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  • FIRST POST
    • Jhpt
    • By Jhpt 29th Nov 17, 4:42 PM
    • 62Posts
    • 20Thanks
    Jhpt
    Awful repair job by Landlord's Contractors
    • #1
    • 29th Nov 17, 4:42 PM
    Awful repair job by Landlord's Contractors 29th Nov 17 at 4:42 PM
    Hello everybody,

    I live in a rented property, and we unfortunately required the boiler to be changed. Our landlord was fantastic, organised for a Combi unit to be installed . This is where it goes Pete Tong.

    I was woken at 8am (I was working nights at this point) with a frantic call from the estate agent shouting down the phone the contractors were on the way and we MUST let them in (otherwise the Landlord would be charged for their time) - being pretty normal, despite not getting 24 hours notice, we of course let them in. At this point we had been told it was less than a days job and we'd have hot water/heating by that night. Low and behold.. we had no hot water/heating, until the next night. Showering etc impossible and as this happened in early November pretty cold!

    Secondly, the contractors were terrible - they left the place in an absolute state, dust and mess and walls/carpets marked every single room, they replace a boxed in unit with a Combi shoved in a corner (not boxed in), they'd used 3 towels to clean up a leak and left soaking, they'd used our hoover to vacuum up water. I even had the tenant in the flat beneath me come up to complain there was water pouring through her ceiling - thankfully the Chuckle Brothers were still on site to rectify this mistake.

    After they left, we realised we STILL had no heating, water OK. Without knowing the technical ins/outs they'd forgotten to activate/ switch on the boiler. We had another contractor out for this (paid for by estate agent). Since the install we've had the other contractors out 3x - to "activate the boiler", to re-pressurise it and then to show me how to re-pressurise it, as well as being told we now needed to get new radiators throughout as they can't handle the Combi pressure.

    Long story short, I feel that we (as tenant's) should not be obliged to pay a full months rent, seeing as in one calender month we have been without heating/hot water a total of 5 nights, huge amounts of time cleaning the flat, have had 3 bath towels ruined, have had our hoover used (without permission) to vacuum up water and have had to go and purchase new inner lining, and have had a load of distress and disruption a) due to less than 24 hours notice of the install and b) quater-backing "operation recovery" ... Do we have legal rights here? We've asked the Landlord (via EA) for a 25% off considering the above factors.

    Thank you!
Page 1
    • theartfullodger
    • By theartfullodger 29th Nov 17, 5:09 PM
    • 9,101 Posts
    • 12,067 Thanks
    theartfullodger
    • #2
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:09 PM
    • #2
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:09 PM
    You write (yes, WRITE) to landlord (yes, landlord), copy agent, keep a copy, listing the issues as outlined in Shelter's website on reporting repairs with private landlord.
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 29th Nov 17, 5:12 PM
    • 1,227 Posts
    • 1,009 Thanks
    Comms69
    • #3
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:12 PM
    • #3
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:12 PM
    Invoice for any damages and leave it at that.


    I regularly re-pressurise the boiler, it takes 30 seconds.
    • glentoran99
    • By glentoran99 29th Nov 17, 5:22 PM
    • 4,906 Posts
    • 3,910 Thanks
    glentoran99
    • #4
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:22 PM
    • #4
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:22 PM
    Invoice for any damages and leave it at that.


    I regularly re-pressurise the boiler, it takes 30 seconds.
    Originally posted by Comms69


    then you have a leak somewhere
    • Jhpt
    • By Jhpt 29th Nov 17, 5:29 PM
    • 62 Posts
    • 20 Thanks
    Jhpt
    • #5
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:29 PM
    • #5
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:29 PM
    Invoice for any damages and leave it at that.
    I regularly re-pressurise the boiler, it takes 30 seconds.
    Originally posted by Comms69
    Yeah re-pressurising isn't a problem at all - but 3 call outs for another contractor in the 2 weeks following a job means it hasn't been done well at all! Would you not argue that paying full whack rent when 5 days the flat was borderline un-liveable in isn't quite right?

