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  • FIRST POST
    • MSE Archna
    • By MSE Archna 18th Mar 08, 11:39 AM
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    MSE Archna
    TV Licence article Discussion
    • #1
    • 18th Mar 08, 11:39 AM
    TV Licence article Discussion 18th Mar 08 at 11:39 AM


    This thread is specifically to discuss the the


    To discuss or ask a question about this article: click reply
    Last edited by MSE Researcher; 14-06-2010 at 4:08 PM.
    Report inappropriate posts: forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com




Page 128
    • frecklepower
    • By frecklepower 24th Jul 17, 11:11 AM
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    frecklepower
    My 80-year old mum watches live TV in our house - do I need a license?
    My wife and I currently watch very little live TV, and we have been considering stopping completely and getting rid of the TV license. We are moving house in about two weeks, and this seems a good opportunity to make this change.

    However there is a complicating factor: we are converting one side of the house into an annex for my 80-year old mother. The annex will be in effect a fully functioning flat with its own front door, kitchen, bathroom etc, but is physically part of our house, and will use the same utilities, phone line and TV aerial input as the rest of the house. The work will take about six months, after which my mother will sell her current house, and move into the annex. My mother watches a lot of live TV, but currently in her own home does not need a license, as she is over 70.

    At the point my mother moves in, would we be obliged to buy a license, because one member of our household watches live TV via our house phone line and/or TV aerial, even though we ourselves do not watch live TV, and even though that sole family member is over 70? Would we need to install a separate aerial and/or set up a separate phone account for my mother if we wanted to continue without a TV license?
    • Cornucopia
    • By Cornucopia 24th Jul 17, 11:27 AM
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    Cornucopia
    Presently, the rule is that if there are ANY over-75s in the household then it qualifies for a Free Licence.

    However, this may well change over the coming years as the responsibility for the rules and the funding is moving from the Government to the BBC.

    So, however your accommodation is configured, your Mother will be entitled to a free Licence at the moment. At the stage at which she moves in, I would suggest simply asking TVL whether the Free Licence covers the whole property or just her annex(*), and then you can decide what to do with your part of the property with the benefit of that knowledge.

    (*) There are various considerations including whether all parties are family members, whether the properties have separate front doors, etc.
    I'm a Board Guide on the Phones & TV, Techie Stuff, In My Home,
    The Money Savers Arms and Food Shopping boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge threads there. Any views (especially those on the UK TV Licence) are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com.

    Board guides are not moderators. If you spot an inappropriate or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com
    • LeeUK
    • By LeeUK 24th Jul 17, 11:44 AM
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    LeeUK
    ^ The free over 75 TV licence will cover the whole property. If your annex is not listed as a dwelling in it's own right e.g. doesn't have it's own house number and isn't liable for it's own council tax, then don't be fobbed off into buying 2 separate licences from TVL.
    • Cornucopia
    • By Cornucopia 24th Jul 17, 12:06 PM
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    Cornucopia
    ... they all have cameras now.
    Originally posted by DavidP24
    Do they? I've not noticed it in any videos, though it's not always clear how old they are.
    I'm a Board Guide on the Phones & TV, Techie Stuff, In My Home,
    The Money Savers Arms and Food Shopping boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge threads there. Any views (especially those on the UK TV Licence) are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com.

    Board guides are not moderators. If you spot an inappropriate or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com
    • frecklepower
    • By frecklepower 24th Jul 17, 1:50 PM
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    frecklepower
    Thank you Cornucopia, LeeUK, DavidP24 for your helpful replies. I have been emboldened to take a look at the TV Licensing site, and found this statement:

    After your 75th birthday, you can get a free TV Licence. It covers you as well as anyone you live with.

