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What do people think of this....thoughts, opinions please..

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Comments

  • DiggingOut
    DiggingOut Posts: 770 Forumite
    Why not, Travelman?

    1. It's dishonest. He borrowed the money, he should repay it if he can. And he can, and he said himself that he knows that he should.

    2. It's possibility not even an option, because of the gambling thing.

    3. If it is an option, it's counterproductive To encourage him to do anything else is like giving heroin to a junkie. He's recovering. Running away is detrimental. If he runs from this, he'll end up in destructive/compulsive behaviour again -- if not gambling, something else. Ask any counsellor.

    4. It affects what you see when you look in a mirror. He has enough regrets already. He doesn't need to feel guilty over stiffing his creditors when he didn't have to.
    I have five stars! This doesn't mean that I know anything about any of the things I post. I could be a raving lunatic, or a brilliant genius, or just some guy on the internet. In fact, I could be all three at the same time.

    If anything I say makes sense, then do it. If not, don't. Don't blame me or my stars if you do something stupid because I suggested it. I'm responsible for my own stupidity only. You are responsible for yours.

    Why, I don't even have five stars anymore! Aren't you glad you aren't responsible for my stupidity?
  • TRAVELMAN_2
    TRAVELMAN_2 Posts: 864 Forumite
    But it's NOT running away! He still has to go to the Court & have a meeting with the official receiver.

    This is why I've suggested it. It's a complete 'fresh slate' for him. On the gambling thing sure it's up to him to sort out but if the debt is weighing heavily it's an option. If Donmonster wants to keep his current job/level of income (daft in my opinion as if his outgoings exceed his income then on payments order will be made which will last for 3 years-otherwise 1 year max) & have the moral satisfaction of paying his creditors back then if, say he has £200 spare £100 would go back to the creditors approx via the official receiver. That's a kind of psychological healing if you like.

    I say why bother? If he can take a pay cut, tighten his belt (obviously then this will restrist the going out bit/football, etc) for a year, then why not?

    It's an option open to him-after all he's an adult.

    I suspect a lot of people on here have had huge struggles with money & upset & are slowly paying it back & get narked with people mentioning Bankruptcy as it seems to them to be 'easy'. Well, it is 'easy' (relatively speaking) IF you have no assets like a house, posh car etc...so I'm not saying it's for all but it's certainly an option.

    My other 1/2 thinks it's the best thing she could have ever done. For the sake of 1/2 an hour in Court (she did not even see the judge) & a 2 hour meeting £19000 GONE-no more letters, phone calls & she can start afresh.

    It's just an option to consider.There is no where near the stigma attached today as there was before. And remember, because it's on his credit file for six years he won't be able to get any form of credit (with the exception of a mortgage at say 2/3% over base rate & for the sole purpose of buying a house-no extra to waste) anyway as his bank a/c will be stuck on 'basic' setting for 5/6 years-so this is a lesson in itself.
  • mountainofdebt
    mountainofdebt Posts: 7,795 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    and I know I'm repeating myself here, is that if the OP makes himself bankrupt then it will probably result in consequences at work....I honestly believe that you can not be declared bankrupt and work in the financial sector.

    (I know when I worked at Natwest, not so long ago I couldn't even go overdrawn without my manager being informed!!!)

    The OP will really and truely up the creek without a paddle if this happens.
    2014 Target;
    To overpay CC by £1,000.
    Overpayment to date : £310

    2nd Purse Challenge:
    £15.88 saved to date
  • TRAVELMAN_2
    TRAVELMAN_2 Posts: 864 Forumite
    Mountain of debt-yes-aware it might be difficult but in his 1st post he said he was not keen on his job at all.

    Why not leave!!! If he is unemployed then no payment order will be made & £50 k gone in 1 year maximum-fresh start! Or...leave & take another, lower paid job. Or, as a 3rd choice-why not do some charity work abroad for 6 months-by which time in all probability he'd have been discharged early & be FREE-new start!

    We're not on here really to talk about the moral's ie 'I've scrimped for 4 years & will have paid it all off by x', etc or to condone Bankruptcy, but in many cases (certainly not all) it is a good option to consider.

    Then it's all done-fresh start! & As for a previous poster that says Bankruptcy is 'dishonest' well it can't be-you swear an oath when you hand over the papers!

    DomM MAY want to keep on 'living outside his means' or 'have a bit of a head in the clouds' attitude but whatever he's thinking the debt (does not matter how it was accrued-that's not the job of this board) IS & WILL weigh on his mind. Bankruptcy might be the way to achieve 'debt free wababee' status-after all that's the title of this board!
  • ceegee
    ceegee Posts: 856 Forumite
    This bankruptcy business is making me really angry. At the risk of inducing wrath from some corners, why the heck should someone who has got themselves into loads of debt just get "baled out"? Most of us work hard and live within our means. Personally, I find paying a mortgage and bringing up children on just over £1000 per month is not easy and some people have even less than that. Donmonster has a fabulous income and he should jolly well get himself out of his debt. Exaggerating his rent and planning £1000 holidays is indicative of the attitude that got him into this mess in the first place.

