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  • FIRST POST
    • mark090360
    • By mark090360 12th Jan 18, 1:15 PM
    • 3Posts
    • 0Thanks
    mark090360
    Car was not as advertised - Only found out when next service due
    • #1
    • 12th Jan 18, 1:15 PM
    Car was not as advertised - Only found out when next service due 12th Jan 18 at 1:15 PM
    Hi
    I am looking for some advice as to whether I have a case or not, and then can anyone point me in the direction of someone who could help me resolve this issue.

    I bought a nearly new car from a main dealer in Jan 17, and when I took it into my local main dealership to be serviced in October 17, they told me that the car had been remapped and that the warranty was invalid and that unless I had informed my insurance that the car was modified then my insurance was invalid, and that I was driving illegally. I obviously did not know about the remap as I thought I had bought a standard car, as per my sales agreement. It took some time to investigate the issue, resulting in the dealer that I bought the car from collecting it from the dealer that serviced it, and they had the car for a month, finally changing the ECU, and a month after that they were able to confirm that the warranty on the car was re-instated. They have accepted that they sold me a modified car, which was not picked up on their pre-sales checks.

    My issue now is that they will not extend the warranty for the car. They cannot, or will not, tell me what the actual remap did to the car, but I am now left worried that there will be longer term issues with the engine or gearbox. This has been further compounded by the fact they will not even extend the warranty by the month that the car was in the dealership. I now have no confidence in the car and, to be blunt, I want rid of it.

    My 2 questions are:

    1. Am I justified asking the dealer to take the car back as I have now had it a year?(I anticipate that there would have to be an allowance for my usage of the car)
    2. If I can ask them to take the car back, can anyone recommend a solicitor who understands the car industry and could advise me what to do?

    Regards

    Mark
Page 1
    • Ganga
    • By Ganga 12th Jan 18, 1:20 PM
    • 924 Posts
    • 463 Thanks
    Ganga
    • #2
    • 12th Jan 18, 1:20 PM
    • #2
    • 12th Jan 18, 1:20 PM
    You have owned/driven the car for allmost one year,you must know if the car is ok.What was the original warranty period?
    ITS NOT EASY TO GET EVERYTHING WRONG ,I HAVE TO WORK HARD TO DO IT!
    • ssparks2003
    • By ssparks2003 12th Jan 18, 1:41 PM
    • 254 Posts
    • 326 Thanks
    ssparks2003
    • #3
    • 12th Jan 18, 1:41 PM
    • #3
    • 12th Jan 18, 1:41 PM
    You found a fault, they have repaired the fault, there is no longer a fault. Why do you think you can reject a non faulty vehicle?
    • mark090360
    • By mark090360 12th Jan 18, 3:55 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    mark090360
    • #4
    • 12th Jan 18, 3:55 PM
    • #4
    • 12th Jan 18, 3:55 PM
    Because they told me that the warranty was voided due to the long-term damage that the ECU remap would do to the engine or gearbox. When they worked out that I hadn't done the remap, and they had sold it to me like that, they fixed the ECU and do not want to extend the warranty in case there is a failure of the Engine or gearbox due to the remap they left on the car. Is that fair?
    • Warwick Hunt
    • By Warwick Hunt 12th Jan 18, 3:58 PM
    • 866 Posts
    • 421 Thanks
    Warwick Hunt
    • #5
    • 12th Jan 18, 3:58 PM
    • #5
    • 12th Jan 18, 3:58 PM
    Because they told me that the warranty was voided due to the long-term damage that the ECU remap would do to the engine or gearbox. When they worked out that I hadn't done the remap, and they had sold it to me like that, they fixed the ECU and do not want to extend the warranty in case there is a failure of the Engine or gearbox due to the remap they left on the car. Is that fair?
    Originally posted by mark090360
    What’s the long term damage?
    • NotRichAtAll
    • By NotRichAtAll 12th Jan 18, 4:01 PM
    • 700 Posts
    • 529 Thanks
    NotRichAtAll
    • #6
    • 12th Jan 18, 4:01 PM
    • #6
    • 12th Jan 18, 4:01 PM
    if its a diesel engine a remap generally means the dpf could have been removed too.
    • takman
    • By takman 12th Jan 18, 4:09 PM
    • 3,013 Posts
    • 2,591 Thanks
    takman
    • #7
    • 12th Jan 18, 4:09 PM
    • #7
    • 12th Jan 18, 4:09 PM
    if its a diesel engine a remap generally means the dpf could have been removed too.
    Originally posted by NotRichAtAll
    If that was the case then a light would have come up on the dashboard once the ECU's software was restored to factory standard.

    Because they told me that the warranty was voided due to the long-term damage that the ECU remap would do to the engine or gearbox. When they worked out that I hadn't done the remap, and they had sold it to me like that, they fixed the ECU and do not want to extend the warranty in case there is a failure of the Engine or gearbox due to the remap they left on the car. Is that fair?
    Originally posted by mark090360
    If the car was running fine for a year without any noticeable problems when driving and returning the MPG you expected then the remap is unlikely to have caused any damage to the engine or gearbox.