    I had been worried that, as my wife and I are (or will be) the house owners, our under-75 status would trump my mother's over-75 status, and so we would need a full license to cover her usage. But the TVL site does not mention house ownership, only 'anyone you live with'. So that's clear enough: either my mother is deemed to be living with us, and therefore her free license is valid for her (and would cover us incidentally); or she does not live with us (ie her flat is deemed separate), her free license is valid for her, and we need pay the license fee only if we ourselves watch live TV. As Cornucopia advises, it will be worth us clarifying the actual 'living with' position with TVL when the time comes.
    • Bedsit Bob
    • By Bedsit Bob 24th Jul 17, 3:26 PM
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    Bedsit Bob
    If you do not need a licence they like you to tell them here:

    https://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/cs/no-licence-needed/about.app
    Originally posted by DavidP24
    But you should note that, it is merely what they would like you to do.

    There is no legal requirement for you to do, and doing so may result in them asking to search your home.
    My job is Top Secret. Even I don't know what I'm doing.

    Amount I have so far denied the BBC - £1161
    • Bedsit Bob
    • By Bedsit Bob 24th Jul 17, 3:30 PM
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    Bedsit Bob
    One said there was a Sky dish so they would apply for warrant.
    Originally posted by DavidP24
    Based on that logic, I have milk in my fridge, so I must own a cow.
    My job is Top Secret. Even I don't know what I'm doing.

    Amount I have so far denied the BBC - £1161
    • Bedsit Bob
    • By Bedsit Bob 24th Jul 17, 5:15 PM
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    Bedsit Bob
    they have what they call a "lighter" follow up even if you declare you do not need a licence.
    Originally posted by DavidP24
    In what way is it lighter

    Do they wear slippers, while conducting the search?
    My job is Top Secret. Even I don't know what I'm doing.

    Amount I have so far denied the BBC - £1161
    • Cornucopia
    • By Cornucopia 24th Jul 17, 5:32 PM
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    Cornucopia
    You can see from the videos I posted above that they have what they call a "lighter" follow up even if you declare you do not need a licence.
    Originally posted by DavidP24
    Sorry to be pedantic, but they SAY they have a "lighter" follow up. Like Bob, I am sceptical about what the difference could/should be - perhaps they only hammer on the door twice instead of three times?

    Most people who have dealt with TVL (from an unlicensed standpoint) for any period of time have been lied to many, many times and become somewhat weary of it. The level of trust is absolutely rock-bottom.
    Last edited by Cornucopia; 24-07-2017 at 5:58 PM.
    I'm a Board Guide on the Phones & TV, Techie Stuff, In My Home,
    The Money Savers Arms and Food Shopping boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge threads there. Any views (especially those on the UK TV Licence) are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com.

    Board guides are not moderators. If you spot an inappropriate or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com
    • Bedsit Bob
    • By Bedsit Bob 24th Jul 17, 7:58 PM
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    Bedsit Bob
    perhaps they only hammer on the door twice instead of three times?
    Originally posted by Cornucopia
    Unless it's Sheldon Cooper, in which case it'll always be three times.
    My job is Top Secret. Even I don't know what I'm doing.

    Amount I have so far denied the BBC - £1161
    • Lewie
    • By Lewie 24th Jul 17, 8:08 PM
    • 264 Posts
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    Lewie
    Time for another referendum me thinks!!
    • Cornucopia
    • By Cornucopia 25th Jul 17, 10:04 AM
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    Cornucopia
    Thankfully, there now seems to be a head of steam building against the BBC with the release of salary info and the realisation of a gender pay imbalance of shocking proportions. Apparently, it is not just the celebs. Across the whole BBC - an organisation of 8000 people - women are paid 10% less than men.

    I still wonder why what to me/us are manifest issues with TV Licensing have not resulted in either public uproar or action by MPs. I think an amount of it is that the BBC "have an answer for everything", and it is an issue that doesn't affect most people.

    Having said that, I am still plugging away and I know of many others who are doing the same. In my case, my MP has just written to Tony Hall on my behalf asking him to address shortcomings in the BBC complaints process regarding TV Licensing operations and policy.
    I'm a Board Guide on the Phones & TV, Techie Stuff, In My Home,
    The Money Savers Arms and Food Shopping boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge threads there. Any views (especially those on the UK TV Licence) are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com.

    Board guides are not moderators. If you spot an inappropriate or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com
    • Niv
    • By Niv 25th Jul 17, 1:57 PM
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    Niv
    IMO the BBC is not a wholly public service, it is (in a number of cases) a run of the mill broadcaster (albeit maybe better than some).


