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  • FIRST POST
    • AcStar
    • By AcStar 29th Nov 17, 8:53 PM
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    AcStar
    Serious defects missed in Colleys Homebuyers report
    • #1
    • 29th Nov 17, 8:53 PM
    Serious defects missed in Colleys Homebuyers report 29th Nov 17 at 8:53 PM
    I had a survey done by Colley's in 2010 and they negligently did not 'follow the trail' of significant defects caused by dry rot. Had they advised me to get a specialist in, these faults would have been spotted and I would never have purchased the property. To rectify this 95% of the property was demolished and costs of bridge loan, issues with professionals and a high valuation have resulted in complete loss of l capital invested. An independent expert has valued the overpayment for the house such that I literally only paid for the land. A court case is about to start after prolonged issues to reach this stage.
    Has anyone else experienced negligence in terms of the survey from Colleys. Where they have missed a defect. I am not referring to a Colley's valuation. It would be really helpful to know if I am a voice in the dark in this nightmare.

    Many thanks
    Last edited by AcStar; 29-11-2017 at 8:58 PM. Reason: to clarify points
Page 1
    • knightstyle
    • By knightstyle 29th Nov 17, 10:04 PM
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    knightstyle
    • #2
    • 29th Nov 17, 10:04 PM
    • #2
    • 29th Nov 17, 10:04 PM
    First you need to explain what type of survey you had done, what did it cost and what did it say about these problems.
    Are you sure you paid for a full structural survey? Often even these will state that they could not check the timbers for this kind of thing due to access.
    Has anyone with expert knowledge checked the T&Cs carefully before you spend more money taking them to court?

    Not saying you did but many homebuyers just get the basic survey which is more of a valuation than a survey.
    Last edited by knightstyle; 29-11-2017 at 10:08 PM. Reason: add a bit
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 29th Nov 17, 10:47 PM
    • 6,278 Posts
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    davidmcn
    • #3
    • 29th Nov 17, 10:47 PM
    • #3
    • 29th Nov 17, 10:47 PM
    Not quite sure what advice you're looking for - even if nobody else has a similar nightmare story, any professional, no matter how reputable, can c0ck up from time to time. It's why they have insurance.
    • 00ec25
    • By 00ec25 29th Nov 17, 10:53 PM
    • 5,566 Posts
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    00ec25
    • #4
    • 29th Nov 17, 10:53 PM
    • #4
    • 29th Nov 17, 10:53 PM
    A court case is about to start after prolonged issues to reach this stage.
    Originally posted by AcStar
    First you need to explain what type of survey you had done, .
    Originally posted by knightstyle
    since a court case is about to start the last thing OP should be doing is discussing the details relating to the case in public.
    • Thrugelmir
    • By Thrugelmir 29th Nov 17, 10:54 PM
    • 56,236 Posts
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    Thrugelmir
    • #5
    • 29th Nov 17, 10:54 PM
    • #5
    • 29th Nov 17, 10:54 PM
    Has anyone else experienced negligence in terms of the survey from Colleys. Where they have missed a defect. I am not referring to a Colley's valuation. It would be really helpful to know if I am a voice in the dark in this nightmare.

    Originally posted by AcStar
    Colleys didn't miss the "defect". The surveyor appointed to undertake the job appears to have done. As the lack of admission appears to suggest that they consider it worth contesting before calling on their insurance to settle.
    “Opportunities come infrequently. When it rains gold, put out the bucket, not the thimble”
    ― Warren Buffett
    • Cakeguts
    • By Cakeguts 30th Nov 17, 1:03 AM
    • 3,280 Posts
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    Cakeguts
    • #6
    • 30th Nov 17, 1:03 AM
    • #6
    • 30th Nov 17, 1:03 AM
    What sort of survey did you have done? Did you instruct the surveyor or did your mortgage company? It makes a difference because if you didn't instruct the surveyor even if you paid for it then it was a mortgage valuation rather than a survey.

    This is what should have happened. There should have been a survey carried out on the instructions of the mortgage company which would value the property for mortgage purposes and would be for the benefit of the mortgage company even if you paid for it. It is part of the process of getting a mortgage for a particular property.

    After that survey you should have instructed a surveyor yourself to check for defects to the property. Did you do this and is it this survey where the defects were missed? It is important to know if this was a surveyor instructed by your or not.
    • aneary
    • By aneary 30th Nov 17, 8:43 AM
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    aneary
    • #7
    • 30th Nov 17, 8:43 AM
    • #7
    • 30th Nov 17, 8:43 AM
    What sort of survey did you have done? Did you instruct the surveyor or did your mortgage company? It makes a difference because if you didn't instruct the surveyor even if you paid for it then it was a mortgage valuation rather than a survey.

    This is what should have happened. There should have been a survey carried out on the instructions of the mortgage company which would value the property for mortgage purposes and would be for the benefit of the mortgage company even if you paid for it. It is part of the process of getting a mortgage for a particular property.

