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What do people think of this....thoughts, opinions please..
Comments
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TRAVELMAN wrote:Please everyone-this board is not about morals as such it's how to be debt free as quickly as possible!
If this board was just about trying to be debt free as quickly as possible, at whatever cost, then we would tell all new posters to run away to outer mongolia and live in a tent, you can be there in 12 hours and you will be debt free in 12 hours, because the evil banks will never find you. This board is not about that it's about finding solutions to each and every individual posters debts. There are some incredibly knowledgable people on here, who by judging people's income/debts/outgoings will give advice accordingly. Sometimes, (yes sometimes) the clever people say, bankruptcy does seem the best option for you, when the situation really is hopeless and all attempts have been made. This board might not be about morals, but we should certainly not be breaking the law by encouraging people that have wrecklessly run up large debts to just run away, when they don't really have to. I am just ranting...I just wanted to make the point that it is not about getting rid of debts asap ("fresh start"), it's about wanting to be debt free, in a year, or two or ten. I have personally found tightening my belt a very cathartic experience and a lesson that will stay with me forever. I have learned that I can be in control of money and it does not control me. Oh my God...shut me up.0 -
This bankruptcy business is making me really angry. At the risk of inducing wrath from some corners, why the heck should someone who has got themselves into loads of debt just get "baled out"?
Because the law allows it. And it's not quite as simple as getting baled out.
Yes, your debt gets written off but you have to present a budget to the OR and justify every amount for every type of expense.
The OR will not allow extravagance or budgetting for non-essential items.
You could be subject to an Income Order so that the OR takes your surplus income during your bankruptcy to pay something off your debts. This lasts until you are discharged.
You then don't get the chance to borrow again for 6 years.
And plenty of people still think it's something to be ashamed of.
Criminals "do time" and then get rehabilitated ... why not bankrupts?
(Me playing Devil's Advocate ... just for a change)
Warning ..... I'm a peri-menopausal axe-wielding maniac0 -
The intent of the bankruptcy laws is for those who have no hope of diggingout
without some kind of extreme remedy.
The intent is not that people would quit their well-paid jobs so that they could go bankrupt and stiff their creditors, when they are capable of paying. If too many people do that, bankruptcy laws will be tightened to the point where those who really need it won't have the option.
This is silly, really. The OP can slash his spending and be clear in three/four years, with a good credit record, and be able to get a mortgage. If he quits his job and goes bankrupt, his credit record is trashed, he probably couldn't get another job in financial services for years, he may NEVER get a job that pays as well as he has now, and he will be unlikely to be able to buy a house for six years or longer.
What some people are suggesting is horrific, both morally and financially. How many people would love to have even 1/2 his income, and they are suggesting he just throw it away.I have five stars! This doesn't mean that I know anything about any of the things I post. I could be a raving lunatic, or a brilliant genius, or just some guy on the internet. In fact, I could be all three at the same time.
If anything I say makes sense, then do it. If not, don't. Don't blame me or my stars if you do something stupid because I suggested it. I'm responsible for my own stupidity only. You are responsible for yours.
Why, I don't even have five stars anymore! Aren't you glad you aren't responsible for my stupidity?0 -
The law is there-DonM can use it if HE feels he wants/needs to. As soon as he is discharged several Mortgage lenders will offer up to 90% Loan to value at base rate + 2/3%-this reducing after clear payments for 2 years.
Morally it's DOnM's call -not anyone elses.
Morals don't come in to this-it's how HE feels & what action HE wants to take. I'm just presenting some options-it was the best thing for my other 1/2 in her circumstances. As I've said not suitable for all!
End of0 -
DiggingOut wrote:3. If it is an option, it's counterproductive To encourage him to do anything else is like giving heroin to a junkie. He's recovering. Running away is detrimental. If he runs from this, he'll end up in destructive/compulsive behaviour again -- if not gambling, something else.
