Where would I stand with job centre?

freakyogre

Sorry for another long post, I wanted to get all the details in.

I applied for a job a couple of weeks ago (sent my CV only) which was advertised as a 'payment area supervisor/till operative' in a garden centre. I have a background in admin/training and customer service and really do enjoy dealing with customers so thought i'd give it a go. I do not however, know a thing about gardening or plants. The job description sounded like the 'supervisor' part was the main bit of the job with occasional lifting/general store work (although does state may include these).

I received a call on Friday to say that they actually have a job at their head office (admin) that I would be more suited to. This wasn't advertised with the others so I wasn't aware of it. I said I was very interested in the other job as obviously know more on the admin side. He said that he was away for 2 weeks, but if I wanted to go to the garden centre I originally applied for on a trial basis I could do and he'd talk to me about the other when he gets back, as long as the trial goes ok. I asked if by doing this I may miss out on the admin job, but he said no.
He even started discussing relocating for that job which came as a bit of a shock as it was very early days! I said I would be happy to go in on Monday and that was that.
I phoned the job centre to let them know as I was due to sign on yesterday and also was due to have a back to work session meeting today. I wasn't sure if I would be paid for the trial or not though so they said that I needed to speak to someone inparticular and to call back on Tuesday as Monday was a bank holiday.

Anyway. I arrived on Monday not sure what to expect so wore smart clothes (shirt, black trousers...heels!) as was half expecting an interview and got a look as though I was an alien. I was asked if i'd be ok with what I was wearing and I said yes as assumed i'd be on the tills. Nope. The first job I was asked to do was to brush and mop the toilet floor, that was fine, I can clean quite happily. Once that was done I was asked to help cut back some of the plants. Now bear in mind I do not have a garden and managed to kill cress when I tried to grow it, this may not have been a good idea!! I got on with it though and did plant after plant, row after row. This is all I did all day.
Obviously by 5pm I was in quite a lot of pain as pottering around a garden centre in heels isn't a good idea, I know this now
During the day the manager asked me if I was expecting an admin role as there was one coming up at head office, I said that yes, this was mentioned, but I knew this role I was doing there and then wasn't admin (but wasn't sure what to expect).
I also asked if I would be paid as needed to advise the job centre and it was said that I wouldn't for Monday, but would after then. Fair enough.

I went in yesterday and did two jobs all day. The first was carrying on with chopping the plants, the second was to pick up any plants that had fallen over. Considering it was VERY windy here yesterday, I was picking them up, walking to the end of the aisle only for them to blow over again. It got quite annoying when a tree as big as me decided to keep falling over on to my head.
I phoned the job centre in the morning and asked them to close my claim, but explained it was a trial at the moment. The man I spoke to started asking me if I wanted to claim for working tax credits instead, as i've never been asked before (I assume it's an age thing as i've recently turned 25) I said yes. He said that it would take about half an hour, so I said that i'd have to do that another time as was about to start work and couldn't hang about on the phone! He said he'd do it all later when I phoned back. I again said not to bother with tax credits, I just wanted to close my claim, but again he said he'd do it all when I phoned back. I said that I didn't want to get into trouble for working and my claim still being open, but he said he'd put a note on the system. I haven't been able to phone them back yet as their hours clash with mine, so I really don't know if he has done anything.

I spoke to various people last night and had pretty much decided to jack it in this morning, but then decided to give it another go as it's a job at the end of the day and may lead to something else.

Today I spent most of day lining up plants, a job I got the impression was well overdue as they're short staffed and heard them say a couple of times that they kept meaning to do it, but didn't have the time.
Inbetween lining them up I had to go and get the trolleys to put them on and once lined up, dragged them to another area and line them up again as they'd moved. Why I couldn't line then up once I got to their destination i'll never know!
It was raining all afternoon and not being a outdoor person I don't have waterproof clothing so by 5pm I was soaked to the skin and covered in soil/mud. They said a couple of times about buying waterproofs, but I don't see why I should for a trial job for 2 weeks that may not lead anywhere.

I also have a couple of concerns as they haven't even taken my bank details yet, so i'm not sure how they're planning on paying me (if they are).
They haven't attempted to show me around the tills, or even the store, I am just waved off in a general direction and expected to find my way (it's very big). Today when the others were busy out back and I was lining yet more plants up, I had to go and get one of them whenever a customer needed help or wanted to buy something.

