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  • FIRST POST
    • Katlou
    • By Katlou 7th Dec 17, 11:37 AM
    • 5Posts
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    Katlou
    Dismissed - what next
    • #1
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:37 AM
    Dismissed - what next 7th Dec 17 at 11:37 AM
    I was dismissed from my job 2 days ago due to absence. There was no issues with my performance whatsoever, however I had had three instances of absence (all with a GP's note) for work-related stress within 6 months.

    I also have an issue with my manager as he appears to have been sharing personal information with other colleagues. After I was dismissed I was told by a colleague that another colleague had already been aware that my manager was planning to dismiss me before it had happened, and had said my manager had told him this.

    There have been lots of other occurrences that I consider to be unfair and unjust and I have written a three page letter of appeal to them today.

    However, I am wondering if, in the mean time I would be entitled to JSA?
Page 1
    • andydownes123
    • By andydownes123 7th Dec 17, 11:41 AM
    • 120 Posts
    • 200 Thanks
    andydownes123
    • #2
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:41 AM
    • #2
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:41 AM
    Sounds like you dodged a bullet to me. Three instances of work-related stress in your first six months...I think you're better off somewhere else ! Try another employer in the same sector, see if they are any better. In the first 2 years, an employer can literally sack you for anything.

    To put in context, as an employee for company for over ten years, if I had three instances of absence over six-months (equating to six a year), I'd be in serious trouble.
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 7th Dec 17, 11:42 AM
    • 1,313 Posts
    • 1,062 Thanks
    Comms69
    • #3
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:42 AM
    • #3
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:42 AM
    I was dismissed from my job 2 days ago due to absence. There was no issues with my performance whatsoever, however I had had three instances of absence (all with a GP's note) for work-related stress within 6 months.

    I also have an issue with my manager as he appears to have been sharing personal information with other colleagues. After I was dismissed I was told by a colleague that another colleague had already been aware that my manager was planning to dismiss me before it had happened, and had said my manager had told him this.

    There have been lots of other occurrences that I consider to be unfair and unjust and I have written a three page letter of appeal to them today.

    However, I am wondering if, in the mean time I would be entitled to JSA?
    Originally posted by Katlou


    It depends on a number of issues and DWP typically have their own policies.


    I do have a few questions though (and it's better to not send the letter yet, if you haven't already done so)


    How long had you worked there?
    When you say personal information, do you mean that you would be dismissed? Because a manager reallocating work would be fairly appropriate in such circumstances.
    • Katlou
    • By Katlou 7th Dec 17, 11:48 AM
    • 5 Posts
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    Katlou
    • #4
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:48 AM
    • #4
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:48 AM
    I had been planning to leave anyway but when we had the meeting they would not let me resign and said it was too late as they were dismissing me. I do not want the job back but I certainly would like an apology.

    He shared the information that he was planning to dismiss me before we had even had the meeting to discuss it. This is not the first time he has shared personal information, I have had colleagues tell me private information about other employees that they have obtained from my manager. I am now extremely concerned that he may share personal information I have told him.

    Another issue is that I requested a flexible working request which was suggested by an occupational health doctor and this was turned down, even though other people were allowed this.
    • Ozzuk
    • By Ozzuk 7th Dec 17, 11:49 AM
    • 1,179 Posts
    • 1,726 Thanks
    Ozzuk
    • #5
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:49 AM
    • #5
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:49 AM
    Look for a new job, work on what was causing the stress (try counselling for instance if it helps).

    What do you want to happen? Doesn't sound like you have any chance of getting your job back, and it sounds like it was making you ill anyway. Move on!