Absolutely.0 -
TRAVELMAN wrote:The law is there-DonM can use it if HE feels he wants/needs to. As soon as he is discharged several Mortgage lenders will offer up to 90% Loan to value at base rate + 2/3%-this reducing after clear payments for 2 years.
Morally it's DOnM's call -not anyone elses.
Morals don't come in to this-it's how HE feels & what action HE wants to take.
All fine in principle, but I make it that the OP is on a salary of about £46,000 a year at the age of 27. It seems clear that he's reluctant to reduce his lifestyle in order to be debt-free quicker. My guess would be that any approach requiring him to do so is likely to fail. Tightening his belt just isn't his thing.
Also, going bankrupt involves defaulting on what he owes his woman. That's not going to play well.0 -
I agree 100% with Digging_Out.
I am sure I am clever enough to have used those bankruptcy laws to have escaped ENORMOUS debt if I had wanted to when I have been unemployed.
I knew someone once - I think I even called him "friend". He took his bank and other creditors for around £50,000 about 10 years ago. Laughed about it he did. Still drove round in a Merc with a personal number. Suggested there was a lot of it about even then!
And then I shared rooms with a guy who was self-employed like a lot of IT people were a few years back and ran up about £40,000 of Inland Revenue debt. He also laughed about how he got his accountant to write a sob story and within a very short while got the whole debt written off. Him with his huge great 4WD parked outside next to my two bob Citroen. And what I found even more amazing was that he was a bloody freemason! He must be their worst student - worst I ever came across! He came home late one day and said he had walked an old lady home who had been discharged from hospital and whom he found wandering confused innthe street. Right Jekyl and Hyde he was! Probably a typical citizen!
Years ago I knew a foreign student who went back home afterwards and told me he just stopped paying his Barclaycard.
Such people may be okay to chat with in normal social circumstances but really they are parasites.
I am not saying our young friend here is tempted to become one but repeatedly inviting him to consider it at this stage I consider immoral.
Let him try the constructive ideas. He isn't desperate just yet and he could get to feel proud of himself yet.0 -
going bankrupt is not the answer: if the OP quits his job to become bankrupt, how does he plan on maintaining his lifestyle which he is (at the present time) unwilling to cut back on, even for the short term?2014 Target;
To overpay CC by £1,000.
Overpayment to date : £310
2nd Purse Challenge:
£15.88 saved to date0 -
If you believe this....TRAVELMAN wrote:Morally it's DOnM's call -not anyone elses.
...then why do you say this?TRAVELMAN wrote:Morals don't come in to this-it's how HE feels & what action HE wants to take.
Rather inconsistent, here. "It's his call morally, but it isn't a moral question".
Of course, morals aren't defined by what you or DonM think. There is such a thing as right and wrong, whether a person agrees with it or not. How he FEELS does not define morally right or wrong. I sometimes FEEL like doing things that are morally wrong. We all do.
You ought to consider the morality of what you are doing. Counsellors have to deal with people all the time who have "friends" like you. Sometimes the morally wrong thing that I FEEL like doing is going out and shooting the "friends" of some of the people I work with, who encourage them to go right back to the old irresponsible patterns that have caused them so much trouble.I have five stars! This doesn't mean that I know anything about any of the things I post. I could be a raving lunatic, or a brilliant genius, or just some guy on the internet. In fact, I could be all three at the same time.
If anything I say makes sense, then do it. If not, don't. Don't blame me or my stars if you do something stupid because I suggested it. I'm responsible for my own stupidity only. You are responsible for yours.
Why, I don't even have five stars anymore! Aren't you glad you aren't responsible for my stupidity?0 -
Some very desperate people will post here about Bankruptcy. For some of them, this will be their best way out.
It would be a travesty if they were put off by the pontifications of this thread. MSEers will have failed, in these cases.
ENOUGH ... the moral issues are not suitable for this Board. Please ....Warning ..... I'm a peri-menopausal axe-wielding maniac0
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