    There is so much good advice on this website. Donmonster should have a good trawl through the site, face up to his responsibilities and sort out his financial problems in an adult way, instead of ducking and diving and messing about.

    Rant over. I do hope that Donmonster gets everything sorted out....there is no excuse for him not to. He has a good chance if he puts his mind to it. He has an obviously loving girlfriend, lots of agencies such as the CAB and Debtline and a plethora of good advice on this site. Go on, Donmonster, get cracking and report back with every positive step you make on the road to recovery!
    :snow_grin"Let it snow, let it snow, let it snow........":snow_grin
  • TRAVELMAN_2
    TRAVELMAN_2 Posts: 864 Forumite
    Why oh why does Bankruptcy evoke such passions? Granted, it's easier & quicker than it's ever been but is not for all-if you have a family/house with equity, etc....

    This could be just the fresh start he needs. Done a bit more research & as he's in a DMA plan & acknowledged the gambling problem as long as he's honest with the official receiver he should be fine!

    We're all different with different ways of dealing with things. If DonM quit his job (& took on a more enjoyable job), & went Bankrupt it would probably all be over in a year max.

    Everyone is in different circumstances & I applaud those that have dug themselves out of debt.

    But-to cut to the chase-the quickest (& I'm not talking about morals-that's up to DonM) way to acheive this board title of 'debt free wanabee' is this route.
  • DiggingOut
    DiggingOut Posts: 770 Forumite
    Sorry, Travelman, it's dishonest. The OP agreed to pay the money when he borrowed it. If he doesn't pay it when he's able to, he's broken his word. He signed a contract that he would pay it, and you are proposing that he not pay it when he can. That's dishonest, no matter how you slice it.

    If your mate borrows money from you, has a good job and can pay it, but goes bankrupt (or quits his job so he can go bankrupt), you would say he's dishonest. You wouldn't say, "Why not? Fresh start!"

    The same principle applies, even if you aren't the creditor that gets stiffed.

    "Swear an oath" -- what a joke! That makes it honest to break your word?
    I have five stars! This doesn't mean that I know anything about any of the things I post. I could be a raving lunatic, or a brilliant genius, or just some guy on the internet. In fact, I could be all three at the same time.

    If anything I say makes sense, then do it. If not, don't. Don't blame me or my stars if you do something stupid because I suggested it. I'm responsible for my own stupidity only. You are responsible for yours.

    Why, I don't even have five stars anymore! Aren't you glad you aren't responsible for my stupidity?
  • TRAVELMAN_2
    TRAVELMAN_2 Posts: 864 Forumite
    Digging out....Sorry....I was saying that the PROCESS of going Bankrupt is not dishonest (I thought you were implying that just because people go Bankrupt it's a dishonest thing to do)-did not think you were refering directly to DonM's signing of his credit agreement.

    Crossed wires I think....

    Yes-we could all get a bit moral & say it should all be paid back, etc... you signed the agreement...etc..As an example...my other 1/2 who has come here from France & has recently gone BR was on a fairly low wage. LLoyds gave her an overdraft ('all students & young people have them ') credit cards, 16% loans to clear cards....the cycle continued until we sat down & worked it all out. She'd have taken 10 years to clear it with the pittance she had left over!! Stupid....naive....YES. head in the clouds 'yes'! So for her it was the best option-no more calls/letters & she can afford heinz not value beans (!!!).

    Granted-DonM COULD pay it all off, write endless letters, offer full & final settlements OR could leave the job he dislikes & have a fresh start maximum of 1 year on!

    If you look up the rules on Insolvency it just says that 'I can't pay my debts' so then the official receiver takes over his finances & pays anything left to the creditors.If DonM feels particularly moral he can stay on the same income & pay approx 50/60% of his excess income (via the receiver) for 3 years to his creditors.

    Or...he can get a lower paid job & tighten his belt for a year maximum.Or..he could go off doing charity work abroad with his girlfriend. All new starts!

    The title od this board is 'debt free wanabee' & if DonM went BR the longest in my opinion he'd have 'debt's (meaning his monthly payment to the OR) would be 3 years. An IVA lasts 5 years & the effect on your credit file is the same.

    It's just an option. Please everyone-this board is not about morals as such it's how to be debt free as quickly as possible!
  • Malestrom
    Malestrom Posts: 983 Forumite
    People, can we please remember that we are here to offer advice and support. Bankruptcy is just as much an option to the OP as it is to everyone else. He has been given advice and can make a decision based on this advice if he so wishes.

    Lets please leave the arguements about morality to another day.
    He huihuinga taangata he pukenga whakaaro – A meeting of people; a wellspring of ideas (Maori proverb)
  • Sofa_Sogood
    Sofa_Sogood Posts: 5,258 Forumite
    Maybe if the OP read this thread:

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=28382&page=1&pp=40

    he might understand where the people who are against him going bankrupt, and suggesting other alternatives, are coming from?

    It's just a thought. Good luck.
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