    After that survey you should have instructed a surveyor yourself to check for defects to the property. Did you do this and is it this survey where the defects were missed? It is important to know if this was a surveyor instructed by your or not.
    Originally posted by Cakeguts
    When you apply for a mortgage and get a survey completed you have three options.
    1. mortgage valuation
    2. homebuyers report
    3. structual survey
    So even if the mortgage company carried it out if you picked options 2 or 3 it isn't just a mortgage valuation.
    • AcStar
    • By AcStar 30th Nov 17, 6:02 PM
    • 12 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    AcStar
    • #8
    • 30th Nov 17, 6:02 PM
    • #8
    • 30th Nov 17, 6:02 PM
    Thanks for so much feedback and I agree I need to be discrete - however that's probably why no one else has published details of issues similar to mine. That is why I used the forum to ask this question as I saw many posts regarding quality of valuations, a court action which was awarded against them and then overturned. This was why I was wondering if there were a lot of others with quality of survey and advice issues.
    At the end of the day if we are supposed to make our own enquiries about a property and get let down - surveyors need to take responsibility for their mistakes and the impact it has on the person affected. If a particular firm is continuously letting people down then the public need to be protected or the law changed.

    Just so you know:
    I thought I had paid for a full structural survey (over £1200) but it was the Home buyers report. The issues I have are not impacted by this. However the problem was regarding advice given/not given and missed interpretation of obvious signs of a potential problem obvious to others on superficial inspection. No mortgage involved but had used them for a valuation for mortgage on another property. The sole reason was to establish if any defects existed with the house and if it was ok to purchase it.

    Call this a poll if you will.
    • moneyistooshorttomention
    • By moneyistooshorttomention 30th Nov 17, 6:17 PM
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    moneyistooshorttomention
    • #9
    • 30th Nov 17, 6:17 PM
    • #9
    • 30th Nov 17, 6:17 PM
    I'm wondering if you have the legal insurance add-on to your house and contents insurance cover?

    If so - have you rung them/explained the problem/explained the timescale of date you bought the house and date you realised what this surveyor had(nt) done?

    I'm wondering if there is a chance your insurers might cover the cost of a legal claim against this surveyor.
    New Year's Resolution already made -

    Don't get mad....get firm ...
    • AcStar
    • By AcStar 30th Nov 17, 6:20 PM
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    • 7 Thanks
    AcStar
    Thanks - already in hand - though this has its issues too.
    • Thrugelmir
    • By Thrugelmir 30th Nov 17, 6:23 PM
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    Thrugelmir
    The sole reason was to establish if any defects existed with the house and if it was ok to purchase it.
    Originally posted by AcStar
    That's a very high expectation. Possibly unreasonable given particular circumstances. Given that surveyors will not:

    The surveyor inspects the inside and outside of the main building and all permanent outbuildings, but does not force or open up the fabric. This means that the surveyor does not take up carpets, floor coverings or floorboards, move furniture, remove the contents of cupboards, roof spaces, etc., remove secured panels and/or hatches or undo electrical fittings.
    What's the potential for vendor concealment if they were aware of the issues?
    “Opportunities come infrequently. When it rains gold, put out the bucket, not the thimble”
    ― Warren Buffett
    • AcStar
    • By AcStar 30th Nov 17, 6:24 PM
    • 12 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    AcStar
    When this is the only route to verify the purchase of the most expensive asset anyone would likely to have then there has to be a simpler/fairer route of redress when things go wrong.

    There is always the possible issue of vendor concealment and it would be obvious if fresh paintwork exists, new carpets, blocked access (on purpose) and so on. Surely the surveyor should be particularly on guard if he/she sees this and built into surveyor training for this very reason?
    Last edited by AcStar; 30-11-2017 at 6:30 PM.
    • ACG
    • By ACG 30th Nov 17, 6:35 PM
    • 15,904 Posts
    • 8,148 Thanks
    ACG
    There is always the possible issue of vendor concealment and it would be obvious if fresh paintwork exists, new carpets, blocked access (on purpose) and so on. Surely the surveyor should be particularly on guard if he/she sees this and built into surveyor training for this very reason?
    Originally posted by AcStar
    People doing up their house to sell is quite common.
    I am a Mortgage Adviser
    You should note that this site doesn't check my status as a mortgage adviser, so you need to take my word for it. This signature is here as I follow MSE's Mortgage Adviser Code of Conduct. Any posts on here are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as financial advice.
    • AcStar
    • By AcStar 30th Nov 17, 6:42 PM
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    AcStar
    Hi of course people want to make their houses look lovely prior to sale.

