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  • FIRST POST
    • pinklady21
    • By pinklady21 1st Dec 17, 3:21 PM
    • 297Posts
    • 168Thanks
    pinklady21
    Vendor messing us about
    • #1
    • 1st Dec 17, 3:21 PM
    Vendor messing us about 1st Dec 17 at 3:21 PM
    We have been trying to buy a house for about 5 months. We viewed and offered within about a week of it coming onto the market. While there had been other viewings, all had walked away when they saw the state of the place and the amount of repairs that needed done.

    It has been a victorian former family home but latterly used as a holiday home for friends and family. It is damp, needs new kitchen and bathroom, has woodworm etc etc. There is land and other buildings with it which are also very dilapidated.
    We offered the asking price, which was slightly below(about £10k) Home Report value, which the vendor accepted.

    At that point, we had accepted an offer on our house, and were waiting for our buyer to conclude missives (Scotland). Our buyer wanted a date of entry in August, but the vendor refused to give us our preferred entry date - as "they were going on holiday and would not have time to clear the place."
    There have also been other issues where the vendor has been downright intransigent.

    Anyway - the Home Report recommended specialist reports for dampness, and if the cost of remedy exceeded his ballpark estimate of £10k, to advise the surveyor as he would then look again at the value.
    The repairs cost estimates came back at £30k. Our offer had been subject to carrying out checks and surveys on the property.

    We went back to the vendor, showed them the reports, and as we had not known these costs at the time of making our offer, then asked if they would consider a small reduction of £10k in the offer price. So, while less than the original asking price, it was still within £10k of the H/R value same as our original offer.

    This offer was refused. So, reluctantly, we decided we would suck it up and to proceed on the basis of our original offer.

    At this point, our buyer pulled out. We then had to apply for a mortgage to buy the new property, rather than use the proceeds of that sale. However our mortgage was agreed in principle, the lender just needs an updated valuation.

    The vendor decided to put the house back on the market, even though we advised we were going to raise a small mortgage to enable us to proceed.

    At this point, in Scotland the usual practice is for the vendor to request a Home Report refresh if required. Usually costs about £150 plus VAT. We have advised them on 3 occasions now that we need this report for our lender and cannot proceed without it.

    Not only is the vendor refusing to arrange this, they have now said via their solicitor (who sounds fairly fed up dealing with them) that they were instructed to formally withdraw from our offer to them, as they have another buyer interested and want to go with them instead.

    Thing is - it is still on the market, not showing up on agents website as Under Offer - as it was when our offer was accepted.

    I am spitting mad with them. We have conducted negotiations in good faith, and feel that we have been messed about at every stage, incurring costs in the process.

    It seems we can:
    1. Try and persuade them to sell to us as they accepted our offer ages ago
    2. Walk away and chalk it up to experience
    3. Sit it out a bit longer and see if this purported "sale to someone else" materialises
    3. Anything else?

    Sounds to me like we have a really awkward individual here, who has inherited the property, doesn't want it, but doesn't seem to want any one else to have it either!!!

    Anyone been here before and able to offer sage advice?
    Thank you!
Page 1
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 1st Dec 17, 3:27 PM
    • 1,315 Posts
    • 1,066 Thanks
    Comms69
    • #2
    • 1st Dec 17, 3:27 PM
    • #2
    • 1st Dec 17, 3:27 PM
    Maybe he just doesn't want to sell to you?...
    • agrinnall
    • By agrinnall 1st Dec 17, 3:32 PM
    • 18,761 Posts
    • 14,469 Thanks
    agrinnall
    • #3
    • 1st Dec 17, 3:32 PM
    • #3
    • 1st Dec 17, 3:32 PM

    At this point, in Scotland the usual practice is for the vendor to request a Home Report refresh if required. Usually costs about £150 plus VAT. We have advised them on 3 occasions now that we need this report for our lender and cannot proceed without it.
    Originally posted by pinklady21
    While it is indeed usual practice, and I did it when selling my own house, there is nothing in the legislation requiring it (I looked it up at the time) so if your vendor refuses but your lender requires an update then if you want to go ahead you'll need to pay for it yourself.
    • pinklady21
    • By pinklady21 1st Dec 17, 3:36 PM
    • 297 Posts
    • 168 Thanks
    pinklady21
    • #4
    • 1st Dec 17, 3:36 PM
    • #4
    • 1st Dec 17, 3:36 PM
    Paying for our own report is an option, but not one they have offered us - as I think their solicitor would advise them that usual practice is for the vendor to pay for it.
    We have already paid for various survey reports on the property, and while I might be prepared to suck this one up as well...... I am worried the vendor will still pull the rug out from under us.

