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  • FIRST POST
    • bery_451
    • By bery_451 9th Nov 17, 3:44 PM
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    bery_451
    Section 75 Protection credit card Enquiry
    • #1
    • 9th Nov 17, 3:44 PM
    Section 75 Protection credit card Enquiry 9th Nov 17 at 3:44 PM
    Hi,

    We having new windows/doors fitted, half the job is done so far however we have a dispute on the windows themselves being smaller causing huge gaps as well as other issues.

    We addressed the issues to the director of the window company and the directors says he now wants 70% of the deposit instead of the original 20% stated on the contract otherwise they wont continue the works.

    If we agree to increase the deposit now to 70% for the sake of completing the job after this wrong size windows dispute then am I still entitled for the section 75 credit card refund for what amount? How does it work?
Page 1
    • zx81
    • By zx81 9th Nov 17, 3:49 PM
    • 14,058 Posts
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    zx81
    • #2
    • 9th Nov 17, 3:49 PM
    • #2
    • 9th Nov 17, 3:49 PM
    If you have paid any amount on a card, then any Section 75 complaint would cover - or not - the entire amount.

    Remember that Section 75 isn't an automatic refund. It gives you the same rights against the card provider as the supplier.
    • StopIt
    • By StopIt 9th Nov 17, 3:51 PM
    • 1,371 Posts
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    StopIt
    • #3
    • 9th Nov 17, 3:51 PM
    • #3
    • 9th Nov 17, 3:51 PM
    Section 75 covers breach of contract, but I'd be claiming the money NOW and getting someone else to sort this out.


    If any of the sum is paid by Credit Card, it protects the purchase.


    I think you'd be a bit mad to agree to give these guys more money, especially outside of a contract to correct their mess up.


    Edit: See here: https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/shopping/section75-protect-your-purchases
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    • bery_451
    • By bery_451 9th Nov 17, 4:14 PM
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    bery_451
    • #4
    • 9th Nov 17, 4:14 PM
    • #4
    • 9th Nov 17, 4:14 PM
    What about paying them more money after dispute for the sake of getting it completed, after this am I still entitled so section 75?

    If i pay the more money by cash am I protected?

    If they breach the contract by asking for money and if we agree to pay them more money am I still entitled to section 75?

    What if they provide a new updated receipt/contract to reflect the more money deposit, can section 75 apply to more than 1 contract with the same company?
    • glentoran99
    • By glentoran99 9th Nov 17, 4:21 PM
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    glentoran99
    • #5
    • 9th Nov 17, 4:21 PM
    • #5
    • 9th Nov 17, 4:21 PM
    What about paying them more money after dispute for the sake of getting it completed, after this am I still entitled so section 75?

    If i pay the more money by cash am I protected?

    If they breach the contract by asking for money and if we agree to pay them more money am I still entitled to section 75?

    What if they provide a new updated receipt/contract to reflect the more money deposit, can section 75 apply to more than 1 contract with the same company?
    Originally posted by bery_451


    post 2 covers it
    • bery_451
    • By bery_451 9th Nov 17, 5:26 PM
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    bery_451
    • #6
    • 9th Nov 17, 5:26 PM
    • #6
    • 9th Nov 17, 5:26 PM
    post 2 covers it
    Originally posted by glentoran99
    If you have paid any amount on a card, then any Section 75 complaint would cover - or not - the entire amount.

    Remember that Section 75 isn't an automatic refund. It gives you the same rights against the card provider as the supplier.


    Ok post 2 above can you please clarify as I dont understand of what constitutes a or not the entire amount?

    does it has to be in 1 amount on card or can be few amounts for the same order?
    • zx81
    • By zx81 9th Nov 17, 5:57 PM
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    zx81
    • #7
    • 9th Nov 17, 5:57 PM
    • #7
    • 9th Nov 17, 5:57 PM
    Section 75 potentially covers you for the full amount that you pay for a product or service, regardless of payment schedule or means of payment, as long as some amount has been paid on a credit card.
    • bery_451
    • By bery_451 9th Nov 17, 6:23 PM
    • 1,032 Posts
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    bery_451
    • #8
    • 9th Nov 17, 6:23 PM
    • #8
    • 9th Nov 17, 6:23 PM
    Section 75 potentially covers you for the full amount that you pay for a product or service, regardless of payment schedule or means of payment, as long as some amount has been paid on a credit card.
    Originally posted by zx81
    Ok if we breach the contract by me paying more towards the deposit after the window size dispute is known between us then am I still entitled to section 75 protection?

    Will the credit card company say after window size dispute why did I pay them more money?
    Last edited by bery_451; 09-11-2017 at 6:28 PM.
    • derps
    • By derps 9th Nov 17, 7:06 PM
    • 98 Posts
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    derps
    • #9
    • 9th Nov 17, 7:06 PM
    • #9
    • 9th Nov 17, 7:06 PM
    Yeah contracts can be renegotiated so if you decide to change the original agreement and pay more, the credit card company could argue that you agreed to the windows as they are.

    I would personally not pay extra for the wrong windows and immediately demand that they fit windows consistent with the original contract for the originally agreed price, failing which you will make a s.75 claim.
    • bery_451
    • By bery_451 9th Nov 17, 7:37 PM
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    bery_451
    Yeah contracts can be renegotiated so if you decide to change the original agreement and pay more, the credit card company could argue that you agreed to the windows as they are.

