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  • FIRST POST
    • battlesgallor
    • By battlesgallor 10th Dec 17, 6:59 PM
    • 27Posts
    • 7Thanks
    battlesgallor
    STEVENAGE LEISURE PARK UKPC parking charge
    • #1
    • 10th Dec 17, 6:59 PM
    STEVENAGE LEISURE PARK UKPC parking charge 10th Dec 17 at 6:59 PM
    To cut a very long story as short as I possibly can, we've spent a lot of time over the last few weeks researching these and other forum pages pepipoo (checked the NEWBY's thread and various others) with regards to a situation which has happened to a friend of mine on The Stevenage Lesuire park site which is Private land PCN'd by UKPC. JLL are the management company of the site. (who we also intend to complain directly to)

    PCN was physically stuck on Vehicle on 13th October 2017, whilst my friend was delivering an item to a Cineworld Senior staff member (who’s advised us to appeal) and my friend used one of the pull in "double yellow lined bays" These bays have been regularly used by all visitors, staff, etc to the site as loading/unloading, picking up and dropping of points for all the years that the site has been built. (google pics confirm)

    After the PCN was issued these pulling bays have now been painted and hatched "LOADING ONLY" and still have double yellow lines, yet one other pull in, near Pizza Hut, has not been painted.

    The signage on this site has been notoriously mentioned. The fact that they are only at the main entrance and exit of the leisure Park site, are too highly situated and not at eye level, obscured by other items, camera’s and shop advertising, are not clearly visible for motorist, and there is no "parking/loading signage" or details of these action, that is actually in the vicinity of these bays.

    The participant in question was also helping a Disabled person and had blue badges in the vehicle.

    The PCN states: Issue Time as 11:56 and First seen time 11:56. the participant was only on site for approximately 5 minutes in total. Clearly an attendant personally issued and stuck the ticket to the vehicle, but didn't bother to hang around to communicate.

    An appeal has been sent to UKPC, & a POPLA ref number was issued on 15th November. It is now approaching the 25th – 26th day to send in the POPLA appeal using the Blue Template letter on the MSE forum.

    No Notice to Keeper has been received, as yet, either so we have a few Questions to ask.
    Here’s some of what we’ve already managed to prepare (swiftly abbreviated for simplicity):

    • The alleged contravention did not occur
    As participant WAS loading/unloading/delivering, hence not parking, no charge or financial implications/costs incurred etc, as the alleged contravention did not occur. Quite simply, the parking attendant got it wrong, didn’t observe, and vehicle was not parked inappropriately at the time the ticket was issued.

    • No evidence of Landowner Authority – the operator is put to strict proof of full compliance with the BPA Code of Practice.
    Paragraph 7 of the BPA CoP defines the mandatory requirements and I put this operator to strict proof of full compliance: (we intend to quote 7.2, 7.3 a,b,c,d & e)

    • A compliant Notice to keeper was never served – no Keeper Liability can apply. (should we be appealing to POPLA as the keeper??)

    • There was insufficient signage (we can elaborate further and have recent pics and old google pics etc)

    • Mitigating circumstances (we can also elaborate further here as well as the disabled bays are quite a distance from Cineworld and the disabled person being helped was quite ill at the time, we can send copy’s of the Blue Badge’s in question also)

    We can also add, “I am a law abiding citizen and I made an honest mistake” to the mix, but does seem contradictory now they've painted and hatched over with large word of "LOADING ONLY"

    The problem we have is that the photographic evidence that was on the UKPC site has been “unavailable” prior to the appeal letter being issued and is now, of course, totally unavailable on UKPC site, they’re investigation has been concluded and a POPLA number issued.

    We also don’t have a copy of the appeal that was sent either, and my friend is dyslexic so is struggling to recall all the events details and to be able to mentally process the appeals situation, which seems quite complexed, becomes confusing, and creates a stressful and worrying situation.

    Any simplicity and help that could be offered here will be gratefully apricated, as we are now considering putting up and paying up just to settle the situation which is precisely what is expected and intended for us to do.
Page 3
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 13th Dec 17, 11:26 AM
    • 34,079 Posts
    • 18,034 Thanks
    Quentin
    Don't give drivers details! Just the keeper's
    • battlesgallor
    • By battlesgallor 13th Dec 17, 11:31 AM
    • 27 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    battlesgallor
    It wont let me proceed on the form unless I enter "motorists Details" name, address, Postcode etc.

    This Kinda defeats the object here??

    but don't feel you have to answer their questions, you should write a detailed appeal and attach it as a PDF
    NEWBYS's #3
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 13th Dec 17, 11:33 AM
    • 1,537 Posts
    • 1,688 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    Put fake info in them. Sheesh, not difficult!

