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  • FIRST POST
    • teddysmum
    • By teddysmum 2nd Dec 17, 2:00 PM
    • 8,606Posts
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    teddysmum
    Npower letter re smartmeters
    • #1
    • 2nd Dec 17, 2:00 PM
    Npower letter re smartmeters 2nd Dec 17 at 2:00 PM
    Npower are sending out letters saying they are replacing all their meters with smart meters, saying you will soon be given an appointment for your conversion .


    There is a leaflet with supposed FAQs, but nowhere does it say that they are not compulsory.


    I rang, today, to complain that they aren't compulsory and the man has tagged my meter as 'refused', saying that tag remains in place until I choose to alter it. (The special line was very busy , so I assume they have had lots of calls about the matter.)


    It may be worth pointing this out to any vulnerable people you know ,who may take the letter as 'legal'.
Page 1
    • Cardew
    • By Cardew 2nd Dec 17, 2:09 PM
    • 27,103 Posts
    • 13,219 Thanks
    Cardew
    • #2
    • 2nd Dec 17, 2:09 PM
    • #2
    • 2nd Dec 17, 2:09 PM
    I have had an email and yesterday a phone call from Ovo trying to persuade me(unsuccessfully) to have a smart-meter.

    Does anyone know what financial incentive(if any) is being offered to the companies to get rid of SMETS1 meters?
    • Hengus
    • By Hengus 2nd Dec 17, 2:11 PM
    • 4,635 Posts
    • 2,809 Thanks
    Hengus
    • #3
    • 2nd Dec 17, 2:11 PM
    • #3
    • 2nd Dec 17, 2:11 PM
    I note that the following document makes no mention of the need to advise consumers that there is a choice:

    http://www.npower.com/idc/groups/wcms_content/@wcms/@corp/documents/digitalassets/smicop-pdf.pdf?bcsi_scan_eec049581022ee5a=1

    I suspect that this is a deliberate attempt by the industry to reduce the number of people who are currently saying 'No'.
    • EachPenny
    • By EachPenny 2nd Dec 17, 2:36 PM
    • 3,264 Posts
    • 6,004 Thanks
    EachPenny
    • #4
    • 2nd Dec 17, 2:36 PM
    • #4
    • 2nd Dec 17, 2:36 PM
    Does anyone know what financial incentive(if any) is being offered to the companies to get rid of SMETS1 meters?
    Originally posted by Cardew
    I imagine the main one is not having to write off the cost of stocks of useless SMETS1 meters when the Government finally gets its act together and tells the companies to stop installing them.
    "In the future, everyone will be rich for 15 minutes"
    • Hengus
    • By Hengus 2nd Dec 17, 2:42 PM
    • 4,635 Posts
    • 2,809 Thanks
    Hengus
    • #5
    • 2nd Dec 17, 2:42 PM
    • #5
    • 2nd Dec 17, 2:42 PM
    I imagine the main one is not having to write off the cost of stocks of useless SMETS1 meters when the Government finally gets its act together and tells the companies to stop installing them.
    Originally posted by EachPenny
    The SMETS1 stop date is currently under BEIS review. Govt is worried that the smart meter roll out programme could stall as SMETS2 meters are still under DCC integration testing.
  • nPower
    • #6
    • 2nd Dec 17, 2:50 PM
    • #6
    • 2nd Dec 17, 2:50 PM
    Npower are sending out letters saying they are replacing all their meters with smart meters, saying you will soon be given an appointment for your conversion .


    There is a leaflet with supposed FAQs, but nowhere does it say that they are not compulsory.


    I rang, today, to complain that they aren't compulsory and the man has tagged my meter as 'refused', saying that tag remains in place until I choose to alter it. (The special line was very busy , so I assume they have had lots of calls about the matter.)


    It may be worth pointing this out to any vulnerable people you know ,who may take the letter as 'legal'.
    Originally posted by teddysmum






    Hi teddysmum,

    Thanks for your message. If you'd like further information about smart meters please contact us using the details on our profile page.

