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  • FIRST POST
    • tarden
    • By tarden 12th Feb 08, 1:01 PM
    • 41Posts
    • 21Thanks
    tarden
    CRB check question
    • #1
    • 12th Feb 08, 1:01 PM
    CRB check question 12th Feb 08 at 1:01 PM
    Hello,
    I am applying for a NHS job that requires a CRB check.
    Do I have to disclose my drink/driving conviction in 1989?
    Any advice welcomed, especially of there is anyone with personal experience.

    Thanks
Page 1
  • daveboy
    • #2
    • 12th Feb 08, 1:11 PM
    • #2
    • 12th Feb 08, 1:11 PM
    Please see the link below which is a PDF that refers to NHS Criminal Record Bureau disclosures:

    http://www.nhsemployers.org/workforce/workforce-2172.cfm

    Right at the bottom of the page is a link titled 'CRB Disclosures in the NHS' which opens up a PDF document.

    My personal feeling is that as it is the NHS it will fall under the Rehabilitation Of Offenders Act (Exemptions Order) 1975. Therefore you will have to disclose it, as an Enhanced CRB Disclosure will turn it up in any case.

    It won't necessarily stop you getting the position, as it was nearly 20 years ago. It may even be that it has been struck from the records on the basis of time, but I always feel that honesty is best in this situation - the last thing you want is to be dismissed in the future for not disclosing it at the earliest opportunity.
    Last edited by daveboy; 12-02-2008 at 1:13 PM.
    • tarden
    • By tarden 12th Feb 08, 1:21 PM
    • 41 Posts
    • 21 Thanks
    tarden
    • #3
    • 12th Feb 08, 1:21 PM
    • #3
    • 12th Feb 08, 1:21 PM
    Thanks very much, daveboy, for your prompt and very informative reply.
    I will disclose it. I don't think it should have any effect on my application given that it is a basic admin job, but who knows?
    Better safe than sorry.
    Thanks again.

    Tarden
  • daveboy
    • #4
    • 12th Feb 08, 1:24 PM
    • #4
    • 12th Feb 08, 1:24 PM
    Further to the above, I have just found this:

    http://www.prisonersabroad.org.uk/Downloads/Factsheets/Disclosing_offences.pdf

    It goes into the different rehabilitation periods, depending on what sentence was imposed by the courts.

    It also, and perhaps more relevant for you, goes into what should be kept on the police national computer (section 7).

    Please note that this is from searching online and it may well be advisable to contact your local police station for official guidance.

    It does appear to me that due to time elapsed, it may have been deleted from the records - if that is the case then I wouldn't disclose it.
    • Nile
    • By Nile 12th Feb 08, 1:26 PM
    • 14,028 Posts
    • 13,877 Thanks
    Nile
    • #5
    • 12th Feb 08, 1:26 PM
    • #5
    • 12th Feb 08, 1:26 PM
    Hello tarden

    You might find some useful information in the crb website:

    www.crb.gov.uk

    I believe that you will be filling in an 'Enhanced Disclosure' form. I have one and it has a category for 'Police Records of Convictions, Cautions, Reprimands and Final Warnings'.

    If you omit anything, it will be found anyway.................so you would jeopardize your employment application for being dishonest.

    Good luck with your job application.

    Regards

    Nile
    Last edited by Nile; 12-02-2008 at 1:31 PM.
  • daveboy
    • #6
    • 12th Feb 08, 1:53 PM
    • #6
    • 12th Feb 08, 1:53 PM
    Hello tarden

    You might find some useful information in the crb website:

    www.crb.gov.uk

    I believe that you will be filling in an 'Enhanced Disclosure' form. I have one and it has a category for 'Police Records of Convictions, Cautions, Reprimands and Final Warnings'.

    If you omit anything, it will be found anyway.................so you would jeopardize your employment application for being dishonest.

    Good luck with your job application.

    Regards

    Nile
    Originally posted by Nile
    The above is what I was referring to....the offence was in 1989 and I am of the opinion that it will have been erased from the police national computer due to the time that has passed.

    Edited to add: Upon reading this thread it reminded me last year of an article in which someone had done something back in the 1980s that still appeared - and the Information Commissioner ordered the police to delete the record. The article can be read here:

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/7072241.stm

    Gut instinct for a lot of people would be that 19 years later, it would have been deleted from the records. But it may not have been. For me you have two choices, either seek official guidance from a senior police officer, or a solicitor. Failing that, disclose it. I certainly wouldn't not seek advice and not disclose it, because sods law dictates that it will appear at some stage.
    Last edited by daveboy; 12-02-2008 at 2:04 PM.
  • daveboy
    • #7
    • 12th Feb 08, 2:53 PM
    • #7
    • 12th Feb 08, 2:53 PM
    Not wishing to thrash this to death, and again, it cannot be taken as the official line, but right at the bottom of this page:

    http://www.learndirect-advice.co.uk/helpandadvice/exoffenders/disclosure/

    it states:

    Minor convictions from over 10 years ago are usually wiped from the Police National Computer (PNC). However, if you have been convicted of three or more crimes they can be kept on the PNC for 20 years.

    The definition of minor is open to interpretation and, whilst not attempting in any way to find out what the punishment was by the courts, it is likely that the rehabilitation period for the offence would have been five years (if you were fined by the court) - as it is a motoring offence it isn't listed in the tables commonly seen relating to the RoOA 1974.

    Additionally, as it is a motoring offence that you are concerned about, it may be that details are not kept on the PNC and therefore would not appear on a CRB check. It is quite possible that it is the DVLA that records motoring offences. It would have stayed on your licence for 11 years, until 2000, and that should have been the end of the matter.