    Then in the actual appela state that the form required details, however as it did not give you the option to put KEEPER details you filled out OBVIOUSLY incorrect details. The KEEPER details are....
    • battlesgallor
    • By battlesgallor 13th Dec 17, 11:54 AM
    • 27 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    battlesgallor
    Put fake info in them. Sheesh, not difficult!
    No helpful, when your are actually being Honest and have to tick a box on they're site saying "I will submit an honest appeal which accurately describes my understanding of events"
    • nosferatu1001
    • By nosferatu1001 13th Dec 17, 11:55 AM
    • 1,537 Posts
    • 1,688 Thanks
    nosferatu1001
    No, it IS helpful

    they are requiring you to enter information that is NOT something they can demand as a requirement of an appeal
    So you thwart them, and you make a clear statement about what you have done. Give it a name of Donald Trump, 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue and it would be clear to anyone that you are not attempting to be dishonest.
    • battlesgallor
    • By battlesgallor 13th Dec 17, 4:43 PM
    • 27 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    battlesgallor
    Give it a name of Donald Trump, 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue
    RE: above posts,
    we've just had to add this paragraph below to the POPLA APPEAL Letter.
    Is it ok?? would Donald Trump approve??? :-))

    On submitting this Appeal on to the POPLA Website, which is requesting information that is NOT something that is as a requirement of an appeal, additionally, as there is no other option that can be selected or is available to be selected, by the Appellant, on the POPLA Appeal website. If the event arises, that there is any issue with the Appeal form submitted on line, you are respectfully, asked to referred to point 2 paragraph 2 of this Appeal.
    Last edited by battlesgallor; 13-12-2017 at 4:46 PM.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 13th Dec 17, 11:59 PM
    • 52,853 Posts
    • 66,370 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    "Are you submitting this form on behalf of someone else" I've selected "yes"
    No idea what made you tick 'yes'. I don't understand the issue.

    NO-ONE here says to tick that you are appealing 'on behalf of' anyone.

    Tick NO.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • battlesgallor
    • By battlesgallor 14th Dec 17, 9:50 AM
    • 27 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    battlesgallor
    Tick NO.
    There wasn't an option to tick no either :-))) so we Didn't select or tick "Yes" to anything in the end and added the paragraph in post #46 to the Appeals letter referring the Reader to point 2 of the letter.

    Nice little "trip up" point on POPLA website to suggest and ask Appellants to input "MOTORISTS DETAILS"

    It was submitted yesterday, and we can track its progress, so we'll see how it goes from here on. The pictures alone support the signage issues. It'll be interesting to see what comes back from it.

    Its been really good to go through this process and we've learn't a lot on here about PCN and all the info within the cases on this forum helped us to work it all out.

    The support and guidance that has been given is invaluable. Its been a trying and tiring process which we are aware, may need to go further with:-(( but, did the best we could, and felt there was no more that could have been added.

    Can't thank you all enough.

    Will let you know how it goes.

    keep the humour flowing :-000 sarcastic or not, it helps to lighten the load :-00
    Last edited by battlesgallor; 14-12-2017 at 9:52 AM.
    • battlesgallor
    • By battlesgallor 4th Jan 18, 8:55 AM
    • 27 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    battlesgallor
    Hello again & a Happy New Year to you all.

    Just writing/posting to let you know that we had an email from POPLA yesterday which is detailed below.

    Dear X xxxxxxx

    Thank you for submitting your parking charge Appeal to POPLA.
    An Appeal has been opened with the reference XXXXXXXXXX.

    UK Parking Control Ltd have told us they do not wish to contest the Appeal. This means that your Appeal is successful and you do not need to pay the parking charge.

    Yours sincerely
    POPLA Team

    SUCCESS!!!!
    Thank you again to all who guided us through this and helped us understand the process of Appealing.
    If you could let me know how to post or forward this on to the "POPLA Decisions" area of the forum I can load the full POPLA appeal letter that was sent, for others to use if required.

    Little trick or note for others.....We didn't write our appeal defining our title ie: Mr, Mrs, Miss, Ms etc, Just signed our correspondence with an initial and surname. As No Notice to Keeper had not been issued by UKPC, and we were not sure what had been sent in the 1st stage appeal to UKPC. (re Driver/Keeper)

    Invaluable info & lessons learnt ......DON'T REPLY HASTILY TO PCN's....wait and think it through....DO YOUR RESEARCH, Read, Read and Re-Read the NEWBY'S POST and ask for help. Take and add photo's to the Appeal. It may take some time to work it all out, but we will be referring back to this experience because we have been paying out to these companies because if the "14 days" discounted rate scare tactics for far too long now.

    We also kept an eye on the local press from the town this PCN was issued at. The towns local newspaper reported that this particular Parking Leisure site had also ticketed coaches and buses that had an annual agreement to park on the site with the Landowner, whilst taking Groups of children and visitors to the Christmas Panto at the theatre opposite the site even though the drivers stayed with the vehicles and purchased meals from the restaurants on the site.

    Just goes to show that not all PCN companies and they're attendants get it right when issuing these tickets and sticking them to any windscreen they can reach:-))))

    My Friend is truly grateful and ecstatically happy that this is finally over and wishes for me to pass on they're thanks for the help and support given.
    Last edited by battlesgallor; 04-01-2018 at 9:43 AM.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 4th Jan 18, 9:59 PM
    • 52,853 Posts
    • 66,370 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    We also kept an eye on the local press from the town this PCN was issued at. The towns local newspaper reported that this particular Parking Leisure site had also ticketed coaches and buses that had an annual agreement to park on the site with the Landowner, whilst taking Groups of children and visitors to the Christmas Panto at the theatre opposite the site even though the drivers stayed with the vehicles and purchased meals from the restaurants on the site.
    Originally posted by battlesgallor
    Shame on them.

    But well done on the win!


    If you could let me know how to post or forward this on to the "POPLA Decisions" area of the forum I can load the full POPLA appeal letter that was sent, for others to use if required.
    Just 'reply' there and copy & paste this post in.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

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