    Edit, just saw your recent post. You won't get an apology as that will be an admission of guilt (highley unlikely anyway). And you don't work there anymore, so what does it matter what they say? Try and put it behind you, focus on a new, healthier future.
    Last edited by Ozzuk; 07-12-2017 at 11:52 AM.
    • Katlou
    • By Katlou 7th Dec 17, 11:51 AM
    • 5 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Katlou
    • #6
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:51 AM
    • #6
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:51 AM
    I am happy to move on. My question is whether I will be entitled to JSA.
    • Katlou
    • By Katlou 7th Dec 17, 11:56 AM
    • 5 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Katlou
    • #7
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:56 AM
    • #7
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:56 AM
    Also to put this into context, more than half of the department has also been off long term with stress. I was actively seeking another job and I am happy to have left. However I was not going to just be sacked without having my say which is why i wrote everything out in the appeal letter. I just need to know know what my options are in terms of benefits whilst I'm looking for a new job.
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 7th Dec 17, 11:57 AM
    • 1,313 Posts
    • 1,062 Thanks
    Comms69
    • #8
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:57 AM
    • #8
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:57 AM
    I had been planning to leave anyway but when we had the meeting they would not let me resign and said it was too late as they were dismissing me. I do not want the job back but I certainly would like an apology. - That's not something you'll get I think.

    He shared the information that he was planning to dismiss me before we had even had the meeting to discuss it. - that's fine. This is not the first time he has shared personal information - that's business information. , I have had colleagues tell me private information about other employees that they have obtained from my manager. I am now extremely concerned that he may share personal information I have told him. - He may, why are you telling him personal information? You could possibly seek action if he did, but seems unlikely you'd have proof

    Another issue is that I requested a flexible working request which was suggested by an occupational health doctor and this was turned down, even though other people were allowed this.
    Originally posted by Katlou
    They aren't obliged to allow flexible working, if there's a legitimate business reason
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 7th Dec 17, 11:58 AM
    • 1,313 Posts
    • 1,062 Thanks
    Comms69
    • #9
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:58 AM
    • #9
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:58 AM
    Also to put this into context, more than half of the department has also been off long term with stress. I was actively seeking another job and I am happy to have left. However I was not going to just be sacked without having my say which is why i wrote everything out in the appeal letter. I just need to know know what my options are in terms of benefits whilst I'm looking for a new job.
    Originally posted by Katlou
    Contact Jobcentre today and apply. You don't get paid for first 5 (I think its 5) days anyway, so need to get started.
    • Katlou
    • By Katlou 7th Dec 17, 12:04 PM
    • 5 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Katlou
    He shared the information about dismissing me before we had even had the meeting; prior to the meeting I was told that no decision would be made until we had actually had the meeting as he needed to hear what I had to say first, so it does seem unfair that he was telling other members of staff that he had already decided to dismiss me.

    I have had to share some information with him about medical conditions etc as this had related to my absence. The personal information he shared about other colleagues related to their reasons for being absent such as marriage difficulties and depression that the colleagues had not shared themselves.

    The decision to decline my flexible work request would be understandable if they had not accepted identical requests from other employees.

    I spoke with ACAS who said I may have grounds for appeal on basis on discrimination.
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 7th Dec 17, 12:13 PM
    • 1,313 Posts
    • 1,062 Thanks
    Comms69
    He shared the information about dismissing me before we had even had the meeting; prior to the meeting I was told that no decision would be made until we had actually had the meeting as he needed to hear what I had to say first, so it does seem unfair that he was telling other members of staff that he had already decided to dismiss me. - How long had you worked there? (second time of asking)

    I have had to share some information with him about medical conditions etc as this had related to my absence. - That's fair enough, and no, he shouldn't share that kind of information. The personal information he shared about other colleagues related to their reasons for being absent such as marriage difficulties and depression that the colleagues had not shared themselves. - fair enough.

