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    • pointer7
    • By pointer7 7th Dec 17, 9:31 AM
    • 55Posts
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    pointer7
    Estate Agent Asking For ID?
    • #1
    • 7th Dec 17, 9:31 AM
    Estate Agent Asking For ID? 7th Dec 17 at 9:31 AM
    Hello All,

    I have made an offer on a property this morning. I haven't heard whether it has been accepted or not yet but the sellers agents are asking for me to bring ID in.

    Obviously I said if the offer isn't accepted then no I wont be (no point) if it is then I will but then I thought why cant they contact my solicitors as they have copies of my ID anyway?

    Should they be doing this or would I have to actually pop in to the agents?
Page 1
    • camelot1971
    • By camelot1971 7th Dec 17, 9:36 AM
    • 547 Posts
    • 859 Thanks
    camelot1971
    • #2
    • 7th Dec 17, 9:36 AM
    • #2
    • 7th Dec 17, 9:36 AM
    Estate agents have a legal obligation to verify the identity of someone buying property. It's part of the money laundering regulations. Until the offer is accepted though there is no need as there is no contract.

    You could probably use your solicitors but I bet they would charge you!
    • anselld
    • By anselld 7th Dec 17, 9:37 AM
    • 5,418 Posts
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    anselld
    • #3
    • 7th Dec 17, 9:37 AM
    • #3
    • 7th Dec 17, 9:37 AM
    EAs have responsibility to undertake ID checks to comply with money laundering regulations.

    Do you really want to pay Solicitors rates for photocopying your ID?
    • Surrey_EA
    • By Surrey_EA 7th Dec 17, 9:40 AM
    • 1,298 Posts
    • 1,551 Thanks
    Surrey_EA
    • #4
    • 7th Dec 17, 9:40 AM
    • #4
    • 7th Dec 17, 9:40 AM
    As above, EAs need to comply with anti money laundering regulations.

    However, most agents wouldn't start asking for ID until after the offer is accepted.
    • pointer7
    • By pointer7 7th Dec 17, 9:42 AM
    • 55 Posts
    • 9 Thanks
    pointer7
    • #5
    • 7th Dec 17, 9:42 AM
    • #5
    • 7th Dec 17, 9:42 AM
    Solicitors have already taken my ID when we instructed them to act for us as its standard procedure anyway.

    I guess I'll pop in if the offer is accepted
    • Surrey_EA
    • By Surrey_EA 7th Dec 17, 11:07 AM
    • 1,298 Posts
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    Surrey_EA
    • #6
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:07 AM
    • #6
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:07 AM
    Solicitors have already taken my ID when we instructed them to act for us as its standard procedure anyway.

    I guess I'll pop in if the offer is accepted
    Originally posted by pointer7
    It is now standard procedure for Estate Agents too. If you're arranging a mortgage your broker, or mortgage lender will probably need ID verification as well.
    • googler
    • By googler 7th Dec 17, 11:34 AM
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    googler
    • #7
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:34 AM
    • #7
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:34 AM
    "Money laundering customer due diligence on buyers – is it an obligation?

    In general terms, the Money Laundering Regulations require sales agents to carry out customer due diligence (CDD) on their ‘customers’. Customers are defined as the individuals or businesses that enter into contracts with sales agents to market properties.
    In the case of acquisition or buying agents, it would be the individuals or businesses they enter into contracts with contracts to acquire properties.

    There is a further obligation with regard to beneficial owners ...

    Therefore, there is absolutely no obligation on sales agent to carry out CDD on buyers, or acquisition agents to do this on sellers.

    The misunderstanding has arisen because HMRC enforcement officers have been indicating that it would be ‘best practice’ to obtain this ID confirmation and this has also been a theme in the ongoing HMRC money laundering webinars."

    https://www.estateagenttoday.co.uk/industry-views/2016/4/money-laundering-customer-due-diligence-on-buyers--is-it-an-obligation
    • m0bov
    • By m0bov 7th Dec 17, 11:42 AM
    • 1,139 Posts
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    m0bov
    • #8
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:42 AM
    • #8
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:42 AM
    You have no contact with the EA, so no need for ID. The solicitor carries out the money checks, not the EA. So, if it causes you an issue, speak to the vendor directly. They might be trying to credit score you or pass your details to in house mortgage sales.
    • Surrey_EA
    • By Surrey_EA 7th Dec 17, 11:52 AM
    • 1,298 Posts
    • 1,551 Thanks
    Surrey_EA
    • #9
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:52 AM
    • #9
    • 7th Dec 17, 11:52 AM
    "Money laundering customer due diligence on buyers – is it an obligation?