    You write (yes, WRITE) to landlord (yes, landlord), copy agent, keep a copy, listing the issues as outlined in Shelter's website on reporting repairs with private landlord.
    Originally posted by theartfullodger
    Have done - via the agent but it ended up in the same place, although great advice I'm viewing Shelter's website now! Cheers
    • Thrugelmir
    • By Thrugelmir 29th Nov 17, 5:38 PM
    • 56,183 Posts
    • 49,566 Thanks
    Thrugelmir
    • #6
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:38 PM
    • #6
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:38 PM
    Seems that the LL needs to take the matter up with the contractors first. The LL cannot be held directly responsible for all their actions.
    “Opportunities come infrequently. When it rains gold, put out the bucket, not the thimble”
    ― Warren Buffett
    • Slithery
    • By Slithery 29th Nov 17, 5:40 PM
    • 355 Posts
    • 507 Thanks
    Slithery
    • #7
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:40 PM
    • #7
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:40 PM
    Would you not argue that paying full whack rent when 5 days the flat was borderline un-liveable in isn't quite right?
    Originally posted by Jhpt
    No. Not at all.

    The lack of a working boiler does not make the property unlivable. Last time I had a boiler issue it took 2 weeks to get it sorted, and I was the owner, not renting.
    • dimbo61
    • By dimbo61 29th Nov 17, 5:41 PM
    • 9,584 Posts
    • 5,179 Thanks
    dimbo61
    • #8
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:41 PM
    • #8
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:41 PM
    Thank God you did not have to pay for the Chuckle brothers as well.
    Cost me £4300 to replace my home boiler last year.
    This new modern boiler should reduce your gas bill over the next few months/years
    • Lokolo
    • By Lokolo 29th Nov 17, 5:44 PM
    • 19,849 Posts
    • 14,918 Thanks
    Lokolo
    • #9
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:44 PM
    • #9
    • 29th Nov 17, 5:44 PM
    You said the hot water was working but not the heating. Was this what was not working for 5 days or was it both hot water and heating not working for 5 days?

    To me, it looks as though you didn't have heating for 5 days, but had hot water throughout.
    • Jhpt
    • By Jhpt 29th Nov 17, 5:47 PM
    • 62 Posts
    • 20 Thanks
    Jhpt
    Seems that the LL needs to take the matter up with the contractors first. The LL cannot be held directly responsible for all their actions.
    Originally posted by Thrugelmir
    Completely agree - I get on with my LL pretty well, haven't blamed her at all and we've both agreed contractors fault. It HAS been a month now so there's been ample time for this to be sorted!

    No. Not at all.
    The lack of a working boiler does not make the property unlivable. Last time I had a boiler issue it took 2 weeks to get it sorted, and I was the owner, not renting.
    Originally posted by Slithery
    Well I'd argue that less than 24 hours notice that you can't wash at home and have no heating isn't great when paying a fortune in rent. I think it's a little different renting/ owning; part of my contract is paying for a liveable environment, your mortgage pays for bricks/mortar...

    Thank God you did not have to pay for the Chuckle brothers as well.
    Cost me £4300 to replace my home boiler last year.
    This new modern boiler should reduce your gas bill over the next few months/years
    Originally posted by dimbo61
    wow.. that's ridiculous!
    • Jhpt
    • By Jhpt 29th Nov 17, 5:48 PM
    • 62 Posts
    • 20 Thanks
    Jhpt
    You said the hot water was working but not the heating. Was this what was not working for 5 days or was it both hot water and heating not working for 5 days?

    To me, it looks as though you didn't have heating for 5 days, but had hot water throughout.
    Originally posted by Lokolo
    We were without hot water for 3 days, without heating for 5
    • swingaloo
    • By swingaloo 29th Nov 17, 5:58 PM
    • 1,744 Posts
    • 3,086 Thanks
    swingaloo
    The problem is that the agents use the cheapest contractors they can find.

