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  • FIRST POST
    • MonroeM
    • By MonroeM 14th Feb 18, 2:32 PM
    • 120Posts
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    MonroeM
    VWRL, SWDA or HMWO?
    • #1
    • 14th Feb 18, 2:32 PM
    VWRL, SWDA or HMWO? 14th Feb 18 at 2:32 PM
    I am looking at investing in a World ETF and am trying to decide between VWRL, SWDA & HMWO.

    VWRL & HMWO yield around 2% whereas SWDA I understand has no dividend yield. HMWO is much smaller than its mainstream large share fund rivals VWRL & SWDA so could this be a disadvantage?

    The charges are roughly the same between 0.20 and 0.25% so is it just personal preference or is there any other differences in these World ETF's?
Page 1
    • A_T
    • By A_T 14th Feb 18, 4:36 PM
    • 313 Posts
    • 192 Thanks
    A_T
    • #2
    • 14th Feb 18, 4:36 PM
    • #2
    • 14th Feb 18, 4:36 PM
    VWRL includes emerging markets - SWDA and HMWO are developed markets only.


    HMWO charge is 0.15%
    • ArchBair
    • By ArchBair 14th Feb 18, 4:54 PM
    • 71 Posts
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    ArchBair
    • #3
    • 14th Feb 18, 4:54 PM
    • #3
    • 14th Feb 18, 4:54 PM
    I don't think there is hardly any difference in performance as well.
    • Glen Clark
    • By Glen Clark 14th Feb 18, 5:35 PM
    • 4,070 Posts
    • 3,098 Thanks
    Glen Clark
    • #4
    • 14th Feb 18, 5:35 PM
    • #4
    • 14th Feb 18, 5:35 PM
    I am looking at investing in a World ETF and am trying to decide between VWRL, SWDA & HMWO.

    VWRL & HMWO yield around 2% whereas SWDA I understand has no dividend yield. HMWO is much smaller than its mainstream large share fund rivals VWRL & SWDA so could this be a disadvantage?

    The charges are roughly the same between 0.20 and 0.25% so is it just personal preference or is there any other differences in these World ETF's?
    Originally posted by MonroeM
    VWRL charges most because its the most diversified.
    According to FT HMWO is lowest charges at 0.15% http://funds.ft.com/uk/Tearsheet/Summary?s=HMWO:LSE:GBX
    SWDA is an acumulator so the dividends are reinvested - and more efficiently than doinmg it yourself. This makes tax calculations complicated, but you don't need to do them if held in an ISA.
    Disadvantage of the smaller ETF (HMWO) is difference between buying and selling price likely to be slightly higher. But you only pay it once so if its spread over several years holding them it will be practically irrelevant.
    “It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it.” --Upton Sinclair
    • Glen Clark
    • By Glen Clark 14th Feb 18, 5:42 PM
    • 4,070 Posts
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    Glen Clark
    • #5
    • 14th Feb 18, 5:42 PM
    • #5
    • 14th Feb 18, 5:42 PM
    I hold VWRL and SWDA which I can't sell without incurring CGT.

    If I was buying now I would buy HMWO
    “It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it.” --Upton Sinclair
    • grey gym sock
    • By grey gym sock 14th Feb 18, 6:16 PM
    • 4,186 Posts
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    grey gym sock
    • #6
    • 14th Feb 18, 6:16 PM
    • #6
    • 14th Feb 18, 6:16 PM
    or what about VEVE?

    it's very similar to HMWO - i.e. it's developed markets only, and it pays dividends.

    its OCF is slightly higher (0.18%, compared to 0.15% for HMWO).

    but ...

    1) the difference in OCF (0.03%) is small enough that it's possible that it would be more than made up for by more efficient management, or by returning the full profits from stock lending to the ETF (note: i don't know if these ETFs currently do any stock lending).

    2) vanguard are more likely to cut the OCF in future, because they'll do so when they can, not just when forced to by competition.
    • Sue58
    • By Sue58 16th Feb 18, 11:23 AM
    • 104 Posts
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    Sue58
    • #7
    • 16th Feb 18, 11:23 AM
    • #7
    • 16th Feb 18, 11:23 AM
    I don't think there is hardly any difference in performance as well.
    Originally posted by ArchBair
    How do you check the performance figures for these ETF's?

    I'd like to check the performance figures against a global fund such as Henderson Global Growth or a global IT such as Witan?
    • A_T
    • By A_T 16th Feb 18, 11:53 AM
    • 313 Posts
    • 192 Thanks
    A_T
    • #8
    • 16th Feb 18, 11:53 AM
    • #8
    • 16th Feb 18, 11:53 AM
    How do you check the performance figures for these ETF's?

    I'd like to check the performance figures against a global fund such as Henderson Global Growth or a global IT such as Witan?
    Originally posted by Sue58

    Morningstar, FT and Trustnet have free tools that enable one to do comparisons like that.
    • ColdIron
    • By ColdIron 16th Feb 18, 11:57 AM
    • 3,895 Posts
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    ColdIron
    • #9
    • 16th Feb 18, 11:57 AM
    • #9
    • 16th Feb 18, 11:57 AM
    How do you check the performance figures for these ETF's?

