Coalition crack on to cutting benefits to Baby Factories

Rochdale_Pioneers

Out of interest, how do you differentiate between the "baby factories" and the "deserving poor"?

Its very easy. Man has a large family (4 kids or more), and works. Man gets made redundant by his local government employer, and sees his redundancy package slashed vs whats contracted. man then finds himself and another half million people on the dole. 4 kids suddenly feels expensive, but thats not the least of his problems. Man rents his house, man now finds he won't be given enough housing benefit to stay living there.

So how many working families will we see over the next year where losing their job thanks to government policy also sees them lose their house and have to move away from their friends, families, schools etc? Never mind the scroungers who we all hate, what about the poor sods who will be caught in the crossfire?

silvercar

How many large families are there really? Thinking of all the people I know of, I can't think of anyone with more than 4 kids.

ILW

Rochdale_Pioneers wrote: »

Out of interest, how do you differentiate between the "baby factories" and the "deserving poor"?

Its very easy. Man has a large family (4 kids or more), and works. Man gets made redundant by his local government employer, and sees his redundancy package slashed vs whats contracted. man then finds himself and another half million people on the dole. 4 kids suddenly feels expensive, but thats not the least of his problems. Man rents his house, man now finds he won't be given enough housing benefit to stay living there.

Or in some cases, after losing job, man goes on to have at least one more child every year for the next 6 or 7 years. Despite having no way of supporting them himself. That would be my definition of undeserving.

SingleSue

I know I am going to regret posting on this thread but what the hey...here goes.

The economy is in deep doo doo and something really needs to be done and that something involves trying to tackle the biggies, the things which cost the country a large amount. One of those things and one could say, an easier target, is the benefits bill.

The middle earners have already been hit with the loss of child benefit and tax credits (for over certain incomes), so now it is the turn of those at the bottom of the chain...tough as that may be.

We all need to share the pain.

Right, onto a few points I thought about reading through....

Most people know I have disabled children, believe me, I would prefer them not to have disabilities but (and this is a big but), a child can have disabilities but no extra payments are being received for them. Of course, there will always be those who make things seem worse than they are for the money but I would think the numbers of these would be a lot smaller than the genuine ones (have you seen how hard it is to get DLA these days?).

As an example - All 3 of my boys have disabilities but only one receives DLA as eldest son does not think his condition warrants a claim (and at 17, it is his decision) and middle son improved for a time and again, didn't warrant a claim...but they still have their disabilities and all the problems which crop up from time to time (in middle sons case we are currently going through a bad phase).

Ok, next item on my list.....

Wii's, Xbox 360's etc....yes we have them in our house but I have not purchased them, both middle and eldest son saved their pocket money for a whole year, asked for money for birthdays and Christmas from all the family, did odd jobs for relatives and eventually had enough to buy them themselves.

Finally - why on earth would people want THAT many kids? 3 was way enough for me.

Kohoutek

Rochdale_Pioneers wrote: »

Its very easy. Man has a large family (4 kids or more), and works. Man gets made redundant by his local government employer, and sees his redundancy package slashed vs whats contracted. man then finds himself and another half million people on the dole. 4 kids suddenly feels expensive, but thats not the least of his problems. Man rents his house, man now finds he won't be given enough housing benefit to stay living there.

How many people that work for local government can afford more than four kids (without benefits)?

dori2o

Why are we not hitting those who caused the crash. We've hit the middle earners, now we're hitting the poor, when are the rich/higher earners going to be hit. Bankers are still receiving monsterous bonuses yet they are responsible for the most significant part of the crash.

They seem to be able to dictate to the government exactly what their terms are and simply threaten to walk away if they don't get what they want.

Well you know what, it's your turn, and if you don't like it F*** O**.

ILW

dori2o wrote: »

Why are we not hitting those who caused the crash. We've hit the middle earners, now we're hitting the poor, when are the rich/higher earners going to be hit. Bankers are still receiving monsterous bonuses yet they are responsible for the most significant part of the crash.

They seem to be able to dictate to the government exactly what their terms are and simply threaten to walk away if they don't get what they want.

Well you know what, it's your turn, and if you don't like it F*** O**.

Quite a few already have and are happy to be based in Switzerland paying virtually no tax.

dopester

My gran was the seventh child (of nine I think), and her mother had also herself been the seventh child to her mother. It was different back then though. And they didn't do much complaining about having to share rooms, as they do today - or they just got on with it for that is all they knew. Although I've heard one story about gran having all her makeup stolen/used by older girls/sisters.

There was also a need for an increasing population (probably) growing numbers in other countries (= require a matching number to help for any future defence of the UK).. but there would be decades of continual growth and rising living standards.. eg early days.. jobs in biscuit factories for the girls, many a job opportunity for the men, houses to be built, car industry (until it got messed up in 70s)... a progressing UK for decades.

As for high populations today UK.. and apparently needing people to take over the jobs from the aging... I'm not convinced. Like the woman on Radio 5 yesterday saying very few jobs in Glasgow. Unless more people are going to leave the assembly lines where trade is in decline due to overcapacity at much lower wage levels in other parts of the world, and can join and make contibutions of value to technical orientated / computer and tech / science lines of work, where demand and higher pay should be. Other jobs, from joiner to solicitors, the pay is very dependant upon velocity of money in the economy, imo.

A._Badger

dori2o wrote: »

Why are we not hitting those who caused the crash. We've hit the middle earners, now we're hitting the poor, when are the rich/higher earners going to be hit. Bankers are still receiving monsterous bonuses yet they are responsible for the most significant part of the crash.

They seem to be able to dictate to the government exactly what their terms are and simply threaten to walk away if they don't get what they want.

Well you know what, it's your turn, and if you don't like it F*** O**.

Actually, the greatest culprits weren't the bankers but the politicians who sat on their hands while this mess was being created and, in many respects, generated the mess in the first place.

When are they going to be held to account? As far as I can see, whether it's the past two administrations here or in the USA, they are all still living like princes at our expense and pontificating as if they had a clue.

Snooze

Rochdale_Pioneers wrote: »

Out of interest, how do you differentiate between the "baby factories" and the "deserving poor"?

Its very easy. Man has a large family (4 kids or more), and works. Man gets made redundant by his local government employer, and sees his redundancy package slashed vs whats contracted. man then finds himself and another half million people on the dole. 4 kids suddenly feels expensive, but thats not the least of his problems. Man rents his house, man now finds he won't be given enough housing benefit to stay living there.

So how many working families will we see over the next year where losing their job thanks to government policy also sees them lose their house and have to move away from their friends, families, schools etc? Never mind the scroungers who we all hate, what about the poor sods who will be caught in the crossfire?

Tough. Should have thought of that before churning out a load of kids with no financial safety net expecting the tax payer to pay for them.