    Thanks,

    Jen
    Official Company Representative"
    I am the official company representative of nPower. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to queries about the company, so that I can help solve issues. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. I am not allowed to tout for business at all. If you believe I am please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com This does NOT imply any form of approval of my company or its products by MSE.
    If we ask you to contact us, please do so using helpandsupport@npower.com - MSE Forum has temporarily allowed the display of our contact details in our signature due to a technical issue with our profile
    • Hengus
    • By Hengus 2nd Dec 17, 4:53 PM
    • 4,635 Posts
    • 2,809 Thanks
    Hengus
    • #7
    • 2nd Dec 17, 4:53 PM
    • #7
    • 2nd Dec 17, 4:53 PM
    Hi teddysmum,

    Thanks for your message. If you'd like further information about smart meters please contact us using the details on our profile page.

    Thanks,

    Jen
    Originally posted by nPower
    NPower customers should note:

    Quote Npower recently started "small scale pilot installs" of the new smart meters, and expects a wider rollout at some point next year. Unquote

    Source: MSE
    • gsmlnx
    • By gsmlnx 2nd Dec 17, 6:40 PM
    • 717 Posts
    • 587 Thanks
    gsmlnx
    • #8
    • 2nd Dec 17, 6:40 PM
    • #8
    • 2nd Dec 17, 6:40 PM
    I had my npower electricity meter read recently. The reader asked if I would like a Smart Meter and just laughed when I said "No, I'll wait until they really work probably around version 3 of the meters"
    • House Martin
    • By House Martin 2nd Dec 17, 6:57 PM
    • 717 Posts
    • 620 Thanks
    House Martin
    • #9
    • 2nd Dec 17, 6:57 PM
    • #9
    • 2nd Dec 17, 6:57 PM
    Eon meter readers are also getting training to book smart meter install dates. They have not been told to ask customers if they actually want one in their spiel.They are booking smart meter installs to meters coming to the end of their life.
    I think any supplier has the right to fit a smart meter to refusers so long as the meter is nt connected via a hub to the server. . There should be no one who can complain about that surely.
    I personally don`t fancy having the awful Liberty Secure meters Eon now fit in my property and will refuse them.
    If they still have Landis Gyr meters I will be happy with them.
    Last edited by House Martin; 02-12-2017 at 7:19 PM.
    • teddysmum
    • By teddysmum 2nd Dec 17, 8:20 PM
    • 8,606 Posts
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    teddysmum
    I had my npower electricity meter read recently. The reader asked if I would like a Smart Meter and just laughed when I said "No, I'll wait until they really work probably around version 3 of the meters"
    Originally posted by gsmlnx


    That's something like what I said to the man I spoke to, after he mentioned that actually we weren't due until February when the new meters are being tried . (There is no way of knowing whether we would be given the new version)


    I don't see any personal gain from a smart meter for electricity as our readings are sent online and before the required date, so no 'nasty' estimates. The electric meter is easy to read being by the front door and at an easy height, but the gas meter is a problem, being low set and in the walk in pantry, but this doesn't affect billing.


    They could save money if they didn't send meter readers (except for mandatory readings) to premises where regular readings are submitted, as it's a waste of time and can lead to complications when a reader either doesn't send in the result or it is rejected for some reason.
    • House Martin
    • By House Martin 3rd Dec 17, 11:45 PM
    • 717 Posts
    • 620 Thanks
    House Martin
    Nice to know a couple of people are my "followers " (or more like stalkers ) I can t reciprocate I m afraid
    You both missed my "double standards "post earlier on the same subject .
    i do have a hatred of the American Liberty Secure meters which give too much information.Typical Yanks !
    It might be acceptable for the odd weirdo s who are techno geeks, but for normal people, we just want the 5 digit number reading displayed (in kwhs for the electric meter and cub3 for gas ) on the first screen,clearly and not have to scrabble about pressing buttons of a tiny keyboard (9 ) which sets the meter scrolling madly round displaying lots of other info which is nt needed by a European just to see what the reading is whilst under the stairs with a torch.
    .Don t forget old Ken and Marge are not too good at bending down nowadays. Eon are not concerned about the end user but they save a few quid on the cost of the meter
    I ve seen thousands of these meters in use and never heard a good word said about them.
    I challenge the head of meter asset boss at Eon to come around with me on my rounds and listen to what the UK think about Liberty Secure rubbish meters.
    I can see why the cheapjack suppliers buy them like Ovo, Utilita First Utility etc , because they are £20 cheaper than Landis Gyr meters but not one of the big six like Eon. shocking decision !
    I will be switching from Eon in 11 months time anyway so I wont have to refuse them and their dreadful meters
    Last edited by House Martin; 04-12-2017 at 8:10 AM.
    • EachPenny
    • By EachPenny 4th Dec 17, 12:15 AM
    • 3,264 Posts
    • 6,004 Thanks
    EachPenny
    .Don t forget old Ken and Marge are not too good at bending down nowadays. Eon are not concerned about the end user but they save a few quid on the cost of the meter
    I ve seen thousands of these meters in use and never heard a good word said about them.
    Originally posted by House Martin
    The thing is HM, I and I suspect many other posters completely agree with you when you say things like this - I've even thanked your post because I agree so much.