    If anything now you will notice the car will be more sluggish when accelerating as it will have less power as standard.
    • agrinnall
    • By agrinnall 12th Jan 18, 4:51 PM
    • 19,177 Posts
    • 14,840 Thanks
    agrinnall
    • #8
    • 12th Jan 18, 4:51 PM
    • #8
    • 12th Jan 18, 4:51 PM
    Because they told me that the warranty was voided due to the long-term damage that the ECU remap would do to the engine or gearbox.
    Originally posted by mark090360
    But you've already said that the warranty has been re-instated, so what's the issue? It's still covering the length of time that it was when you bought the car, and presumably you were happy with it then.
    • mark090360
    • By mark090360 12th Jan 18, 6:12 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    mark090360
    • #9
    • 12th Jan 18, 6:12 PM
    • #9
    • 12th Jan 18, 6:12 PM
    The dealer said the warranty was void because of the possible long-term damage to the engine/gearbox. Where does that leave me if the engine blows up after 3 years and 3 months?

    Thanks for all these comments, but the question I wanted answered is where am Iegally when I have been sold something that wasn't as advertised, and this was only discovered on a servicing. Yes, I was happy how the car drives, the issue is - how long will it drive?
    • bazzyb
    • By bazzyb 12th Jan 18, 6:34 PM
    • 1,081 Posts
    • 3,212 Thanks
    bazzyb

    1. Am I justified asking the dealer to take the car back as I have now had it a year?(I anticipate that there would have to be an allowance for my usage of the car)
    Originally posted by mark090360
    No.

    Because they told me that the warranty was voided
    Originally posted by mark090360
    The warranty has now been reinstated. So you now have exactly what you thought you were getting in the first place.

    I agree however that the whole experience was mildly inconvenient in having your car out of action unnecessarily for a period of time - hopefully they provided you with a suitable courtesy car whilst that was happening? If not I would be expecting them to cover any out of pocket expenses for that period.
    • lewishardwick
    • By lewishardwick 12th Jan 18, 6:43 PM
    • 509 Posts
    • 623 Thanks
    lewishardwick
    How old is the car?

    A remap would suggest the car has had a 'harder' life than perhaps intended, BUT so can any car. You can treat a 1.0 Micra with no mechanical sympathy and it van last for years. Drive a Focus RS like a little old lady and it fail just outside of its warranty.

    Without a full strip down of the engine and gearbox there's no possible way to tell what state the engine is in.

    If you bought from a main dealer and you're looking to extend the manufacturers warranty I'd suggest contacting their head office to complain.

    If you bought from a 2nd hand dealer, they have limited tools to determine ECU mods.

    Besides the ECU may have been remapped for fuel economy rather than performance. Lets face it, manufacturers program the engine to meet emissions first...
    • lewishardwick
    • By lewishardwick 12th Jan 18, 6:45 PM
    • 509 Posts
    • 623 Thanks
    lewishardwick
    Sorry,just saw the main dealer part.

    Contact HO, they might be able to override the dealers decision to not extend the warranty.
    • NotRichAtAll
    • By NotRichAtAll 12th Jan 18, 9:00 PM
    • 700 Posts
    • 529 Thanks
    NotRichAtAll
    If that was the case then a light would have come up on the dashboard once the ECU's software was restored to factory standard.
    incorrect as normally when you get a remap and the dpf is removed all trace is wiped from the ecu hence you get no light on the dash.

    http://www.ecuflash.co/dpf-removal/
    • shaun from Africa
    • By shaun from Africa 12th Jan 18, 9:44 PM
    • 9,683 Posts
    • 10,877 Thanks
    shaun from Africa
    If that was the case then a light would have come up on the dashboard once the ECU's software was restored to factory standard.
    Originally posted by takman
    incorrect as normally when you get a remap and the dpf is removed all trace is wiped from the ecu hence you get no light on the dash.

    http://www.ecuflash.co/dpf-removal/
    Originally posted by NotRichAtAll
    But takman didn't state that a warning light would be on because of the remap.
    They said that the light would come on when the original ECU software was reinstalled on the vehicle and the DPF had been removed.
    • ThumbRemote
    • By ThumbRemote 12th Jan 18, 11:02 PM
    • 3,829 Posts
    • 4,858 Thanks
    ThumbRemote
    You are entitled to a reduction in the purchase price of the car. The Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations covers misleading omissions - see http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2008/1277/regulation/6/made
    Basically, they omitted to tell you material information when you bought the car.

    Even though they have redone the ECU now, the value of a car which has been driven with a reprogrammed ECU for a period is less than the value of a standard car. You would be entitled to the difference in that price back to you.

    The biggest difference is in calculating what the price difference would be. If you can come up with a figure, you can claim that against the dealer; potentially using the small claims court to do so.
    • agrinnall
    • By agrinnall 13th Jan 18, 9:04 AM
    • 19,177 Posts
    • 14,840 Thanks
    agrinnall

    Even though they have redone the ECU now, the value of a car which has been driven with a reprogrammed ECU for a period is less than the value of a standard car. You would be entitled to the difference in that price back to you.
    Originally posted by ThumbRemote
    But if the OP gets a reduction for buying a car with a remapped ECU then the dealer could try to charge for the work done in reverting the ECU to its original mapping.
    • arcon5
    • By arcon5 13th Jan 18, 1:31 PM
    • 13,296 Posts
    • 8,422 Thanks
    arcon5
    Your assuming the remap would have devalued the car and caused excessive wear... whereas the reality is quite the opposite. Many people have cars remapped for better fuel efficiency and power which can be sought after.
    The increased wear is mere speculation and based on the baseless assumption it's been ragged about.


    If you did have an opportunity to reject it then it would most definitely have been before allowing them to undertake remedial work.

    As it stands you've allowed them to rectify the so called issue, restore the original warranty which was agreed when you bought it and can be on your way.

    Unless you can prove the remap HAS directly caused excessive wear which you cant as theres no suggestion it has.
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