difficult; they always have, it's just what they do.

Regarding a baby; it is a very old property and the sound proofing is pretty good, nothing can really be heard. Added to that, we have always been over the top considerate when it comes to noise. We are both hardly ever here as we work long hours, we both moved to Aberdeen for work so don't have a lot of friends locally, so weekends tend to be spent elsewhere, plus we both only wear slippers inside etc etc.

In saying that, we are the upper flat with wooden floors and there is scope for us to cause a hell of a lot of inconvenience if we chose. Which is also why I find it so bizarre that they are intent on picking fights with us. The last 3 families to live here didn't stay long and we have heard various stories of the issues between them and this couple. Don't know why they keep doing it

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

I see your point Mojisola.

I can't really see how they could make OP's life harder - even if they are deliberately trying to.

The boot is rather on the other foot there - that OP lives above them and not vice-versa. I'm guessing that this couple are being deliberately awkward (if that's the case) because they fear the coming baby will be allowed to cry and scream for hours - which probably would come through as noise into their flat. That much I understand - but they are rather assuming there will be increased noise because of a baby nearby - rather than waiting to see if there is.

crazycatlady1984

Mojisola wrote: »

Congratulations! Hope all goes well.

Ignoring them will probably be for the best. With a little one in the house, you'll be too busy anyway.

Thank you Yes, agree ignoring is the way forward. Being ignored drives them mad, but too bad :rotfl:

baz8790

I would simply remove the gate if it does not cause any security risk to yourselves as it doesn't seem worth the hassle of repairing it.

If they moan about the gate being missing just tell them you cannot afford to keep repairing it.

I would imagine the wind that we have had up here in the last week would of caused some damage to the gate if it has been left swinging about

crazycatlady1984

baz8790 wrote: »

I would simply remove the gate if it does not cause any security risk to yourselves as it doesn't seem worth the hassle of repairing it.

If they moan about the gate being missing just tell them you cannot afford to keep repairing it.

I would imagine the wind that we have had up here in the last week would of caused some damage to the gate if it has been left swinging about

I know what you are saying, but it is good for privacy and also for keeping our cat in away from the road. Also, whilst our house is secure, it is also nice feeling that the garden is secure. We would definitely miss it if it was gone.

Husband is very close to ripping down the one he built between the two gardens at their request though as they do the same with that. The only downside to that is that then we have to look at their tip of a garden (peeling paint, rubbish and rusty old shopping trolleys :eek:) lol x

rach_k

Is there a possibility that they are getting forgetful in their old age and it's not really out of spite? Pushing bins back and forth over somebody's garden sounds like a bit of a strange thing to do even if it would really annoy you - who in their right mind can be bothered doing that?! Even if it's not likely, you could act as if you think it is the case - gently remind them every time they 'forget' to shut the gate, as if it's the first time and they need it explaining to them (for their own security). You clearly not being annoyed but concerned for their well-being in their frail and elderly state might encourage them to remember!

One thing I'm not clear on is 're-routing a ROW' - does that mean you can't have anything they can't move in your garden? A heavy table on the lawn, a garden shed, a kids' swing set? What about a fenced play area (for pets and children!) that covers most but not all of the garden with access only via your back door, leaving easy access across where they currently take their bins and store yours plus a few other garden bits and bobs?

Mojisola

rach_k wrote: »

One thing I'm not clear on is 're-routing a ROW' - does that mean you can't have anything they can't move in your garden? A heavy table on the lawn, a garden shed, a kids' swing set? What about a fenced play area (for pets and children!) that covers most but not all of the garden with access only via your back door, leaving easy access across where they currently take their bins and store yours plus a few other garden bits and bobs?

The ROW is usually set out on the house deeds and a pedestrian one is only as wide as necessary to walk down (and usually push a barrow or similar).

The users of the ROW don't have the right to go all over the garden.

moneyistooshorttomention

Hmmm....well as for the rusty old shopping trolleys.

Last I knew I believe that those shopping trolleys cost us about £100 each (yep....I do mean "us" - as I'm sure the supermarkets won't be covering the cost of replacement trolleys out of their profits).

Now - I do know that supermarkets come out and collect their trolleys if they've been abandoned anywhere. Goodness knows - I've had to report any number of abandoned trolleys to them - and they do always come and collect them.

I've never had to report one "abandoned" in someone's private garden yet - but there's always a first;). So I'd check out who those trolleys are from and would be on the phone saying "Hello, T*sco - there are 6 of your trolleys abandoned at the following address...." and then sit back and await T*sco coming round with a van to collect them:)

crazycatlady1984

rach_k wrote: »

Is there a possibility that they are getting forgetful in their old age and it's not really out of spite? Pushing bins back and forth over somebody's garden sounds like a bit of a strange thing to do even if it would really annoy you - who in their right mind can be bothered doing that?! Even if it's not likely, you could act as if you think it is the case - gently remind them every time they 'forget' to shut the gate, as if it's the first time and they need it explaining to them (for their own security). You clearly not being annoyed but concerned for their well-being in their frail and elderly state might encourage them to remember!

One thing I'm not clear on is 're-routing a ROW' - does that mean you can't have anything they can't move in your garden? A heavy table on the lawn, a garden shed, a kids' swing set? What about a fenced play area (for pets and children!) that covers most but not all of the garden with access only via your back door, leaving easy access across where they currently take their bins and store yours plus a few other garden bits and bobs?

Ha, no, unfortunately not, it is pure spite. They have taken great delight in the past in telling me all the horrid things they would do to annoy the previous occupants of our house. They have done things like this to us over the years but this latest thing with the gate is in response to us telling them we are having a baby. Treating them like they are just forgetful and we are concerned is a good idea, unfortunately we are now beyond that - they are flat out hostile to us now, there is no communication, and they just LOVE the whole note thing (they write pages and pages of hostile drivel) so I don't want to go down that route - all I can do is ignore them.

Re the RoW - yup, pretty much. There is a coloured line drawn on the deeds that is there right of way, so it must be left clear for them and we wouldn't be able to block it with anything (table and chairs etc). In reality, this isn't really an issue though. Again, hard to explain without seeing the garden but this area is kept clear anyway. It's just kind of a wee courtyard bit where we have two small sheds, our bin shelter and a log store. These are all round the side with a big clear paved bit in the middle which we use to take our bins out and to get to the main bit of our garden (ie the grass). Basically it is a long garden and their RoW is really only across the part of it that is closest to the house.