    In general terms, the Money Laundering Regulations require sales agents to carry out customer due diligence (CDD) on their ‘customers’. Customers are defined as the individuals or businesses that enter into contracts with sales agents to market properties.
    In the case of acquisition or buying agents, it would be the individuals or businesses they enter into contracts with contracts to acquire properties.

    There is a further obligation with regard to beneficial owners ...

    Therefore, there is absolutely no obligation on sales agent to carry out CDD on buyers, or acquisition agents to do this on sellers.

    The misunderstanding has arisen because HMRC enforcement officers have been indicating that it would be ‘best practice’ to obtain this ID confirmation and this has also been a theme in the ongoing HMRC money laundering webinars."

    https://www.estateagenttoday.co.uk/industry-views/2016/4/money-laundering-customer-due-diligence-on-buyers--is-it-an-obligation
    Originally posted by googler
    It is my understanding that it has since been clarified by HMRC that EAs do have to carry out AML checks on both buyers and sellers:

    The government sought views on whether the requirement on estate agents to carry out customer due diligence should be clarified. This is because, in the UK, estate agents tend to act only for one of the parties to a transaction, usually the vendor. However, estate agents act as a key facilitator of the transaction and may be the only regulated professional whom the buyer encounters when purchasing a property. The government will clarify that for the purposes of the regulations, an estate agent is to be considered as entering into a business relationship with a purchaser as well with as a seller. This means that estate agency businesses must apply CDD to both contracting parties in a transaction.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/money-laundering-regulations-2017/money-laundering-regulations-2017#estate-agent-businesses
    • Surrey_EA
    • By Surrey_EA 7th Dec 17, 11:59 AM
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    Surrey_EA
    You have no contact with the EA, so no need for ID. The solicitor carries out the money checks, not the EA.
    Originally posted by m0bov
    It does not matter that the buyer does not have a contract with the EA, following updates to anti money laundering regulations earlier this year, HMRC now requires estate agents to carry out ID checks, please see my post above. Solicitors carry out AML checks as well as the EA.

    So, if it causes you an issue, speak to the vendor directly.
    Originally posted by m0bov
    Why would it cause an issue, and what do you think the vendor is going to do about it?


    They might be trying to credit score you or pass your details to in house mortgage sales
    Originally posted by m0bov
    Is this seriously what you think?
    • ReadingTim
    • By ReadingTim 7th Dec 17, 12:16 PM
    • 2,215 Posts
    • 3,138 Thanks
    ReadingTim
    Here's a way to get answers to both of your questions at once, ie whether the offer's been accepted, and whether you have to bring in ID.

    Say you won't be providing any ID. You'll soon hear that your offer hasn't been accepted. Sorted!
    • Surrey_EA
    • By Surrey_EA 7th Dec 17, 12:17 PM
    • 1,298 Posts
    • 1,551 Thanks
    Surrey_EA
    "Money laundering customer due diligence on buyers – is it an obligation?
    Originally posted by googler
    The article you link to is from April 2016, the rules have subsequently been clarified to confirm EAs need to perform AML checks on buyers.
    • Slinky
    • By Slinky 7th Dec 17, 12:30 PM
    • 4,758 Posts
    • 20,753 Thanks
    Slinky
    The EA we bought through insisted on seeing ID and proof of funds for our cash offer. I took them with me when I first viewed as I wasn't going to go back to show them if our offer was successful, as it was over 200 miles round trip.
    • googler
    • By googler 7th Dec 17, 1:11 PM
    • 14,471 Posts
    • 9,346 Thanks
    googler
    It is my understanding that it has since been clarified by HMRC that EAs do have to carry out AML checks on both buyers and sellers:
    Originally posted by Surrey_EA
    They sure have. Ignore my previous post.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/628696/Estate_Agency_Businesses_Guidance_.pdf#
    • googler
    • By googler 7th Dec 17, 4:47 PM
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    • 9,346 Thanks
    googler
    The plot thickens.

    The Law Society of Scotland reckon that the new requirements don't apply to Scottish solicitor firms, that they are exempted from the definition of 'estate agents' in the regulations.

    This raises an interesting conundrum north of the border, then, where this suggests that;

    - A solicitor firm performing estate agency business and handling conveyancing for that business is not required to ID buyers, but ...

    - An estate agency firm (who would pass a buyer's accepted offer on to a separate solicitor firm to perform conveyancing) is required to ID their buyers.

    https://www.lawscot.org.uk/members/business-support/financial-compliance/anti-money-laundering/money-laundering-regulations-2017/
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