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  • FIRST POST
    • Zadzad
    • By Zadzad 3rd Feb 18, 1:42 PM
    • 10Posts
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    Zadzad
    Electric charging networks.
    • #1
    • 3rd Feb 18, 1:42 PM
    Electric charging networks. 3rd Feb 18 at 1:42 PM
    I know that anytime anyone mentions getting a new car the answer is you donít save money, there will always be agreements both ways.

    Mrs drives a 8 year old John cooper works mini. 1.6 petrol, last 3 mots have needed work costing £1000 total plus mot cost. Thatís local rates not BMW.
    Tax is £180 plus she only does 10 miles a day so the car is not being used as it should be.

    I have a derv Nissan QQ, pcp coming to an end, if I pay the balloon will mean mots and new service plan.

    Other then about 6 weeks a year I I do about 100 miles a week and spend £60 on derv.

    Rarely do we travel outside of Kent beyond maybe lakeside or Gatwick radius. 60-75 miles both major routes have eco city ?? Charges at the motorway services.

    Double electric makes sense. 2 supermarkets have chargers as well as 2 council car parks so there is the possibility of never needing to charge at home.

    Now the question.

    There appears to be so many charging networks and itís confusing, what are the best networks to join, I understand some have a monthly admin charge and free charging and others feee cards but pay as you go so to speak.

    We would be looking at a Zoe (I know there is a battery charge) and either a leaf or i3 Rex.

    All advice appreciated
Page 1
    • missile
    • By missile 3rd Feb 18, 1:50 PM
    • 9,248 Posts
    • 4,545 Thanks
    missile
    • #2
    • 3rd Feb 18, 1:50 PM
    • #2
    • 3rd Feb 18, 1:50 PM
    Seems like a good plan.
    My concerns would be:
    As electric becomes more popular, it may become difficult to find a convenient charge point.
    Time to charge. My friend has a Tesla. Even on their excellent network of super high speed chargers it took an hour.

    If you are able to charge at home overnight, these may not be concerns for you.
    "A nation's greatness is measured by how it treats its weakest members." ~ Mahatma Gandhi
    Ride hard or stay home
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 3rd Feb 18, 2:02 PM
    • 34,555 Posts
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    Quentin
    • #3
    • 3rd Feb 18, 2:02 PM
    • #3
    • 3rd Feb 18, 2:02 PM
    Apart from using the few remaining free charge points it is much cheaper charging at home than at a charge point (especially if you have economy 7 and charge overnight!)
    • scaredofdebt
    • By scaredofdebt 3rd Feb 18, 2:05 PM
    • 958 Posts
    • 380 Thanks
    scaredofdebt
    • #4
    • 3rd Feb 18, 2:05 PM
    • #4
    • 3rd Feb 18, 2:05 PM
    Consider leasing. If you lease and get the full package covering tyres, repairs etc, you will know your exact costs (factor in electricity) so you can be fairly certain how that stacks up vs your current car. You also don't need to worry about the potentially huge depreciation that could affect EVs.

    For example, I can lease a Zoe through work for about £350 a month over 4 years. I currently pay £150 for my car finance and £200 on fuel so it would be a no brainer for me but I am in "negative equity" so it won't be happening for a while.

    The mileages you do you will hardly ever need to use an external charge point, if you do go on a long journey every now and then you can look to hire a petrol/diesel car if required, just factor that cost in as well.
    Make £2018 in 2018 Challenge - Total to date £281
    • missile
    • By missile 3rd Feb 18, 2:42 PM
    • 9,248 Posts
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    missile
    • #5
    • 3rd Feb 18, 2:42 PM
    • #5
    • 3rd Feb 18, 2:42 PM
    For that very low mileage, 10 miles per day wife would be cheaper taking a taxi.
    The cost of fuel becomes insignificant vs the depreciation. I would suggest a petrol car would be a cheaper option for OP.
    "A nation's greatness is measured by how it treats its weakest members." ~ Mahatma Gandhi
    Ride hard or stay home
    • Tarambor
    • By Tarambor 3rd Feb 18, 4:27 PM
    • 2,241 Posts
    • 1,610 Thanks
    Tarambor
    • #6
    • 3rd Feb 18, 4:27 PM
    • #6
    • 3rd Feb 18, 4:27 PM
    Mrs drives a 8 year old John cooper works mini. 1.6 petrol, last 3 mots have needed work costing £1000 total plus mot cost. That!!!8217;s local rates not BMW.
    Originally posted by Zadzad
    So in the last 3 years its needed less than the cost of 3-6 months depreciation on a new car.

    I have a derv Nissan QQ, pcp coming to an end, if I pay the balloon will mean mots and new service plan.
    Why is the MOT an issue? My 2010 Mondeo is now on 127,000 miles. It has never failed a single MOT. Its last one it had last month it passed with no advisories. That is what happens when you properly maintain a vehicle. It has cost me less than £200 in non-service repairs in the 90,000 miles I've done.