    Broadly agree with the above sentiment to split off things like radio, tv news and maybe some of the documentary type programmes then let the rest sink or swim on its own merits and be propped up by the licence fee. If people want to watch Graeme Norton et al then they will be happy to pay a subscription / watch adverts etc.
    YNWA

    Target: Mortgage free by 58.
    • Niv
    • By Niv 25th Jul 17, 1:59 PM
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    Niv
    [QUOTE=DavidP24;72887420]

    The commercial arm would move to a subscription model, based on the current pricing of all you can eat for £13 a month and smaller options. It would be phased in over 5 years so in year 1 they need to raise 20% and so on.


    [QUOTE]


    Are you kidding? £13 a month! Netflix is like £7pm I cant see people paying £13 voluntarily, the only reason people pay £12.12 is it is required to watch live tv, if it was just for the bbc I would be cancelling that today!
    YNWA

    Target: Mortgage free by 58.
    • Lewie
    • By Lewie 25th Jul 17, 2:13 PM
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    Lewie
    You're right Niv, folk wouldn't pay it.
    Lets set it at £15 just to makesure.
    Goodbye BBC, at last.
    • Niv
    • By Niv 26th Jul 17, 6:03 PM
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    Niv
    No I am not kidding, you are paying that now and so is everyone else with a TV licence
    it is just that it is enforced. You can bet the elderly will stick with it and so will those who are not price sensitive.

    The £13 is the full thing, I can see them offering packages a low as £5 a month, it is in their interests to address different demographics.

    Netflix is cheaper but Sky sell a load of tripe for £20 a month and it has ads, my idea would be to still have no ads but simply have a message at start and end saying brought to you by XYZ as well as product placement and of course international sales. BBC also have more programmes than Netflix by a factor of probably 1000 to 1.

    When it is run properly they will become more commercial, use their international sales to get competitive, maybe bid for programmes the way Sky does.

    I think if we have the licence phased out over 5 years at 20% year, they can offer the top up of licence, so £116 with £30 optional top up to access iPlayer, get access to some libraries only available via iPlayer.

    Then in year two it goes to £86 and £60 per annum, there would be a levy on all the channels as there is/was for C4 & C5 till it is on its own two feet.

    I would expect them to split the content between their free to air (covered by the remaining licence fee ) and paid content, so over the 5 year it is all moved to the subscription model except for community programming, news and radio. I think the documentaries would be split, the political ones would be part of BBC News or just under the community part, but the nature documentaries would definitely be paid content.

    They are already asking people for their licence via iplayer online, it is just a small step to add encryption and security.

    http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/141025-you-will-need-to-register-and-sign-in-for-bbc-iplayer-here-s-why
    Originally posted by DavidP24

    We are sort of paying that now; we are NOT paying £13 for BBC we are paying £13 for a tv licence, there is a massive difference. If I were given the choice to not have to pay for a tv licence if I stopped watching BBC then I would cancel it no doubt as I barely watch BBC.


    Regarding your sky claim: I pay £6.99 per month (soon to be £7.99) for sky channels via now tv (a sky owned platform), tripe or not is just an opinion of yours, I personally watch a lot more on the sky platform than I do current BBC/iplayer so its all relative.


    where do you get your stats of 1000:1 BBC:netflix? I cant believe that with no source as it sounds like the sort of thing spouted by someone trying to justify the BBC service you are suggesting.


    Just to make this clear, I am not anti BBC at all, I am simply saying that I cannot believe there will be a wholesale buy in of a £13 per month service simply for BBC , that is 8 channels plus iplayer and of those 8 channels some are quite specialist and I doubt they are all utilised by many. The nowtv equivalent is 11 channels including box sets.