    I'd like to check the performance figures against a global fund such as Henderson Global Growth or a global IT such as Witan?
    Originally posted by Sue58
    They are shares just like your ITs. Use the comparison tools provided by TrustNet, MorningStar or even HL
    • ArchBair
    • By ArchBair 16th Feb 18, 3:14 PM
    • 71 Posts
    • 20 Thanks
    ArchBair
    How do you check the performance figures for these ETF's?

    I'd like to check the performance figures against a global fund such as Henderson Global Growth or a global IT such as Witan?
    Originally posted by Sue58
    Over 5 years the Henderson Global Growth as delivered 125.7 and Witan 103.3, whereas VWRL 78.2 and SWDA 84.3.

    HMWO only has figures for the past 3 years but they are very similar, in fact there is only about 1% difference between all three ETF's over the past 3 years..
    • Sue58
    • By Sue58 16th Feb 18, 4:38 PM
    • 104 Posts
    • 24 Thanks
    Sue58
    Over 5 years the Henderson Global Growth as delivered 125.7 and Witan 103.3, whereas VWRL 78.2 and SWDA 84.3.

    HMWO only has figures for the past 3 years but they are very similar, in fact there is only about 1% difference between all three ETF's over the past 3 years..
    Originally posted by ArchBair
    Thanks for those figures, I was just about to check them on Trustnet as suggested by other people.

    So the active fund and IT have done better over the past 5 years and also in this recent downturn/correction over the past few weeks.
    • Glen Clark
    • By Glen Clark 16th Feb 18, 5:28 PM
    • 4,070 Posts
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    Glen Clark
    VWRL 78.2 and SWDA 84.3
    Originally posted by ArchBair
    VWRL pays dividends in US Dollars (which usually incurs a fee to convert to Sterling for UK investors) and SWDA reinvests them (presumably more efficiently than doing it yourself after charges).
    Please do you know if this is taken into account?
    “It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it.” --Upton Sinclair
    • ArchBair
    • By ArchBair 16th Feb 18, 6:08 PM
    • 71 Posts
    • 20 Thanks
    ArchBair
    VWRL pays dividends in US Dollars (which usually incurs a fee to convert to Sterling for UK investors) and SWDA reinvests them (presumably more efficiently than doing it yourself after charges).
    Please do you know if this is taken into account?
    Originally posted by Glen Clark
    I can't say for sure however usually Trustnet do take these things into account when producing figures, but as I said I can't be sure about this.
    • MPN
    • By MPN 17th Feb 18, 4:39 PM
    • 248 Posts
    • 84 Thanks
    MPN
    Over 5 years the Henderson Global Growth as delivered 125.7 and Witan 103.3, whereas VWRL 78.2 and SWDA 84.3.

    HMWO only has figures for the past 3 years but they are very similar, in fact there is only about 1% difference between all three ETF's over the past 3 years..
    Originally posted by ArchBair
    You can't really compare the performance figures for these funds as they are not really 'like for like' because they invest very differently to the ETF's.
    • MonroeM
    • By MonroeM 17th Feb 18, 6:14 PM
    • 120 Posts
    • 33 Thanks
    MonroeM
    You can't really compare the performance figures for these funds as they are not really 'like for like' because they invest very differently to the ETF's.
    Originally posted by MPN
    I tend to agree, you can't compare world etf's to global funds or IT's.
    • aroominyork
    • By aroominyork 17th Feb 18, 6:32 PM
    • 391 Posts
    • 106 Thanks
    aroominyork
    vanguard are more likely to cut the OCF in future, because they'll do so when they can, not just when forced to by competition.
    Originally posted by grey gym sock
    Why do you think that? Is Vanguard a social enterprise or a business?
    • IanManc
    • By IanManc 17th Feb 18, 6:41 PM
    • 440 Posts
    • 670 Thanks
    IanManc
    Why do you think that? Is Vanguard a social enterprise or a business?
    Originally posted by aroominyork
    Because Vanguard is a mutual, owned by the investors in its products.
    • bostonerimus
    • By bostonerimus 17th Feb 18, 6:52 PM
    • 1,552 Posts
    • 991 Thanks
    bostonerimus
    Why do you think that? Is Vanguard a social enterprise or a business?
    Originally posted by aroominyork
    Good question.

    Vanguard certainly has a mission and a guru - John Bogle. It is critically different from most fund companies and platforms as it is owned by the funds, which in turn are owned by the shareholders, so it is a mutual company owned by it's customers. There are no major shareholders taking profits and dividends out of the company.
    Misanthrope in search of similar for mutual loathing
    • Sue58
    • By Sue58 17th Feb 18, 7:34 PM
    • 104 Posts
    • 24 Thanks
    Sue58
    I thought this thread was about a choice of ETF's not Vanguard in particular?

    I personally feel there is very little difference, between the three including their performance figures so just select the ETF that is more to your liking. VWRL is more all world than the other two.
    • Glen Clark
    • By Glen Clark 17th Feb 18, 7:44 PM
    • 4,070 Posts
    • 3,098 Thanks
    Glen Clark
    There are no major shareholders taking profits and dividends out of the company.
    Originally posted by bostonerimus
    So in theory a mutual will be cheaper for its customers.
    If that always worked in practice the Co-op would be cheaper than all the other supermarkets.
    But it isn't.
    “It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it.” --Upton Sinclair
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