    Whilst I have gone from one side to the other, I am now firmly of the belief that if this was me, I'd say nothing as it was a motoring conviction rather than a criminal conviction.
    Last edited by daveboy; 12-02-2008 at 2:55 PM.
    • tarden
    • By tarden 12th Feb 08, 3:01 PM
    • 41 Posts
    • 21 Thanks
    tarden
    • #8
    • 12th Feb 08, 3:01 PM
    • #8
    • 12th Feb 08, 3:01 PM
    Daveboy, you have been excellent. Thanks very much. I think now I'll go with not mentioning it.
    • Ebany
    • By Ebany 12th Feb 08, 7:10 PM
    • 242 Posts
    • 201 Thanks
    Ebany
    • #9
    • 12th Feb 08, 7:10 PM
    • #9
    • 12th Feb 08, 7:10 PM
    I know I have seen drink/driving convictions come up on enchanced CRB checks as I work in healthcare recruitment and we do lots of them. I would personally reccommend mentioning it as I think it would be highly unlikely to be a barrier to your employment as it is, but I know we are a lot harsher on people who fail to mention something that then does show up.

    I believe it is a part of the code of practice for those who can get CRB's that they do not just treat anyone with any kind of disclosure as unemployable, circumstances, time since the offence, and relevance to the position should be taken into consideration when making a recuitment decision.

    One option could be to give a sealed statement with then with instructions that they may open it in the event of a disclosure, possibly with the explanation that it happened some time ago and you aren't sure if it is relevant, but you don't want it on your personnel record if it is not required.

    Its one of those awkward things, you don't want to say something if you don't need to, but if something then shows up you look worse...
    • ohreally
    • By ohreally 13th Feb 08, 12:01 PM
    • 5,491 Posts
    • 4,046 Thanks
    ohreally
    Hello,
    I am applying for a NHS job that requires a CRB check.
    Any advice welcomed, especially of there is anyone with personal experience.
    Originally posted by tarden

    Some posts are excempt from a disclosure check. If the post isn't exempt you will be subject to one of the following...
    Enhanced Check only
    Enhanced +DWCL
    Enhanced + AARL
    Enhanced + Both Lists
    Where DWCL - Disqualified from working with children list
    AARL - Adults at risk list

    The above apply to Scotland, however England has a very similar procedure.
    Imagination is a mental faculty that serves as a coping mechanism for those who can't or won't accept reality - unicorns and dragons and wives who don't nag, are all figments of the "imagination".
  • Nikolai
    Thanks ohreally and ebany. As the job will involve contact with patients, then an enhanced check will be required I think.
    I have found out that there is an NHS Job shop near to me, where they will advise and help with applications for NHS jobs.

    Will visit them tomorrow (closed on weds).
    I will also mention ebany's sealed statement suggestion - sounds like a very good idea.
    Thanks all.
  • astonsmummy
    Hi
    What did you end up doing?
    I've got a criminal record and in my application I disclosed my 2 convictions and one caution and have still been offered an interview with the NHS so IMO honesty is the best policy
    Baby boy Number 2, arrived 12th April 2009!
  • sarebear
    does anyone know if cautions show on a crb check ? it was 8 years ago for shoplifting. which my i point out was a total accident ! but stupidly i admitted to it , as yes i had gone out of the store without paying for it, but it was due to the fact i had a call on my mobile to say my son had been rushed into hospital and i dashed out of the store forgetting i had a dvd in my hands !
    so i admitted to it ,as they decided to call the police and as you can imagine i just wanted to get to the hospital to my son. had to go down the station a week later and was given a caution, but the officer told me that it didn't actually mean i had a criminal record ! that is where i am confused. will it show or not ?:confused:
  • astonsmummy
    If it was a formal caution then yes it will show on an enhanced CRB, well mine does and it was 9 years ago.
    Baby boy Number 2, arrived 12th April 2009!
    • clairec79
    • By clairec79 20th Apr 08, 4:19 PM
    • 2,047 Posts
    • 5,770 Thanks
    clairec79
    I was told to declare anything and everything, if it came up and hadn't been disclosed then there was no way the NHS would employ you but if you had declared it then it may be disregarded, bt if you hadn't declared it they'd consider you had lied on your application
    • northernlass
    • By northernlass 20th Apr 08, 4:31 PM
    • 903 Posts
    • 1,114 Thanks
    northernlass
    i disclosed a common assault conviction on my first CRB in 2004 and it showed up but i have had my CRB updated last year and it does not appear at all. i was convicted in 2002 so 5 years later and it was removed.???????
  • irishpads
    Crb
    Hi

    Briefly had an altercation in 2000 and received a caution for actual bodily harm

    Issue.. On the charge sheet (official caution note)the police recorded my dob incorrectly and place of birth (this throu assumption as i have a strong accent but not necessarily born in that country!) i idnt notice this till much later as i was glad to get outta the station

    Is this caution valid as the information is incorrect and if not how do i get it removed

    Can i challenge it if it appears on my CRB enhanced

    Also they have taken DNA and used the same data..

    thx in advance
  • sheff lass
    hi, i got offered a post as a healthcare technicion 2 weeks ago and at the time had no criminal record, i recently got arrested and given a caution, does anyone know if this will affect my job offer?
    Last edited by sheff lass; 15-06-2009 at 11:56 PM. Reason: extra info
  • sheff lass
    it will be in the blood bank department mainly admin like keeping records and labelling samples
  • chay2882
    crb checks
    Hi,

    I am awaiting a crb to come back for a support worker role with adults in mental health. Back in feb i had a fight with my partner and the police were called.I was asked to go to police station but was not arrested or anything so no charges or cautions but the officer said he would have to make a note of it incase it happens again.

    Does anyone know if this will show and if it will prevent me from geting the job??

    I didnt disclose this as it said on the form an cautions or convictions and i dont have any of them.

    Im really worried as really want this job.
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