    I am not sure that it truly is the sticking point here - there has been a lack of candour from them throughout, which sticks in my craw a bit. Maybe they don't want to sell it to us and would rather cut off their nose to spite their face!
    • googler
    • By googler 1st Dec 17, 3:38 PM
    • 14,472 Posts
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    googler
    • #5
    • 1st Dec 17, 3:38 PM
    • #5
    • 1st Dec 17, 3:38 PM
    Not only is the vendor refusing to arrange this, they have now said via their solicitor (who sounds fairly fed up dealing with them) that they were instructed to formally withdraw from our offer to them, as they have another buyer interested and want to go with them instead.
    Originally posted by pinklady21
    Do you mean the solicitors have had to withdraw from acting for the seller, as they would have to do if the seller insisted on accepting the other offer?
    • pinklady21
    • By pinklady21 1st Dec 17, 3:41 PM
    • 297 Posts
    • 168 Thanks
    pinklady21
    • #6
    • 1st Dec 17, 3:41 PM
    • #6
    • 1st Dec 17, 3:41 PM
    This is what my solicitors received from their solicitors:

    .... our instructions are to formally withdraw from any negotiations with your client........

    Do you think this is because they really DO have another offer?
    Even though EA listing does not reflect this?

    Anything else we can do to try and salvage it - we are down to the tune of nearly £1000 with fees and costs on this one.
    • googler
    • By googler 1st Dec 17, 4:34 PM
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    googler
    • #7
    • 1st Dec 17, 4:34 PM
    • #7
    • 1st Dec 17, 4:34 PM
    .... our instructions are to formally withdraw from any negotiations with your client........
    Originally posted by pinklady21
    The seller has instructed his solicitors not to deal with you. At all.

    He/she doesn't want to sell it to you in particular, is what it looks like to me....

    What does your solicitor suggest? You're paying him/her, after all, not us....
    • sheramber
    • By sheramber 1st Dec 17, 5:07 PM
    • 3,998 Posts
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    sheramber
    • #8
    • 1st Dec 17, 5:07 PM
    • #8
    • 1st Dec 17, 5:07 PM
    There is no legal requirement for a refresh of the Home Report

    https://scotland.shelter.org.uk/get_advice/advice_topics/finding_a_place_to_live/moving_home/selling_your_home/home_reports_if_youre_selling_a_property

    How long does a home report last?

    The documents in the home report must be no more than 12 weeks old when you put your property on the market.

    Once your home is on the market, there is no official 'expiry date' for the home report. However, if your home is for sale for a very long time, you may consider getting a 'refresh' survey report.

    If a potential buyer requests a refresh survey, it will be up to the buyer and the seller to both agree who pays for it to be carried out. The charge, if any, for refreshing the survey will be determined by the surveyor or home report provider as part of their service. Some surveyors may agree to update the survey report for free if the house has been for a sale for a long time. However, there are no guarantees that this will happen and you should speak to your solicitor or surveyor to find out more.

    You can take your house off the market for up to four weeks and then put it up for sale again without having to get a new report done.
    • JoJo1978
    • By JoJo1978 1st Dec 17, 5:20 PM
    • 180 Posts
    • 175 Thanks
    JoJo1978
    • #9
    • 1st Dec 17, 5:20 PM
    • #9
    • 1st Dec 17, 5:20 PM
    I don't think this house is for sale to you any more. Sorry but sounds like it's time to cut your losses and find somewhere else.
    Hamster in the wheel (London) 1999-2017
    Mortgage free since 2015; Pension pot sorted 2017
    Second career (what TBD!) 2018
    • pinklady21
    • By pinklady21 1st Dec 17, 6:28 PM
    • 297 Posts
    • 168 Thanks
    pinklady21
    Thanks for the replies -
    I am awaiting a response from our solicitors on what to do next.

    The issue with the Home Report is that lenders will usually only accept the information on value if it is up to 12 weeks old. After that, you need to get a new valuation done that will be acceptable to them.

    I suspect the vendor is being as intransigent as they have been throughout..... they even tried to deny there was any dampness in the property, despite their own surveyor drawing attention to it, and two surveys from us from different building firms. A lot of it is down to dodgy "repairs" that were supposed to have been done a few years back which have simply made the problem worse.