    However when there is a malicious cover up - not saying that happened to me - there should be redress. Saw an article published in the Telegraph on-line on this very issue recently. So this is a current 'up for discussion issue' as vendors need to be liable for misrepresentation. If something is not good for purpose or unsafe it can be returned. In certain USA states the sale of a property can be reversed.
    • Thrugelmir
    • By Thrugelmir 30th Nov 17, 6:48 PM
    • 56,236 Posts
    • 49,610 Thanks
    Thrugelmir
    There is always the possible issue of vendor concealment and it would be obvious if fresh paintwork exists, new carpets, blocked access (on purpose) and so on. Surely the surveyor should be particularly on guard if he/she sees this and built into surveyor training for this very reason?
    Originally posted by AcStar
    The terms and conditions under which a survey is conducted are very clearly set out. Subjective reasoning is not included. Buyer beware.
    “Opportunities come infrequently. When it rains gold, put out the bucket, not the thimble”
    ― Warren Buffett
    • AcStar
    • By AcStar 30th Nov 17, 6:54 PM
    • 12 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    AcStar
    Point taken and why I am going to make it a mission to get this changed as we are in the hands of individuals who should be made responsible for cover ups, mistakes and so on. In my case the course of events from my situation have had a severe life-changing impact on myself and my family.
    I am sure I am not alone with this?
    Last edited by AcStar; 30-11-2017 at 6:58 PM.
    • moneyistooshorttomention
    • By moneyistooshorttomention 30th Nov 17, 8:09 PM
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    moneyistooshorttomention
    Hi of course people want to make their houses look lovely prior to sale.

    However when there is a malicious cover up - not saying that happened to me - there should be redress. Saw an article published in the Telegraph on-line on this very issue recently. So this is a current 'up for discussion issue' as vendors need to be liable for misrepresentation. If something is not good for purpose or unsafe it can be returned. In certain USA states the sale of a property can be reversed.
    Originally posted by AcStar
    I guess you're going the "misrepresentation" route then? As I understand that one can take the "vendor deliberately misled me" route and, at the worst, force them to buy their house back again off you. Don't know whether anyone has succeeded in that yet?
    New Year's Resolution already made -

    Don't get mad....get firm ...
    • moneyistooshorttomention
    • By moneyistooshorttomention 30th Nov 17, 8:14 PM
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    moneyistooshorttomention
    Point taken and why I am going to make it a mission to get this changed as we are in the hands of individuals who should be made responsible for cover ups, mistakes and so on. In my case the course of events from my situation have had a severe life-changing impact on myself and my family.
    I am sure I am not alone with this?
    Originally posted by AcStar
    Well there's another thread on here right now by a buyer that didnt get told there was Japanese Knotweed in the garden by their surveyor (Mid-level survey).

    I have two friends that moved here at same time as me - and their surveyor didnt tell them there was JK in the garden.

    My surveyor (Homebuyer Survey) didnt so much as hint that I should get the house completely rewired.

    There's loads of us on the receiving end of surveyors not doing their jobs properly and then trying to protect their own backs.

    Quite frankly - there is a market for a (good) surveyor to write a "How to be your own surveyor" reference book and we could all just buy that and do our own surveys instead/or as well as any "official" one we had done. I would have loved to have a book like that - but couldnt find one

    I dont really know what they honestly think we are all paying them good money for....

    Good luck.

    EDIT; I've just googled - yet again - for that home survey book I tried in vain to find when I came to buy this house. ....and I found a reference to "Readers Digest Home Survey Manual". Quick visit to Amazon.co.uk later and I didnt bother to study it in great detail at that price - about £3 later I've bought a copy and it will be on its way to me shortly. Sighs. I would have been quite prepared to pay £30/£40 for a bang up-to-date technical "how to be your own surveyor" manual at the time I bought this house - and then sat and had a couple of stiff drinks to help me work my way through understanding the technical language I would have expected it to be in.
    Last edited by moneyistooshorttomention; 30-11-2017 at 8:22 PM.
    New Year's Resolution already made -

    Don't get mad....get firm ...
    • teneighty
    • By teneighty 30th Nov 17, 8:52 PM
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    teneighty
    In response to Money's post, there are good surveyors out there but they don't do Homebuyers Reports for £450.

    Pay peanuts and you get monkeys. Simple.

    The profession has been massively "dumbed down" as the big financial institutions have muscled in and taken over with the large national chains. Working on the basis of churning out as many surveys/valuations as possible with the resultant collapse in professional standards and customer service.
    • moneyistooshorttomention
    • By moneyistooshorttomention 30th Nov 17, 10:07 PM
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    moneyistooshorttomention
    I thought that was around about the "going rate" for Homebuyers surveys (ie the mid-level ones)?? Dont know about OP - but mine certainly wasnt a "big national chain"....

    Just got vague figures in my mind of:
    - bottom level basic (ie the drive-by type stuff) - around £100??????
    - Homebuyers survey - around £400-£500
    - Top-level survey - couldnt say - but I'd guess at around £1,000?

    The price of mid-level survey (as I understood it to be) sounded fairly reasonable at, say, 2 hours (dont know for sure) visiting property concerned and then 1-2 hours writing it up. So, say, £100 per hour. Now that's me taking a very very rough guesstimate of how long I think that would take them? Which represents a pretty decent hourly rate (which many of us would love to be paid) from where I'm standing.

    Just struck me that, personally, I paid mine more than my "solicitor that turned out to be a legal executive"
    New Year's Resolution already made -

    Don't get mad....get firm ...
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