    Also, just to point out as you not be aware; the popular programmes on the sky platform are available on catch up (in fact in some cases available on catch up before it has had its main airing!) and catch up has no ads.
    YNWA

    Target: Mortgage free by 58.
    • tonyb6101
    • By tonyb6101 26th Jul 17, 6:59 PM
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    tonyb6101
    Hi, I have a question about TV licensing. I realise you need a license to watch live TV but where does this leave the +1 channels like ITV+1 and Film4+1. Are these channels life or broadcasting catchup ? If ITV1 shows a program at 9pm and I watch it on ITV+1 at 10pm am i watching catchup TV or live TV? If this is live TV then how does it differ from me going onto the ITV hub and watching the original program shown on ITV1 at 10pm?

    I hope that makes sense
    Thnaks
    • Cornucopia
    • By Cornucopia 26th Jul 17, 7:54 PM
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    Cornucopia
    where does this leave the +1 channels like ITV+1 and Film4+1. Are these channels life or broadcasting catchup ? If ITV1 shows a program at 9pm and I watch it on ITV+1 at 10pm am i watching catchup TV or live TV?
    Originally posted by tonyb6101
    +1 channels are live linear TV broadcasts, and therefore require a TV Licence.

    If this is live TV then how does it differ from me going onto the ITV hub and watching the original program shown on ITV1 at 10pm?
    When you watch a +1 channel, it is being broadcast to everyone at the same time - it is a broadcast, for which a broadcast Licence is required.

    When you watch ITV Hub and other catch-up and video-on-demand services, you are watching your own personal copy of the program, cued up for you on the servers of the provider and streamed to you over the Internet.

    That difference between sharing a broadcast and having your own personal one-to-one copy is the difference between needing a Licence and not needing one. The rules for BBC iPlayer are a special case.
    I'm a Board Guide on the Phones & TV, Techie Stuff, In My Home,
    The Money Savers Arms and Food Shopping boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge threads there. Any views (especially those on the UK TV Licence) are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com.

    Board guides are not moderators. If you spot an inappropriate or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com
    • kristeva
    • By kristeva 26th Jul 17, 8:48 PM
    • 17 Posts
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    kristeva
    Apologies if this has been covered previously but can anyone tell me if there is a difference if any
    between a situation where a room is being 'rented' in a house share and a situation where someone is classified as 'lodging'. If in both situations the owner of the property has a TV license I assume both 'renter' or 'lodger' are covered? I know this may sound like a dumb question but when researching the subject I found some websites seemed to be quite confused on the issue.

    I've recently moved into a self contained / annexe situation so will now have to get a license - I've only been here 2 weeks and threatening letter already through the door! The money is a pain, but what concerns me more is making myself visible after having been 'off grid' for so long. If I lodge again in say 8 months time I'll just let the license expire but I'm guessing they'll be keen to know why, or where I'm going to?
    • Cornucopia
    • By Cornucopia 26th Jul 17, 9:21 PM
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    Cornucopia
    Apologies if this has been covered previously but can anyone tell me if there is a difference if any
    between a situation where a room is being 'rented' in a house share and a situation where someone is classified as 'lodging'.
    Originally posted by kristeva
    Can I suggest you read the guidance on the TVL website here: http://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/check-if-you-need-one/for-your-home/tenants-and-lodgers-aud2 rather than me copying & pasting it all. You'll need to click on the "+" signs to get the full text.

    I've recently moved into a self contained / annexe situation so will now have to get a license - I've only been here 2 weeks and threatening letter already through the door! The money is a pain, but what concerns me more is making myself visible after having been 'off grid' for so long. If I lodge again in say 8 months time I'll just let the license expire but I'm guessing they'll be keen to know why, or where I'm going to?
    You only need a Licence if you need one, which is to watch/record TV Broadcasts or use BBC iPlayer.

    If you paid for one year's Licence in one go, you can just let it lapse. TVL have no right to any info about you or what you are now doing.

    If you paid by DD, you'll need to contact them to cancel properly. They can ask, but the only reason why you'll need to find an answer is if you want a partial refund of your Licence payments. The only reason they now accept without asking for evidence is stopping watching TV.
    I'm a Board Guide on the Phones & TV, Techie Stuff, In My Home,
    The Money Savers Arms and Food Shopping boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge threads there. Any views (especially those on the UK TV Licence) are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com.

    Board guides are not moderators. If you spot an inappropriate or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com
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