Ongoing claim for unprotected tenancy deposit -urgent help needed please!

Dawk

Hi everyone,

I'm currently in the process of claiming my deposit back through the county court, the landlord has been ignoring all contact since we moved out 6 months ago. We never got any information about whether the deposit was protected, or why he was choosing to retain our money.

We've sent a claim form, and recieved an acknowledgment of service in return. In the acknowledgement of service he said he intended to contest the claim because we caused damage requiring repairs costing more than our deposit, but didn't try to counter our claim that the deposit was unprotected. He attached some evidence, a list of supposed damages from the owners of the house (all of which was stuff we complained about because it was damaged when we moved in, a broken pipe reported immediately during our tenancy and promptly fixed, or things that were in perfect working order when we moved out) with a total sum of money rather than reciepts and an itemised list, and a cleaning bill (which again I don't want to pay, its £200 which seems excessive, although I'm sure I missed some bits of dusting etc, the house was mouldy and dirty when we moved in, not professionally cleaned). None of these bills are broken down, and no evidence is supplied to back up the claims that we damaged these things.

The deadline for submitting his defence has now passed and we've recieved nothing through the court. I know this means I should file a request for default judgement, but I'm worried about the attached "evidence" to the acknowledgment giving a false impression of us. Although I've included the fact that our deposit was unprotected in the claim I'm not trying to get him fined, just trying to get him to treat us fairly and come to some kind of settlement. The letter from the house owners claiming we should not recieve our deposit back was sent before our final two letters requesting any form of response from him. I will accept deductions for some cleaning etc., but not a full professional clean and repairs to a run down house so they can get it off the market. Should I file a request for default judgement, and if so is it appropriate to mention that I contest his claims in the acknowledgement? Or should I wait for a defence to be filed even though its several days past the deadline?

Thanks in advance!

clutton_2

have you got an inventory signed at the beginning of the tenancy by both you and the landlord ?

Dawk

clutton wrote: »

have you got an inventory signed at the beginning of the tenancy by both you and the landlord ?

Unfortunately not, we did tell the agent the list of problems with the house at the start of the tenancy, and handed over the list to his secretary. It was very stupid of me, because it means I don't have proof and now the things I complained immediately after moving in are now being charged to us. The house was an unfurnished let so no inventory.

Emma1973

Its not unfortunate for yourselves, its unfortunate for the Landlord! If he didnt do an inventory in the beginning, how can he prove you did the damage and that it wasnt there when you moved in? He cant, so push ahead with the default judgements, and yes, contest the claims, but personally I wouldnt make any offers to him at all, let the judge decide!

N79

Are you claiming for the deposit or deposit plus 3X penalty. If the latter be aware that there is no right of set off against damage. Ie the LL must pay the penalty to you even if the LL can prove that you cause more damage than the deposit. With some good argument and a sympathetic judge you might even manage to extend this to the original deposit sum (but in such a case the judge may simply order it protected and then award it to the LL). The point is that a judge can not do this with the 3x penalty - a fact that many judges have complained about.

If the former then don't agree to any deductions until the LL has proved them. If there is no inventory then they almost certainly can not. This LL has acted totally unreasonably do not let them make you feel guilty and agree to let them make some deductions just because you are a nice guy.

Dawk

Thanks everyone for the advice, it's really appreciated.

Just got my hearing date today and recieved a call from the owners of the house. Apparently the letting agent claimed we broke their boiler and didn't tell them about our complaints about existing damage when we moved in. The owners can't believe the landlord didn't take an inventory, forward on the invoices or get in contact with us and has apparently stopped answering the phone to them too. They didn't mention the deposit protection scheme (and neither did our landlord on his acknowledgement) so I'm not sure what's happening with that, I've heard mixed rulings on that as a lot of judges see it as unduly harsh, so if they convinced the judge we owe them for damages is the judge not likely to decide we don't deserve the fine as well? Doesn't sound like the landlord will be in touch so I guess I'll be in court within the week, scary!

clutton_2

small claims court is not at all scary - nothing like on the tele - you usually meet in a small room with one table - judge on one side you and the other party at another

It is perfectly legitiimate to take a friend in with you - and ask the judge (wigless and very informal) if it is ok to have Jo Bloggs as your "McKenzies Friend". This is someone who can sit next to you, whisper with you, make notes, support you, but who cannot speak on your behalf.

The judge may ask you state your case so you will have to explain your case to him/her (so practise with a friend in advance) - and teh judge will almost certanly then ask you a lot of questions until s/he understand the case fully.

go for it - landlords like this need showing up for the unprofessionals they are

tbs624

Dawk - did you use N1 or N208?

Dawk

Thanks clutton, I know its silly to imagine some horrible threatening scenario with a docks and wigs and gavels but it is off-putting not knowing what to expect. And as my partner is away on work it'll just be me against the defendants. When I talked to the owner on the phone I did express my regret that this was the only way we could get a response out of our letting agent, I do feel bad for them and hate taking them to court because it does seem like they trusted him and he let them down too. So I do want to show him up, I just can't help but feel guilty if the owners are the ones that pay for his unprofessionalism.

tbs624 - I used N208, seems the few I've heard who have made similar claims have gone with that as its quite a straightforward sum you're initially claiming for. Why do you ask?

clutton_2

i have made claims in the small claioms court twice in the last 2 years, and each judge (one man one woman) went out of their way to make me feel comfortable - and to explain what was happening as we went along. The judge should view the LL as a professional business person who knows what they are doing, and you, as an ordinary person who has no reason to fully understand the workings of the justice system.

try not to worry - as i said - practice your "story" in advance - alth you can never tell if a judge has already read it, or if they want it read out to them of it they want to ask you questions. THey will write a lot of notes and probably record their judgment onto tape, so it will take a little time to get through.


you may have some hours to wait as they schedule a lot of cases in one day - so take a book or magazine with you

good luck - let us now how you get on

Dawk

Thanks for the advice, I'll make sure I'm properly prepared and have everything I need.

I've had an offer, but it was for a third of the value of our deposit as a "goodwill gesture" so I've turned it down. They're trying to get me to suggest a figure but as far as I'm concerned my claim form should count as my offer and I don't see why I should keep suggesting lower numbers till they find one they like. Possibly we'll reach a settlement before the hearing, just want it over and done with so I can move on!