Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • crisN
    • By crisN 5th Dec 17, 2:59 PM
    • 4Posts
    • 1Thanks
    crisN
    Letting agent went into rental without permission
    • #1
    • 5th Dec 17, 2:59 PM
    Letting agent went into rental without permission 5th Dec 17 at 2:59 PM
    Hi,
    My daughter and son in law have told their landlady that they don't wish to renew their tenancy after two and a half years of (almost) problem free renting.
    The Tenancy finishes in five weeks time and they have seen it advertised but have had no viewings, my daughter noticed a week or so ago that the flat using old photos was taken down. She then spotted yesterday that the letting agents have put another advert up using photographs of the flat with their furniture and several photographs of my grandson along with his name in large letters on the wall of his bedroom and school certificates! They have obviously entered the flat while my daughter and Son-in Law have been at work and taken these photographs without permission or notice. This is a well known estate agent! When they phoned yesterday they were told that it was miscommunication between themselves and the landlady. Most of the photos were taken off.
    Although still leaving one showing my grandson and school certificates, this has now been taken down.. We have asked for a full report of how this happened. The Letting Agents have now admitted that it was a junior member of staff who is at fault and the Branch has apologised.
    We want some redress for this as my daughter is very upset by this, what should they do when they have the report? The landlady who apologised on behalf of the Letting Agents wants to have new photographs taken which of course my daughter has agreed to as per the Contract with the correct notice. Any advise on how they stand legally?
Page 2
    • vicki2221
    • By vicki2221 5th Dec 17, 4:36 PM
    • 110 Posts
    • 210 Thanks
    vicki2221
    My landlord let himself in to my old flat all the time when I was at work with no notice whatsoever. I complained but it didn't stop. Then I also had the letting agents let themselves in on viewings twice with no notice. I never even got an apology. I know everyone will probably say I should get over it but 5 years later it still makes me upset when I think about it because they were so disrespectful, again and again. However, in your case it does sound like it was a genuine mistake. Change the locks anyway.
    • Lokolo
    • By Lokolo 5th Dec 17, 4:46 PM
    • 19,858 Posts
    • 14,948 Thanks
    Lokolo
    As per tenancy agreement;
    'Not to alter or change or install any locks or or any windows in or about the property or have any additional keys made for any locks without consent of the landlord'.


    As per NSPCC website;
    Risk factors

    Some of the potential risks of photography and filming include:
    • children may be identifiable when a photograph is shared with personal information
    • direct and indirect risks to children and young people when photographs are shared on websites and in publications with personal information
    • inappropriate photographs or recorded images of children
    • inappropriate use, adaptation or copying of images.
    As none of you addressed this major point here is some information!
    Have a nice life.
    Originally posted by crisN
    What major point?

    You raised it with the EA and they removed the photos. You even said that yourself.

    As for the tenancy agreement, if you were actually polite enough to come and ask about that line in your agreement we would tell you that it is unenforceable and you can change the lock, as long as you return the property in its original state (i.e. with the original locks).
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 5th Dec 17, 4:46 PM
    • 1,322 Posts
    • 1,073 Thanks
    Comms69
    As per tenancy agreement;
    'Not to alter or change or install any locks or or any windows in or about the property or have any additional keys made for any locks without consent of the landlord'. - Ignore. Not relevant. Totally not enforceable.


    As per NSPCC website; - Not the law.....
    Risk factors

    Some of the potential risks of photography and filming include:
    • children may be identifiable when a photograph is shared with personal information
    • direct and indirect risks to children and young people when photographs are shared on websites and in publications with personal information
    • inappropriate photographs or recorded images of children
    • inappropriate use, adaptation or copying of images.
    As none of you addressed this major point here is some information!
    Have a nice life.
    Originally posted by crisN


    The NSPCC guidance is for children who are at risk / have safeguarding protections in place (AND IS NOT THE LAW).


    For example - I could photograph you, your child, their child and their child and anyone else.
    • G_M
    • By G_M 5th Dec 17, 4:49 PM
    • 42,359 Posts
    • 49,220 Thanks
    G_M
    As per tenancy agreement;
    'Not to alter or change or install any locks or or any windows in or about the property or have any additional keys made for any locks without consent of the landlord'.

    As already explained, a court would almost certainly reject any application to enforce this clause given the history. Assuming the LL actually went to court.

    As per NSPCC website;
    Risk factors

    Some of the potential risks of photography and filming include:
    • children may be identifiable when a photograph is shared with personal information
    • direct and indirect risks to children and young people when photographs are shared on websites and in publications with personal information
    • inappropriate photographs or recorded images of children
    • inappropriate use, adaptation or copying of images.
    As none of you addressed this major point here is some information!
    .
    Originally posted by crisN
    OK. NSPCC have outlined some 'risk factors'.