    Double electric makes sense.
    Not if you are wanting to save money which you imply by the comments about the cost of your wife's MOTs and having to MOT the vehicle you've got. A Nissan Leaf is several grand more than its petrol/diesel equivalent. You'll never ever recoup that with savings on fuel and servicing even if you used totally free charging all of the time which you won't because you'll be recharging it at home some of the time at 15p per kWh. Nobody buys an electric car to save money because the maths doesn't add up.
    Last edited by Tarambor; 03-02-2018 at 4:32 PM.
    • Car 54
    • By Car 54 4th Feb 18, 1:12 AM
    • 2,645 Posts
    • 1,697 Thanks
    Car 54
    • #7
    • 4th Feb 18, 1:12 AM
    • #7
    • 4th Feb 18, 1:12 AM

    Other then about 6 weeks a year I I do about 100 miles a week and spend £60 on derv.
    Originally posted by Zadzad
    That's about 9 mpg. What sort of Nissan is it?
    • Stageshoot
    • By Stageshoot 4th Feb 18, 10:26 AM
    • 518 Posts
    • 560 Thanks
    Stageshoot
    • #8
    • 4th Feb 18, 10:26 AM
    • #8
    • 4th Feb 18, 10:26 AM
    The Charging network you choose depends on where you live and where you travel

    Best bet is look on "Plugshare" and see which network has the best coverage around where you want to go the majority of the time. (Tend to ignore your home area if you will be charging at home)

    Remember Polar and CYC are now the same network, so you can buy a Polar Membership and use all the CYC points (Often at a lot less cost than you could with a CYC Card)

    Ecotricity is your only choice on the Motorway and like Motorway fuel its expensive 30p Kwh unless yo take you home electricity through them then its 15p Kwh

    (A Zoe that is empty takes about 1 hour and 40kw to fill) so from Empty on a motorway service area thats about £12 to fill for a 160 miles of real world range... Compare that to filling at home overnight on Eco7 at 5p a Kwh £2 for 160 Mile Range

    Polar is Cheaper at 10.8p Kwh but there is a £7.60 Monthly fee (First 3 months free). And a lot of the slower destination chargers dont charge for electricity but almost all of the Rapid Chargers do. But still a lot cheaper than using Ecotricity on the Motorway.. The downside is if they have rapid chargers in the areas you travel to, but they are expanding rapidly

    There is also Podpoint, but they have a really small network at the moment and Instavolt who are introducing a big rapid charge network but ignore that if getting a Zoe as its not compatible with the Zoe

    Spend an hour on the Plugshare Map and see whats in the area you travel to, Sign up for the first 3 months free on Polar its a no catch trial so at least that way you can see if works for you, and get the podpoint app etc. The more you have the better

    Ref the Zoe, Great little EV, we have 2 of them if you are going for the 41kw ZE40 rather than the older 22kw version the range is excellent, I do Mansfield to London and back weekdays and its 140 miles always gets me there with charge left no matter the weather.

    Good luck with whatever you choose, join speakev forum and owners facebook sites for great info
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    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 4th Feb 18, 10:34 AM
    • 16,448 Posts
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    AdrianC
    • #9
    • 4th Feb 18, 10:34 AM
    • #9
    • 4th Feb 18, 10:34 AM
    I have a derv Nissan QQ...

    Other then about 6 weeks a year I I do about 100 miles a week and spend £60 on derv.
    Originally posted by Zadzad
    That's about 9 mpg. What sort of Nissan is it?
    Originally posted by Car 54
    He says a diesel Qashqai - so the answer would seem to be a very, very broken one.
    • DUTR
    • By DUTR 4th Feb 18, 10:42 AM
    • 11,181 Posts
    • 6,399 Thanks
    DUTR
    That's about 9 mpg. What sort of Nissan is it?
    Originally posted by Car 54
    I'd guess that's 60gbp a month, about the same as what I spend for a 2 litre petrol with similar driving pattern.
    • NigeWick
    • By NigeWick 5th Feb 18, 9:33 AM
    • 2,819 Posts
    • 1,120 Thanks
    NigeWick
    Other then about 6 weeks a year I I do about 100 miles a week
    Originally posted by Zadzad
    I have a 30kWh Nissan leaf and will be getting the 40kWh next month. I am with Ecotricity at present because the number of long journies I do made it worthwhile to get their cheap en route charging deal at 15p per kWh. With the new car, I can make both daughters' homes in one hop and there are Polar chargers near both. Therefore, I shall be joining OVO to get their two year free Polar membership and 9p per kWh. Many of their slower chargers have no charge for members.

