Anybody know about tax, mortgages and cr*ppy families?

getmore4less

It can get tough having two hats.

The probate board(ok peeps there) might be another place to open discussion if you don't want it to get lost here.

Ivrytwr3

So for the sake of £5k you are running the risk of alienating yourself from your family? Things won't be the same between you all.

Also, of course the solicitor wants you to go for more - it isn't her family and she gets more cash too - probably swallowing up the £5k.

You started off as the injured party, now you are the bad guy - not sure if this is a good or bad thing.

Savvy_Sue

Ivrytwr3 wrote: »

So for the sake of £5k you are running the risk of alienating yourself from your family? Things won't be the same between you all.

Also, of course the solicitor wants you to go for more - it isn't her family and she gets more cash too - probably swallowing up the £5k.

You started off as the injured party, now you are the bad guy - not sure if this is a good or bad thing.

Some of us know a bit more of the history here (from things the OP has posted before), and frankly the risk of alienation seems to have always been there pretty much regardless of what the OP does or doesn't do. Either that, or it's been a choice between alienation, and attempting to preserve her own physical and mental health.

Given that choice, I think self-preservation has to trump family relationships.

Ames

Thanks Sue.

Iv...

I can see how based on this thread you can come to that conclusion. However there's a lot of history behind this issue.

We could have sold the house for 145-50 when mum died. If dad and sister hadn't gone in one weekend and ripped out the kitchen. AFAIK, the kitchen still isn't finished after getting on for three years. They did that after I'd told them not to. There are lots of other examples.

Even before mum died it was clear that my relationship with my sister wouldn't survive this process.

I don't actually have a choice over the 5k. My welfare rights officer and his superior have both said that if I take what sister is offering I will face sanctions in relation to my means tested benefits. The DWP won't see all the history, they'll just see me selling to family for a house price of £120k, when the house was valued for probate at £150k.

There's also legal implications around my duty to maximise the value of the estate. My solicitor's fees are very reasonable. Of course she's just doing a job and making money from it, but the advice she's giving is sound.

And then there's the moral side. It really hurt that in one email to my solicitor my sister said that dad was just helping her on paper 'as any father would do'. I'm sure most fathers wouldn't help one daughter at the - literal - expense of the other.

Maybe I am now the bad guy. But my sister has taken financial advantage of me many, many times in the past. Her and dad have also actively deprived the estate of assets. So maybe it's time that I become the bad guy.

Ivrytwr3

Fair enough, yes, i am not aware of the past.

However, you all came to an agreement, then you want more cash as advised by your solicitor - extra cash that may be swallowed up through increasing costs or you run the risk of them pulling their offer.

You were looking at accepting £45k earlier, but then got up to £50k (well done!) and now you want more - maybe an option is to take the £50k offer and be done with the whole thing?

Ames

When I agreed to 50 it was on the understanding that I'd have to check with the solicitor and welfare rights advisor. In fact, dad and sister insisted that I saw the solicitor before formally accepting their offer.

As I said, there are legal reasons that I can't accept the offer.

I've made a counter offer where the solicitor costs come out of the estate, rather than me paying them, but I give up my share of mum's car, which sister put in her name two days after mum died. The numbers are about the same.

Lunar_Eclipse

From your figures (hope I remembered correctly!):

Worst case scenario = house worth £150k. Minus debts of 30k = 120k. You've spent 5, they've spent 10k. So the minimum you should accept is 60k, less a small adjustment for what's been spent. Call it 55k minimum and they can sort out things re: the 10k they've spent between them.

Realistic valuation is more like 180k, given the improvements to the property. This would give 75k each, minus adjustments for spending amounts.

So offer range to accept settlement lies between say 55-70k. On this basis, unless I've misunderstood, I would not accept their offer.

I would either go back and counter offer with a fixed, no negotiation price of 55-60k, or go higher in anticipation of negotiating down. I would also tell them you believe your 50/50 share amounts to (insert correct figures) but you'll settle for x for quick 'sale'.

One thing that I do believe, even if my figures are slightly out, is that they are not offering you a fair price.

But obviously it's up to you what you do. Gut instinct?

Lunar_Eclipse

Ames wrote: »

Just thought I'd update. I saw my solicitor today and she said that the 50k is far too low, we could sell it for 145 and I'd get that much or more. She also told me not to talk to dad and sister about it and have everything go through her.

Is the 30k estate debt you mentioned for 'mortgage' taken into account? I had assumed it was.

So if it sold for 145, you need to take out all selling costs, this 30k debt and an adjustment for different amounts spent on the house - then split the rest. I wouldn't have thought 50k was far too low on this basis, which is how I assumed it was being calculated (although as I've already said, it's not a fair offer and I wouldn't accept it personally!)

If you're saying you'll need to lay the estate debt AFTER receiving your 50k, then yes, it is far too low.

Please get all the help you can to protect yourself.

notanewuser

Your father won't be getting "hammered on tax". Or at least, he shouldn't be.

Ames

Yes, the 30k includes the mortgage. It's all the estate debt including solicitors fees but not including the amount that me, sister and dad put in. Sister says I should pay some of the estate debts out of what I get, and dad thinks I should pay half of the cost of getting it ready for them to rent out.

Lunar Eclipse, the house isn't worth that much because their 'improvements' have taken so long that it's cancelled out by falling house prices. And because they haven't finished any of the jobs they started. So people are viewing it and seeing a kitchen which isn't fully tiled, doesn't have kickboards and has gaps in the flooring. And then there's the bedrooms that have been repainted but the cutting out hasn't been done. Dad's 'I'll finish it before completion if there's an offer' doesn't seem to reassure potential buyers. It's still worth around 145 though, not the 120 sister is trying to claim. Which is a huge change in attitude from her 'it's not worth less than 160' attitude of a few days ago.

As far as value goes we'll listen to their mortgage valuation and if we're thousands out then of course we'll adjust what I'll accept.