    In our last rented property they sent someone to relay flags by the front door as they were a trip hazard. They removed the flags and threw a load of white stones in their place. They also decided to repaint the front door (which I was not expecting them to do) this was at the beginning of December and it was snowing. The paint was still wet at night but we had to close the door in order to go to bed so of course it was stuck the following morning.

    On another occasion we had a leak and water was coming down the wall in the hall from the bathroom above. The contractor said that he wasn't sure whether or not he had found the leak so just to be sure he drew a pencil mark round the water stain so we could 'see if it went any further'.

    Oh the joys of renting.
    • Jhpt
    • By Jhpt 29th Nov 17, 6:00 PM
    • 62 Posts
    • 20 Thanks
    Jhpt
    The problem is that the agents use the cheapest contractors they can find.

    In our last rented property they sent someone to relay flags by the front door as they were a trip hazard. They removed the flags and threw a load of white stones in their place. They also decided to repaint the front door (which I was not expecting them to do) this was at the beginning of December and it was snowing. The paint was still wet at night but we had to close the door in order to go to bed so of course it was stuck the following morning.

    On another occasion we had a leak and water was coming down the wall in the hall from the bathroom above. The contractor said that he wasn't sure whether or not he had found the leak so just to be sure he drew a pencil mark round the water stain so we could 'see if it went any further'.

    Oh the joys of renting.
    Originally posted by swingaloo
    Utterly ridiculous.. how these guys do it with a straight face!?

    To clarify - these contractors were chosen BY the landlord - the landlord had insisted to the agent that they would be the ones to go in..
    • Thrugelmir
    • By Thrugelmir 29th Nov 17, 6:32 PM
    • 56,183 Posts
    • 49,566 Thanks
    Thrugelmir
    To clarify - these contractors were chosen BY the landlord - the landlord had insisted to the agent that they would be the ones to go in..
    Originally posted by Jhpt
    When you employ a tradesperson or company you have no idea how well the job will go. As in any walk of life there's the good, the bad and the indifferent.
    “Opportunities come infrequently. When it rains gold, put out the bucket, not the thimble”
    ― Warren Buffett
    • societys child
    • By societys child 29th Nov 17, 7:32 PM
    • 4,891 Posts
    • 5,332 Thanks
    societys child
    You've suffered a little inconvenience, yes they shouldn't have used your towels and vacuum, and things didn't go quite as you wished, but fgs, how much compo do you want?

    If you had a kettle, you weren't without hot water, and I remember hardly using the heating at the beginning of November.

    So, that's perhaps, 3 towels (if actually damaged) and a vac lining (whatever one of them is).
    How much do you want for "allowing them in" at 8am, when did you want them to do it?
    Last edited by societys child; 29-11-2017 at 7:36 PM.

    • saajan_12
    • By saajan_12 29th Nov 17, 9:06 PM
    • 986 Posts
    • 667 Thanks
    saajan_12
    Long story short, I feel that we (as tenant's) should not be obliged to pay a full months rent, - none of these factors make it unlivable so rent is not affected seeing as in one calender month we have been without heating/hot water a total of 5 nights, - reasonable for a boiler replacement. The LL doesn't have to guarantee hot water/heating 24/7 but rather has to provide these and to rectify in a reasonable timeframe when there's an issue. 5 days is reasonable huge amounts of time cleaning the flat, - agree that shouldn't have happened have had 3 bath towels ruined
    - were they ruined or need a wash? you MAY be able to claim the depreciated value of them.. £10?
    , have had our hoover used (without permission) to vacuum up water and have had to go and purchase new inner lining- was this actually damaged due to the hoover not being intended for water?
    No liability on the LL/contractors if it was because it was a poor quality lining or it didn't absolutely need replacing, just a bit dirty.
    , and have had a load of distress and disruption a) due to less than 24 hours notice of the install and b) quater-backing "operation recovery" - no distress/disruption, those are the normal impacts of a repair which the LL did. They have to do repairs, not guarantee you a perfect house. You could have refused the visit due to the lack of notice. ... Do we have legal rights here? We've asked the Landlord (via EA) for a 25% off considering the above factors.