    1) that does not make it illegal as you claimed.
    2) tThe risk has been aknowledged by the agent.
    The risk (photos) has been removed.
    An apology has been given.

    NOW GO OUT AND ENJOY YOURSELF AND GET OVER THIS.

    Both of you.

    edit: to put this in another context, if the agent had responded by telling you they have the right to advertise the property as they want, and refused to remove the photos, then I would be supporting you and suggesting further action.
    Last edited by G_M; 05-12-2017 at 4:51 PM.
    • LEJC
    • By LEJC 5th Dec 17, 4:54 PM
    • 9,041 Posts
    • 59,569 Thanks
    LEJC
    Is your daughter allowing viewings of the property whilst they are still living there?
    who will be conducting viewings...and presumably either your daughter or son in law will be present during each one?
    frugal October...£41.82 of £40 food shopping spend for the 2 of us!

    2017 toiletries challenge 170 out 144 in ...£18.64 spend
    • fairy lights
    • By fairy lights 5th Dec 17, 4:55 PM
    • 8,361 Posts
    • 28,099 Thanks
    fairy lights
    As per tenancy agreement;
    'Not to alter or change or install any locks or or any windows in or about the property or have any additional keys made for any locks without consent of the landlord'.


    As per NSPCC website;
    Risk factors

    Some of the potential risks of photography and filming include:
    • children may be identifiable when a photograph is shared with personal information
    • direct and indirect risks to children and young people when photographs are shared on websites and in publications with personal information
    • inappropriate photographs or recorded images of children
    • inappropriate use, adaptation or copying of images.
    As none of you addressed this major point here is some information!
    Have a nice life.
    Originally posted by crisN
    Are your grandkids in the witness protection programme?
    I find it really strange that you're so paranoid about their safety, yet won't consider changing the locks.
    • G_M
    • By G_M 5th Dec 17, 4:59 PM
    • 42,359 Posts
    • 49,220 Thanks
    G_M
    are your grandkids in the witness protection programme?
    I find it really strange that you're so paranoid about their safety, yet won't consider changing the locks.
    Originally posted by fairy lights
    Good point.
    • LEJC
    • By LEJC 5th Dec 17, 5:00 PM
    • 9,041 Posts
    • 59,569 Thanks
    LEJC
    Are your grandkids in the witness protection programme?
    I find it really strange that you're so paranoid about their safety, yet won't consider changing the locks.
    Originally posted by fairy lights
    well slightly off topic...but in a similar vein I was going to ask if perhaps the grandchild would be in the school nativity this year...and whether the OP would be enforcing the no photos rule to other grandparents who happened to catch her child in a group photo.....without seeking relevant permissions.
    frugal October...£41.82 of £40 food shopping spend for the 2 of us!

    2017 toiletries challenge 170 out 144 in ...£18.64 spend
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 5th Dec 17, 5:01 PM
    • 1,322 Posts
    • 1,073 Thanks
    Comms69
    Are your grandkids in the witness protection programme?
    I find it really strange that you're so paranoid about their safety, yet won't consider changing the locks.
    Originally posted by fairy lights


    Everyone with a camera is a !!!!!phile or a terrorist these days.


    Basic precautions like monitoring children's internet usage go out the window, but you try to snap a scene with a child in it and all hell breaks loose.
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 5th Dec 17, 5:04 PM
    • 1,322 Posts
    • 1,073 Thanks
    Comms69
    well slightly off topic...but in a similar vein I was going to ask if perhaps the grandchild would be in the school nativity this year...and whether the OP would be enforcing the no photos rule to other grandparents who happened to catch her child in a group photo.....without seeking relevant permissions.
    Originally posted by LEJC


    - actually this is one of the few places are photographs should be restricted (for the reasons set out above) statistically there's atleast one child on a safeguarding list in a class.


    Typically the school gets parents to take photographs after the performance when the child cannot be seen. Mostly the reason for this is to protect them from actual harm. - having done photography and filming at various schools, it's surprising how often this is sadly the case.
    • iammumtoone
    • By iammumtoone 5th Dec 17, 5:06 PM
    • 5,369 Posts
    • 11,024 Thanks
    iammumtoone
    I would not worry about it too much.

    Pervs do not stare at pictures of children in school photos/family photographs.

    Your grandson could be identified where he lives by this information but they are moving so this become irrelevant.

    Whilst it should never have happened the only reason this could become an issue was if your daughter was trying to hide from someone (in cases of abuse/safeguarding etc).
    • LEJC
    • By LEJC 5th Dec 17, 5:11 PM
    • 9,041 Posts
    • 59,569 Thanks
    LEJC
    - actually this is one of the few places are photographs should be restricted (for the reasons set out above) statistically there's atleast one child on a safeguarding list in a class.