I think they are just using me to cover while they're short staffed as I would expect after 3 days they would have shown me how to use the tills, but it hasn't even been mentioned.

SO! To the point of this whole story.

I am considering going in tomorrow and explaining to the manager that this isn't what I was expecting (they know this already, but i'm not sure they realise which job I initially applied for) and am not happy to continue with the trial.
I will then contact the 'boss' (I have his email address) who first phoned me and explain that I am interested in the other job and obviously if it's still there when he returns and they still want me, i'd like to give it a go. I realise that by doing this I am putting myself at risk of them thinking that I can't cope and have walked out after 3 days and not offering me the other job.
On the other hand I could have been using the last 3 days to find a suitable job, whereas I haven't as hoped this might work out.

At the moment I do not know if the job centre have closed my claim as the man I spoke to the other day wasn't very clear. If they haven't, then they will be wondering where I was yesterday and also today, so might think I just haven't bothered.

If they haven't closed my claim and I ring them and explain what's happened, would I still continue to get JSA or by not turning up yesterday, is that the end of it?
If they have closed it and I ring them and explain, would I be entitled to JSA? I am a bit concerned as it may be classed as me 'quitting' but it is just a trial, not an actual job at the moment.


Sorry again for such a long post. I know i'll probably get some replies along the lines that I am pathetic for wanting to quit and it's better than nothing and I feel the same way too, but i'm really not sure how long I can stick at it.

Thanks for any help!

111222

They will probably have closed your claim. You will have to restart it through a rapid relclaim which would take a week or so to process but i would apply from when your started it.

As for the job not sure if the JC would expect you to carry on with it, i think you will be ok there. But i sounds a bit of ridiculous situation an admin doing that kind of work. It reminds me of this harry enfield sketch, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZEav9A801A

But i can see where you are coming from, kind of stuck in the middle. Get in touch with JS ASAP and stick in there!

freakyogre

I phoned the job centre at 8am to see if they could check if my claim had been closed, the girl I spoke to said it would have been and i'd need to make another claim, but to speak to who I spoke to the other day and see if they know more.

I drove to work, but stopped up the road and phoned the job centre again, ended up speaking to the same man I did on Tuesday. He advised that my claim is still open and he had put all the notes on there.
I explained that the trial wasn't working out and asked what would happen if I stopped it today, he said that there was a possibility I would be sanctioned as it may be classed as giving the job up. I tried to explain that as a trial, surely if it doesn't work out either way, they can get rid of me or I can leave without an issue? Also, the fact that they have taken no details from me, or given me any sort of induction (including showing me fire exits and health and safety etc) surely means I am not employed by them either.
I made it clear that I wasn't expecting to be paid for the 3 days (how can I if they haven't taken any bank details!) and I wouldn't expect to be paid JSA for this week, i'll just have to lose out. All I wanted to clarify was, if I leave the 'job' today, can I still claim JSA. He wasn't sure, so said he'd speak to someone and call me back.

By now it was 9:15 and i'm sure they were wondering where I was. He phoned back and said that someone else would phone me back at lunchtime to discuss it as it was a complicated issue. I tried to ask him more questions, but as the other department deal with it, he couldn't tell me.

I once again explained the situation but he kept saying I was best to speak to ACAS as it was complicated. I said that I really wasn't going to go down that route as to me it's a trial, it either works out or it doesn't, I just want to put it down as experience and move on and look for another appropriate job.

So I am waiting for a call from them at the moment. I decided not to go back, I was going to go in and see her but ended up getting worked up on the phone so thought it probably wasn't a good idea.
I feel really bad for just not turning up, so will try and find a number for the store (although I never saw anything but the managers mobile) so may be difficult. If not, i'll send an email to the 'boss' who phoned me the other day and explain why I didn't turn up and see what happens. I doubt very much they will consider me for the other job now, but it's a risk i've taken.



Well they just phoned back and asked if I had worked more or less than 16 hours as if it's less they can keep my claim open, but if more they'd have to close it. I explained that I wouldn't be paid anyway but they said it was based on looking for work, so over 16 then I could be unavailable. I said that if they were only counting Tuesday and Wednesday which is when I phoned them from, then it was only 14.
He has put me down as 'failed to sign on' and I am due to go in tomorrow morning so will probably have to go through it again.

Back to job hunting...

mizzbiz

What a nightmare FO. I don' thave any advice other than the JC can be right pains over anything out of the ordinary like this. TBH it's the company you are working for who are out of order and I would take issue with them. If you apply for admin/tills you should not expect to have to line up plants for three days strong in all weathers after mopping out their toilets. Their attitude is disgusting.