    You need to have a look at the Ecotricity and Polar charge points and see which is most convenient for you on your six weeks of longer journies. Then, work out whether it is worthwhile having Ecotricity or Ovo electricity to save money over the year.

    The Renault Zoe is cheaper and has a slightly longer range, but it's French and there have been reports of the steering drop links wearing after 20,000 miles. The new Nissan Leaf will do a few less miles than the Zoe but is more expensive to buy, larger, more comfortable and made in Sunderland. The USA EPA range for the 40kWh Leaf is 151 miles and working on their numbers I reckon I will get at least 160 traveling at 60 - 65 on motorways in the summer. Quite a bit less in winter with the heater/aircon on.
    The mind of the bigot is like the pupil of the eye; the more light you pour upon it, the more it will contract.
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    • Zadzad
    • By Zadzad 5th Feb 18, 1:53 PM
    • 10 Posts
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    Zadzad
    I will try and address everyone!!!8217;s points - grateful of the advice received.

    my logic is I can get 3 hours a day free charge at the council car parks, and my wife has too supermarkets that we use that also have charging bays. But home charging is possible
    Logic is to buy new leaf on pcp and 2nd hand Zoe on 0% credit card

    By the time you start working out costs min £55 x 2 servicing £400 a year it starts to add up. I have not had to pay a service or mot or service on mine for 7 years that!!!8217;s nearly 2k.

    Wife has a 1.6 jcw mini, always from a cold start on short journeys. Sometimes she can get as low as 25mpg around town.
    £60 is a month, around town I get 40 and on a run 60. (The 1.5 derv)

    Nige - would def need to consider eco as they cover all the motorway stations and stopping there for an hour is never a problem. It!!!8217;s either 55!!!8217;mins to fathering corner or 75 to clackets.

    Stage - exactly what I was looking for. I guess as long as most are payg then having an arm of charging cards of apps is ideal. I have looked at a couple of apps and we only have 5 charges within 5 miles and next batch are 16.
    • NigeWick
    • By NigeWick 6th Feb 18, 10:02 AM
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    NigeWick
    Nige - would def need to consider eco as they cover all the motorway stations and stopping there for an hour is never a problem. It!!!8217;s either 55!!!8217;mins to fathering corner or 75 to clackets.
    Originally posted by Zadzad
    Understood.

    Polar network are expanding quite rapidly and it looks as though they're using Holiday Inns plus some others places. I use one by the A3/A243 roundabout near Tolworth. Further, Shell, BP and others are starting to put chargers in their fossil fuel garages too.
    The mind of the bigot is like the pupil of the eye; the more light you pour upon it, the more it will contract.
    Oliver Wendell Holmes
    • Spelunthus
    • By Spelunthus 6th Feb 18, 10:40 AM
    • 77 Posts
    • 79 Thanks
    Spelunthus
    UK Public electric charging is a disgrace. There are too many companies, little inter-operability, many broken charge points. Excuse me having a rant, as I have just had a parking fine, for parking my PHEV at a broken charge point - and being fined for "not charging" (I'm appealing).
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 6th Feb 18, 10:42 AM
    • 16,448 Posts
    • 14,707 Thanks
    AdrianC
    UK Public electric charging is a disgrace. There are too many companies, little inter-operability, many broken charge points. Excuse me having a rant, as I have just had a parking fine, for parking my PHEV at a broken charge point - and being fined for "not charging" (I'm appealing).
    Originally posted by Spelunthus
    Parking is provided free of charge for the purposes of charging your electric vehicle. If the charging is unavailable, why should the parking be free?

    Would you expect an internal combustion vehicle to be able to park there free, too, while the charge point is out of order?
    • Spelunthus
    • By Spelunthus 6th Feb 18, 1:25 PM
    • 77 Posts
    • 79 Thanks
    Spelunthus
    Thanks. . But I HAD paid for the parking. The fine citation is for "not charging" - which I couldn't cause the point was broken. Dunno if the appeal has merit, but I do feel hard done-by.
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 6th Feb 18, 1:45 PM
    • 16,448 Posts
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    AdrianC
    Ah, now that's a detail you forgot to mention...

    But - again - would you be happy if an IC vehicle was parked there, ticket or not? Let's say the charger had been fixed since they parked...
    • Spelunthus
    • By Spelunthus 7th Feb 18, 10:25 AM
    • 77 Posts
    • 79 Thanks
    Spelunthus
    I agree., The bay is marked "electric cars only" - so an IC car in the bay is wrong, with or without a ticket. To summarise.... I parked in electric charge bay with a PHEV and a valid parking ticket. I then find that the charge point is broken (no obvious indication, till I try my smart card). I'm assuming that parking operative can confirm my car is PHEV by referring to registration number. The charge point operator confirms by phone that it is inopperative. I then get a parking fine for "not charging at an electric point" - I'm appealing - we'll see....... seems wrong to me...
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