    The decision to decline my flexible work request would be understandable if they had not accepted identical requests from other employees. - No, the business can accept and reject each application. Each application is treated individually. He can say yes to 19 people and no to the 20th

    I spoke with ACAS who said I may have grounds for appeal on basis on discrimination.
    Originally posted by Katlou
    Discrimination?? on which protected characteristic? You yourself haven't mentioned one so far
    • Nicki
    • By Nicki 7th Dec 17, 12:24 PM
    • 7,568 Posts
    • 26,545 Thanks
    Nicki
    In my team of 7, 2 have flexible working arrangements (reflected in their pay and other terms) and if anyone else asked for the same arrangements I would need to say no because I wouldn't be able to accommodate this and meet business needs. Sometimes these things are first come first served I'm afraid and just because one person has been accommodated doesn't mean you are setting a precedent and the whole team can do the same.
    • Ozzuk
    • By Ozzuk 7th Dec 17, 12:32 PM
    • 1,179 Posts
    • 1,726 Thanks
    Ozzuk
    I am happy to move on. My question is whether I will be entitled to JSA.
    Originally posted by Katlou
    I'd stick with this, I can't see them employing you again, and again, why would you want to?
    • Chrysalis
    • By Chrysalis 7th Dec 17, 12:40 PM
    • 2,083 Posts
    • 955 Thanks
    Chrysalis
    Personally I find it very worrying that its standard practice now for employers to count sickness as a disciplinary. My sister's work does it, amazon does it, your employer did it. One of my old employers did it. I can understand if someone takes several days off without medical evidence in a short period of time, but 3 times in six months all covered by a sicknote in my view should not have disciplinary procedures.
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 7th Dec 17, 12:43 PM
    • 1,313 Posts
    • 1,062 Thanks
    Comms69
    Personally I find it very worrying that its standard practice now for employers to count sickness as a disciplinary. My sister's work does it, amazon does it, your employer did it. One of my old employers did it. I can understand if someone takes several days off without medical evidence in a short period of time, but 3 times in six months all covered by a sicknote in my view should not have disciplinary procedures.
    Originally posted by Chrysalis


    3 times in six months, covered by a sick note suggests it was more than 1 week each time (self cert 7 days)


    Whilst I don't know, a sensible guess would be 2 weeks each. 25% of the time was spent off sick
    • Takeaway_Addict
    • By Takeaway_Addict 7th Dec 17, 12:44 PM
    • 5,670 Posts
    • 6,469 Thanks
    Takeaway_Addict
    Personally I find it very worrying that its standard practice now for employers to count sickness as a disciplinary. My sister's work does it, amazon does it, your employer did it. One of my old employers did it. I can understand if someone takes several days off without medical evidence in a short period of time, but 3 times in six months all covered by a sicknote in my view should not have disciplinary procedures.
    Originally posted by Chrysalis
    So where is the acceptable and unacceptable limit for you? Four absences, five, ten?

    Personally for me three in 6 months isn't dismissal but still could be a disciplinary process allowing time for improvement but also allowing for investigation from the employer to see if they can help.
    Don't trust a forum for advice. Get proper paid advice. Any advice given should always be checked
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 7th Dec 17, 1:01 PM
    • 15,825 Posts
    • 9,118 Thanks
    motorguy
    I am happy to move on.
    Originally posted by Katlou
    Thats not whats coming across on here....
    You are not special. You are not a beautiful and unique snowflake.
    • mac.d
    • By mac.d 7th Dec 17, 1:26 PM
    • 538 Posts
    • 414 Thanks
    mac.d
    Personally for me three in 6 months isn't dismissal but still could be a disciplinary process allowing time for improvement but also allowing for investigation from the employer to see if they can help.
    Originally posted by Takeaway_Addict
    Wouldn't this be the case for most employers? For it to result in dismissal wouldn't it suggest that its either not the first time someone's sickness record has been looked at, or its not the only issue the employer has with the person?
    • LeeUK
    • By LeeUK 7th Dec 17, 1:53 PM
    • 5,670 Posts
    • 2,609 Thanks
    LeeUK
    Get that JSA claim in now. You'll get paid until you show them your P45 then they may sanction you depending on the mood of the Job Centre wifey on the day you go in with it.
    • ohreally
    • By ohreally 7th Dec 17, 2:37 PM
    • 6,359 Posts
    • 4,866 Thanks
    ohreally
    Personally I find it very worrying that its standard practice now for employers to count sickness as a disciplinary
    Originally posted by Chrysalis
    Why? ......
    Last edited by ohreally; 07-12-2017 at 5:04 PM.
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