    Typically the school gets parents to take photographs after the performance when the child cannot be seen. Mostly the reason for this is to protect them from actual harm. - having done photography and filming at various schools, it's surprising how often this is sadly the case.
    Originally posted by Comms69
    and in a lot of schools in my area now it is restricted...its a sign of the times...

    I think perhaps I picked a bad example but wanted to highlight the difference between parental/grandparental pride at a performance and what the OP clearly thinks is intrusion.
    They are obviously proud of their child's achievements to display the information on the wall ...I just wonder if they would have removed the certificates prior to new viewings or actually it's only become am issue when the photos have been put on RM or wherever they were advertised.
    In my experience you proudly display things you want visitors to your house to comment on.....else you would keep them in a drawer away from prying eyes.

    and then of course...Grandma then enters a public forum read by an unrestricted number of people to discuss it.......

    It puts a whole new spin on photos on RM though...I mean how many house for sale do you see with clearly visable photos of the family that live there...quite a few.

    although as a LL I have to say I much prefer my marketing photos to show blank rooms,it's always worked far better for me than pictures with tenants furnishings.
    Last edited by LEJC; 05-12-2017 at 5:22 PM.
    frugal October...£41.82 of £40 food shopping spend for the 2 of us!

    2017 toiletries challenge 170 out 144 in ...£18.64 spend
    • ThePants999
    • By ThePants999 5th Dec 17, 5:18 PM
    • 904 Posts
    • 1,060 Thanks
    ThePants999
    In today's shocking news, it turns out that there's a correlation between overreacting to a minor situation, and overreacting to being told that you overreacted.
    • mchale
    • By mchale 5th Dec 17, 6:51 PM
    • 1,662 Posts
    • 931 Thanks
    mchale
    ask about that line in your agreement we would tell you that it is unenforceable and you can change the lock, as long as you return the property in its original state (i.e. with the original locks).
    Originally posted by Lokolo
    Agree with the above but bear in mind you could be held liable for any damage/costs caused by the LL for gaining entry into the property in a emergency because locks have been changed, also you may well get a section 21 issued.
    ANURADHA KOIRALA ??? go on throw it in google.
    • G_M
    • By G_M 5th Dec 17, 7:13 PM
    • 42,359 Posts
    • 49,220 Thanks
    G_M
    Agree with the above but bear in mind you could be held liable for any damage/costs caused by the LL for gaining entry into the property in a emergency because locks have been changed, also you may well get a section 21 issued.
    Originally posted by mchale
    If the house is on fire (emergency), the fire brigade are unlikely to hang around waiting for the LL to turn up with a key, so whether the key works or not becomes moot......

    Section 21 is irrelevant as OP is leaving anyway.....
    • cjdavies
    • By cjdavies 5th Dec 17, 7:27 PM
    • 2,858 Posts
    • 2,896 Thanks
    cjdavies
    Seriously you all need to get something else in your lives, try going out and enjoying life.
    Originally posted by crisN
    while complaining about photos even after taken down and apologised.
    • mchale
    • By mchale 5th Dec 17, 7:39 PM
    • 1,662 Posts
    • 931 Thanks
    mchale
    If the house is on fire (emergency), the fire brigade are unlikely to hang around waiting for the LL to turn up with a key, so whether the key works or not becomes moot......

    Section 21 is irrelevant as OP is leaving anyway.....
    Originally posted by G_M

    Was thinking more of water/gas leak, sec 21 would be relevant for tenants living in a property & thinking of changing locks.
    ANURADHA KOIRALA ??? go on throw it in google.
    • G_M
    • By G_M 5th Dec 17, 7:58 PM
    • 42,359 Posts
    • 49,220 Thanks
    G_M
    Was thinking more of water/gas leak, sec 21 would be relevant for tenants living in a property & thinking of changing locks.
    Originally posted by mchale
    How would/could the LL know if there was a gas or water leak?

    Oh! Yes - I guess the tenants called and told him. So the LL needs a key because.......
    • PersianCatLady
    • By PersianCatLady 5th Dec 17, 8:05 PM
    • 348 Posts
    • 327 Thanks
    PersianCatLady
    I still want to know what redress were you expecting in addition to the photos being removed considering you say you don't want financial compensation??
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 5th Dec 17, 8:05 PM
    • 6,293 Posts
    • 6,078 Thanks
    davidmcn
    How would/could the LL know if there was a gas or water leak?

    Oh! Yes - I guess the tenants called and told him. So the LL needs a key because.......
    Originally posted by G_M
    I suppose the people downstairs might have contacted the LL, though tbh if I were the downstairs neighbour being flooded I'd already have made my own door-opening arrangements...
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

3,834Posts Today

8,561Users online

Martin's Twitter