Good luck with getting it sorted.

busy_mom_2

mizzbiz wrote: »

What a nightmare FO. I don' thave any advice other than the JC can be right pains over anything out of the ordinary like this. TBH it's the company you are working for who are out of order and I would take issue with them. If you apply for admin/tills you should not expect to have to line up plants for three days strong in all weathers after mopping out their toilets. Their attitude is disgusting.

Good luck with getting it sorted.

Sorry but I feel you are being unfair on the jobcentre, we have rules and process to adhere to same as anyone else. I do see what issus the OP has but the process and reasons would have to be looked at by a decision maker. The employer will be contacted and both sides of the story addressed then a fair decision made.
There is a work trial procedure to follow which could have been taken with support from the jobcentre had they been notified before the trial. Had the trial not worked out no issues. The employer would also have had to give full job desription so Op would have know duties before hand and if job altered jobcentre could of helped.

onlyforboards_2

busy_mom wrote: »

There is a work trial procedure to follow which could have been taken with support from the jobcentre had they been notified before the trial. Had the trial not worked out no issues. The employer would also have had to give full job desription so Op would have know duties before hand and if job altered jobcentre could of helped.

Yes, very strange situation for the op.

freakyogre

busy_mom wrote: »

Sorry but I feel you are being unfair on the jobcentre, we have rules and process to adhere to same as anyone else. I do see what issus the OP has but the process and reasons would have to be looked at by a decision maker. The employer will be contacted and both sides of the story addressed then a fair decision made.
There is a work trial procedure to follow which could have been taken with support from the jobcentre had they been notified before the trial. Had the trial not worked out no issues. The employer would also have had to give full job desription so Op would have know duties before hand and if job altered jobcentre could of helped.

But would they be classed as my employer when it's a trial? No details were taken, they didn't even know my name when I turned up on Monday, I have a feeling I was just being used to cover as they're short staffed. I wasn't willing to take the risk that in 2 weeks time they turn round and say the other job has been filled/didn't exist. I know I am unlikely to find another job in that time, but i've taken that risk.

I'm not sure if you mean the work trial through the job centre which i've heard about, but this wasn't through them. I found the job (which was advertised on the job centre site as well as their own), applied and then was offered the trial direct. I do find it strange that the jobs are now not advertised on their website, so there is no job description for people to see. They are however advertising in store and handing out application forms which I got a quick glimpse of. I did save the page from their website when they were listed so will take a printout with me tomorrow.

Maybe I was being unreasonable and not giving them a chance, but when talking to one of the people who worked there they said that whatever job you do there, it does involve what I was doing all the time, so to me, a job description saying 'may/occasional' isn't quite true.

That side of it doesn't really matter now as I didn't go back, I am just concerned how I stand with the job centre now which I suppose I will find out tomorrow morning.

viktory

All I can say is that you lasted longer than I would have!

tsimehC

Excuse my lack of knowledge on this matter but can't you continue to claim JSA while doing work trails? I thought that's how it worked? I find it amazing that you did those line of duties under that job role. I hope things work out well for you for tomorrow.

oldmotherreilly

You can continue to sign on with JCP, if it is a Work Trial that has been arranged through the Jobcentre. Other than this, it counts as employment. I would expect when you turn up for the 'failed to attend' interview, they will ask you to complete two forms-an A15C (gives details of the employer; dates and wages expected etc and is a one off form for part time employment) and a B7, which would normally be completed at each signing detailing the work you had completed in the previous two week JSA period. I would not imagine that they would send the claim to a Decision Maker, as if you are working then you obviously cannot attend to sign. If they do their jobs properly, however, when such part time employment finishes, JCP are supposed to contact the employer to ask for the reasons why the job finished and part time employment should be treated in the same way as if you were to leave a full time job: you could be sanctioned (ie JSA could be stopped for up to 26 weeks) for voluntarily leaving the job. Ultimately, that decision would be made by a Decision Maker and they would take into account all the things that you have mentioned (they write to you to ask why you left the job). From previous experience, during trial periods you tend to be OK but obviously this cannot be guaranteed. The other thing to point out is that this is what should happen, not always what does happen!

DCFC79

OP i get the feeling you were being used, you werent given no kind of induction or at least shown where the fire exits were and where the meeting point was in case of fire. You definitely have lasted longer than i would have done,