    I wouldn't mind quite so much, but where it is located, properties typically sit on the market for months, and rarely sell for anything near H/R value.
    The vendor was doing really well at getting any offer within £10k of valuation.

    The EA has been odd as well - said categorically that the H/R refresh would be done and "surveyor was booked" - and when we asked where the report was, said that there must have been a misunderstanding......

    House trading would be so much simpler and less of a stress if people would just be honest!
    • googler
    • By googler 1st Dec 17, 7:10 PM
    • 14,472 Posts
    • 9,347 Thanks
    googler
    There is no legal requirement for a refresh of the Home Report
    Originally posted by sheramber
    Legal reqt or not, if the buyer's lender won't finance the purchase without the refresh, then the refresh must be done for the sale to proceed.

    In practice, the seller (who paid for the original) will pay for the refresh, if only to keep their sale on the rails, even though there's no explicit obligation in legislation for them to do so.
    • googler
    • By googler 1st Dec 17, 7:12 PM
    • 14,472 Posts
    • 9,347 Thanks
    googler
    Thanks for the replies -
    I am awaiting a response from our solicitors on what to do next.
    Originally posted by pinklady21
    Keep us posted, but I'm afraid my suggestion is that you move on and find somewhere else to buy. The seller's solicitors have been explicitly instructed not to deal with you, so any further comms are likely to be ignored or refuted.
    • Lucky Duck
    • By Lucky Duck 1st Dec 17, 8:15 PM
    • 126 Posts
    • 73 Thanks
    Lucky Duck
    Indeed, good money after bad springs to mind
    • deannatrois
    • By deannatrois 1st Dec 17, 8:44 PM
    • 4,916 Posts
    • 6,882 Thanks
    deannatrois
    Whatever the reason, the seller has told their solicitor very clearly that they don't wish to sell to you anymore. At that point you have to move on.

    Obviously for some reason the property appealed to you regardless of its problems.. was it already at a relatively low price because of the damp etc.., and you tried to bargain it lower? I wonder if this is the reason the seller started becoming intransigent.

    A seller who has taken a building's condition into account when giving a price, who is then treated to a buyer who wants to take yet more money off the price may feel like the seller is trying it on. They can feel like this even if the price was not low in the first place, they just feel its what the property is worth. This can start a mistrust. Then you lost your buyer. The seller may have just decided they wanted out.

    Such is life.
    • bobbymotors
    • By bobbymotors 1st Dec 17, 9:43 PM
    • 543 Posts
    • 737 Thanks
    bobbymotors
    number 2 only.

    and don't offer next time on another place until it's a price you are going to stick at and keep your word on. Vendor obviously has the hump with you for trying to get another £10k off.

    Your only chance is to write to or visit the vendor, be very apologetic ask to draw a line under what's happened and say you are more than happy to proceed at the agreed price.
    • steampowered
    • By steampowered 1st Dec 17, 10:36 PM
    • 1,954 Posts
    • 1,825 Thanks
    steampowered
    Requesting a £10k reduction in the price because you found out about £30k of repairs is perfectly reasonable. In fact I would say it is generous.

    I think you have to cut your losses and move on. The solicitor's email to you is crystal clear - the vendor is no longer negotiating with you.

    £1,000 is not an enormous amount of money in the grand scheme of things.

    If the vendor changes his mind, let them get back to you. Chasing them is not going to help.
    • BoGoF
    • By BoGoF 1st Dec 17, 10:53 PM
    • 2,726 Posts
    • 1,964 Thanks
    BoGoF
    Confused as to why you need your solicitor to advise you what to do. As others have said the vendor does not want to sell to you. End of.
    • googler
    • By googler 1st Dec 17, 11:46 PM
    • 14,472 Posts
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    googler
    Confused as to why you need your solicitor to advise you what to do. As others have said the vendor does not want to sell to you. End of.
    Originally posted by BoGoF
    Because the sale/purchase is in Scotland, and after an offer has been accepted, solicitors progress the missives to conclusion
    • cr1mson
    • By cr1mson 2nd Dec 17, 6:38 AM
    • 773 Posts
    • 583 Thanks
    cr1mson
    OK I am hugely confused as normally when you make an offer in Scotland it is for both price and entry date. So surely when you accepted the offer for your own home the entry date would have already been agreed?
    • getmore4less
    • By getmore4less 2nd Dec 17, 7:12 AM
    • 30,821 Posts
    • 18,429 Thanks
    getmore4less
    Seems this all started with the dodgy home report,

    why did that surveyor do a free refresh?
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