    Thank you!
    Originally posted by Jhpt


    Completely agree - I get on with my LL pretty well, haven't blamed her at all and we've both agreed contractors fault. It HAS been a month now so there's been ample time for this to be sorted!
    - from a keeping up friendly relationships perspective, fine but legally your only recourse (if any) is from your LL.


    Well I'd argue that less than 24 hours notice that you can't wash at home and have no heating isn't great when paying a fortune in rent. - you chose to let them in, if the repair wasn't an emergency, you could have refused to have them give the proper notice. Nothing to recover now. I think it's a little different renting/ owning; part of my contract is paying for a liveable environment, your mortgage pays for bricks/mortar...
    - the mortgage is irrelevant. Your rent pays for accomodation to the same standard as an owner occupier. So you should be subject to reasonable repair timings as if you were an owner occupier. 5 days without heating/hot water for a boiler replacement is reasonable and doesn't make it unlivable.

    wow.. that's ridiculous!
    Originally posted by Jhpt
    The rent is irrelevant as the house was not uninhabitable and the LL fulfilled their repair obligations within a very reasonable timeframe. Your loss is at most the depreciated value of the vacuum inner lining and towels, if these were actually damaged beyond cleaning.
    • deannatrois
    • By deannatrois 29th Nov 17, 9:55 PM
    • 4,901 Posts
    • 6,866 Thanks
    deannatrois
    After four years of living in a private rental house that was freezing, with a boiler that kept breaking and empty promises from the LL to replace the boiler if x y or z happened (which did), then I lived in a council place with the same problem.., freezing.

    I had asked for a new boiler in council place but given my experience didn't think there was much chance.

    One day an engineer came knocking on the door saying he needed to look at the boiler system because he was replacing it. No notice at all. I could have hugged the poor man.

    Took a few days. Radiators were replaced as well. I didn't give a damn about hot water not working for a few days. The prospect of living in a warm home for the first time for years was all I needed. And it was totally worth the minor inconvenience.

    I cleaned up any mess the engineer made when he moved from one area to another. Dustpan and brush and scrubbing my main weapons. Wasn't a problem. Even managed to strip the wallpaper from behind radiators as they were removed - which had been there for decades.

    Warm home, no more waiting for a repair engineer several times a year, waiting for obsolete parts to arrive., I considered myself lucky. Would never have sought compensation. And yes, my bills went down by £10 a week.
    • mchale
    • By mchale 29th Nov 17, 11:53 PM
    • 1,657 Posts
    • 930 Thanks
    mchale
    We've asked the Landlord (via EA) for a 25% off considering the above factors.

    Thank you!
    Originally posted by Jhpt

    Bear in mind you may well get compensation, but you might also get a section 21.
    ANURADHA KOIRALA ??? go on throw it in google.
    • csgohan4
    • By csgohan4 30th Nov 17, 7:49 AM
    • 4,010 Posts
    • 2,497 Thanks
    csgohan4
    Bear in mind you may well get compensation, but you might also get a section 21.
    Originally posted by mchale


    There is some protection for revenge evictions


    https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/repairs/revenge_eviction_if_you_ask_for_repairs
    "It is prudent when shopping for something important, not to limit yourself to Pound land"
    • FBaby
    • By FBaby 30th Nov 17, 9:06 AM
    • 16,116 Posts
    • 40,006 Thanks
    FBaby
    You need to be take a realistic approach to this. Being a tenant and paying rent doesn't equate to getting first class service. Boiler issues happen to everyone all the time. Yes, it's frustrating, yes, it's annoying, but it is as already said life whether renting or owning.

    As it's been said too, you will be making saving in your bills with a new boiler, so maybe focus on the positive that comes with being a tenant. If it was your own home, you would be much worse off financially, either without a boiler or with a big bill to pay.
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