    Energy supply is a consumer service, which means the consumer ought to get much more say in how that service is delivered to them. They ought to be able to express a preference for the type of meter they want and how their information is shared.

    But then you put your other hat on, and join your colleagues who appear to be somewhat obsessed with enforcement and fiddling and imposing their will on people who it appears should consider themselves very fortunate that the energy companies are willing to supply them with energy, provided they agree to be very good boys and girls.

    The big energy companies don't seem to have broken away from the notion they are in charge and the customers need to do what they are jolly well told. A wake up call is much needed, but unfortunately I don't think this government is the one to do it.
    "In the future, everyone will be rich for 15 minutes"
    • Carrot007
    • By Carrot007 4th Dec 17, 1:57 AM
    • 736 Posts
    • 589 Thanks
    Carrot007
    Energy supply is a consumer service, which means the consumer ought to get much more say in how that service is delivered to them. They ought to be able to express a preference for the type of meter they want and how their information is shared.
    Originally posted by EachPenny
    Don't know much about the other parts you mentioned but I can talk about this.

    You can have it if you are prepared to pay for it.

    As it stands a prepay customer is a loss if they have to call thier supplier once in a year. Obviously prepay are more likely to.

    A non prepay customer only has to ring twice before the supplier makes a loss.

    This does not even take into account what happens on the call. It could be worse for the supplier.

    There is no supplier that really wants to be in the domestic market. It would be better off being re-nationalised. (beyond the subsequent job losses etc)
    Last edited by Carrot007; 04-12-2017 at 2:01 AM.
    • House Martin
    • By House Martin 4th Dec 17, 12:22 PM
    • 717 Posts
    • 620 Thanks
    House Martin
    Don't know much about the other parts you mentioned but I can talk about this.

    You can have it if you are prepared to pay for it.

    As it stands a prepay customer is a loss if they have to call thier supplier once in a year. Obviously prepay are more likely to.

    A non prepay customer only has to ring twice before the supplier makes a loss.

    This does not even take into account what happens on the call. It could be worse for the supplier.