    I would personally not pay extra for the wrong windows and immediately demand that they fit windows consistent with the original contract for the originally agreed price, failing which you will make a s.75 claim.
    Originally posted by derps
    Ok understood many thanks.
    • bery_451
    • By bery_451 10th Nov 17, 12:55 AM
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    bery_451
    Finally in regards to section 75 claim does the credit card company chase the business to recover funds or credit card company refunds consumer with its own card company money?
    • eco_warrior
    • By eco_warrior 10th Nov 17, 8:58 AM
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    eco_warrior
    The credit card company may pursue the lender depending on the value of the claim, or if they are still trading etc. Quite a few variables.

    Sometimes the cc company will take possession of the goods involved (if there are any) and auction them off to recoup some of their loss. Cars being an obvious example.
    • eco_warrior
    • By eco_warrior 10th Nov 17, 8:59 AM
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    eco_warrior
    Lender = merchant

    Oops
    • bery_451
    • By bery_451 10th Nov 17, 11:40 AM
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    bery_451
    Ok the value of the claim is £10000 and they are still trading as of now.

    So to clarify credit card will refund me out of their own pocket first and rip the windows/doors out of my house to recoup some of their losses? Also how will credit card company enforce merchant to pay them back, is it via legals & courts?

    Circumstances like mine what will likely to happen?

    Cheers,
    • bigadaj
    • By bigadaj 10th Nov 17, 1:06 PM
    • 10,676 Posts
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    bigadaj
    Ok the value of the claim is £10000 and they are still trading as of now.

    So to clarify credit card will refund me out of their own pocket first and rip the windows/doors out of my house to recoup some of their losses? Also how will credit card company enforce merchant to pay them back, is it via legals & courts?

    Circumstances like mine what will likely to happen?

    Cheers,
    Originally posted by bery_451


    No, the credit card has joint and several liability meaning that they are equally liable for putting things right.


    The process may be that a surveyor is appointed to review the work and comment on it's adequacy. The card company will then likely appoint another company to undertake the works and pay for them directly, either carrying on the works started by others if they are acceptable or ripping things out and starting from fresh.


    Raise the issues with your card company and state you want to make a section 75 claim. They then have several options, the first might be for them to make some payment to your current installer to finish the job properly. It could be that you'll need to appoint and pay for a survey, the cost of which will be reimbursed as part of your claim if you're successful.


    If the section 75 claim is successful then the credit card will supply the goods or services for the agreed price, whether they can reclaim that money from the company isn't your concern, maybe they will, maybe they won't.
    • bery_451
    • By bery_451 10th Nov 17, 3:07 PM
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    bery_451
    No, the credit card has joint and several liability meaning that they are equally liable for putting things right.


    The process may be that a surveyor is appointed to review the work and comment on it's adequacy. The card company will then likely appoint another company to undertake the works and pay for them directly, either carrying on the works started by others if they are acceptable or ripping things out and starting from fresh.


    Raise the issues with your card company and state you want to make a section 75 claim. They then have several options, the first might be for them to make some payment to your current installer to finish the job properly. It could be that you'll need to appoint and pay for a survey, the cost of which will be reimbursed as part of your claim if you're successful.


    If the section 75 claim is successful then the credit card will supply the goods or services for the agreed price, whether they can reclaim that money from the company isn't your concern, maybe they will, maybe they won't.
    Originally posted by bigadaj
    Ok so it is not the simple solution of card company refunding me £10000?

    Probably cost the card company more than £10000 if they choose to rectify it themselves instead of refunding me.

    Ripping it out and starting fresh will cause so much inconvenience and hassle to my household again. An option I must take if given?
    • bery_451
    • By bery_451 11th Nov 17, 10:05 PM
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    bery_451
    Hello seeking advice please.
    • derps
    • By derps 12th Nov 17, 11:52 AM
    • 98 Posts
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    derps
    No, Section 75 is not a straight entitlement to a refund, it's about liability for a breach of contract and the card provider's joint liability with the merchant to put it right.

    The best people to speak to about the options will be the credit card provider, with whom you will want to cooperate to discuss the best outcome for both of you. The credit card provider is likely to be guided by an independent expert report regarding the current state of the windows, the contract and the options to rectify the situation going forward so speak to them about a good report from someone reputable such as someone with FENSA and what the provider wants to do.
    • jack_pott
    • By jack_pott 12th Nov 17, 12:54 PM
    • 4,260 Posts
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    jack_pott
    The best people to speak to about the options will be the credit card provider
    Originally posted by derps
    I once rang HSBC with an enquiry about Section 75, not because I wanted to make a claim, but just to enquire whether it applies when only a part payment is made (I didn't know at that time).

    Before I had even got to the question, the bloke in the call centre butted in and said "Your card doesn't offer that facility sir".

    Every time I re-started speaking he just butted in again and again:

    Your card doesn't offer that facility sir Your card doesn't offer that facility sir Your card doesn't offer that facility sir Your card doesn't offer that facility sir Your card doesn't offer that facility sir
    I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.
    Friedrich Nietzsche
    • derps
    • By derps 12th Nov 17, 1:08 PM
    • 98 Posts
    • 79 Thanks
    derps
    Irrelevant anecdote
    Originally posted by jack_pott
    You're right - it will be much more productive to only make non-negotiable demands of the bank after crowdsourcing amateur advice from the internet for the One True Correct Answer instead of opening a two-way dialogue with them
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