    There is no supplier that really wants to be in the domestic market. It would be better off being re-nationalised. (beyond the subsequent job losses etc)
    Originally posted by Carrot007
    all prepayment meters have been subsidised down in price from the true cost of running them. Politicians got onto this one approx 10 years ago when prepay rates were much higher than even standard/variable.
    Recently they have even been notched down another peg to be slightly under SV rates.
    Dumb prepay meters are the devils invention.We as meter readers are constantly being sent out, at great expense to try and deal with meter problems many of which are self inflicted criminal damage on the outdated old meters as customers try tricks to defeat the key and cards Smart prepay will improve the situation a lot , at least it will do away with the key and cards. Just as we all pay for the smart meter install roll out we all pay the huge extra costs involved in the commercial losses associated with the UKs obsession with prepay meters, something that is rare in Europe and USA I believe
    .http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-25718447.
    This is a link to a newspaper story back in 2014 which involved a gas explosion with a prepay meter, in Dundas Road Sheffield where I have worked a few times .Check the paragraph which details British Gas Revenue protection officers who went into 20 properties in the street, with a police escort and found 7 out of the 20 checked to be fiddling meters.This is a level which surprised the hard bitten RPU men in the extent of the criminality. Just multiply that out to the rest of the UKs downmarket terraced regions (except York ! ) and anyone can see how much energy is leaching away , unpaid for throughout the UK and prepayment meters are fiddled 9 out of 10 compared to credit meters
    Everyone certainly is nt a "good girl or boy " when it comes to fiddling meters ot TV licences
    Last edited by House Martin; 04-12-2017 at 12:33 PM.
    • thorganby
    • By thorganby 4th Dec 17, 12:40 PM
    • 25 Posts
    • 20 Thanks
    thorganby
    Nice to know a couple of people are my "followers " (or more like stalkers ) I can t reciprocate I m afraid
    You both missed my "double standards "post earlier on the same subject .
    i do have a hatred of the American Liberty Secure meters which give too much information.Typical Yanks !
    It might be acceptable for the odd weirdo s who are techno geeks, but for normal people, we just want the 5 digit number reading displayed (in kwhs for the electric meter and cub3 for gas ) on the first screen,clearly and not have to scrabble about pressing buttons of a tiny keyboard (9 ) which sets the meter scrolling madly round displaying lots of other info which is nt needed by a European just to see what the reading is whilst under the stairs with a torch.
    .Don t forget old Ken and Marge are not too good at bending down nowadays. Eon are not concerned about the end user but they save a few quid on the cost of the meter
    I ve seen thousands of these meters in use and never heard a good word said about them.
    I challenge the head of meter asset boss at Eon to come around with me on my rounds and listen to what the UK think about Liberty Secure rubbish meters.
    I can see why the cheapjack suppliers buy them like Ovo, Utilita First Utility etc , because they are £20 cheaper than Landis Gyr meters but not one of the big six like Eon. shocking decision !
    I will be switching from Eon in 11 months time anyway so I wont have to refuse them and their dreadful meters
    Originally posted by House Martin
    Unfortunately some MSE readers may believe this incorrect information that you regularly post.

    Secure meters are NOT Yank rubbish as you like to post, in fact they originated in India over three decades ago and operate very successfully in many countries around the world EXCEPT America:

    Africa
    Australia
    Europe
    India
    Middle East
    South Asia
    South East Asia
    United Kingdom

    Horstmann is another of the companies brands that you should have heard of.

    In 2013 the Secure Liberty gas and electric meters were the only SMETS1 compliant system available in the UK but don't let facts get in the way of a good rant.

    Readers may actually have some respect for your posts if they contained accurate verifiable information rather than your insults, wild assumptions and strange opinions.
    • teddysmum
    • By teddysmum 4th Dec 17, 1:02 PM
    • 8,606 Posts
    • 5,093 Thanks
    teddysmum
    I am assuming a crossover of mail, because after refusing and having my account tagged as a refusal, today I got my appointment to do both meters.


    The appointment (fitting only done if you call or email to accept or change the date-so please hurry up or you'll miss out)for 22nd December between 8amand 12pm(is the latter noon or midnight as 12pm doesn't exist?)


    This after the CS person said ours wouldn't be done until February when some will get new style meters, so they were certain to be trying to fob us off with an obsolete model.


    I won't be responding so hard luck if they turn up as they won't be allowed,though ,on second thoughts I' best contact them because the electric meter is accessible outside.


    Also they will switch off each service for at least half an hour (in cold weather) and someone has to be home, even if the meters are outside, so they can show you how to use the setup and save money (the latter is easy: use less fuel)


    So that's the burglar alarm going off, all clocks on heating, cooker etc resetting and the aquarium filter playing up; even more reasons not to want useless meters.


    PS Just rang to make sure no one will come out as you can't trust the fact that confirmation is required. The lady confirmed that without agreement no one will come out, but added that my refusal wasn't on the main system yet and that it would be an old style meter, seeming to agree by laughing when I commented that fitting one would be a waste of time.
    Last edited by teddysmum; 04-12-2017 at 1:16 PM.
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