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  • FIRST POST
    • Elinore
    • By Elinore 7th Nov 17, 7:15 AM
    • 94Posts
    • 336Thanks
    Elinore
    Hopefully you can help resolve this argument one way or another!
    • #1
    • 7th Nov 17, 7:15 AM
    Hopefully you can help resolve this argument one way or another! 7th Nov 17 at 7:15 AM
    Firstly a little introduction – we normally are two happy like minded adults who tend to have a loving and agreeable relationship, we have been together since we were 17. So this type of discord is very out of the ordinary however we are both stressed currently the Mr. has a sister undergoing cancer treatment and I have some major work and life issues.

    The issue- Our money situation. Last year we finally bought a house after years and years of saving. Immediately a few things went wrong with the house, our cars and the Dog, as these things tend to do (ps the dog is all good now) these costs killed our remaining savings dead. We also have some changes that significantly increased our outgoings, we are also over paying to get a better mortgage rate when we renew as we have a rubbish FTB/low LTV deal.

    We are used to cutting our cloth so we have done so, me on the understanding that the house (think a London style town house with a basement flat – it not quite as its doesn’t have its own front door but its close enough for illustration purposes) the ground floor would be let to a lodger – which was one of the reasons we bought this property. The Mr. has been putting this off for months and months and then last month stated that he had changed his mind and didn’t want a lodger.

    Cue shock.

    He very adamant.

    I am angry and frustrated.

    The ‘flat’ (£600 PCM) could free up some significant pennies to replenish the savings and also we have been living on the edge for ages I am running out, wearing out or not having - everything from work clothes to haircuts. I genuinely feel a mess and get moaned at if I spend a few quid of foundation or hairspray!

    And here is started the argument – I got third job

    Evening job is being paid into my account alone and the Mr. has gone bonkers. He pays his OT (his second job) and oncall, bonuses and awards into the joint and I have taken another job and am keeping the money all for myself.

    My argument is get a lodger and I won’t have to have THREE JOBS to pay the effing bills and not feel like I am not robbing our account to get my flipping haircut, buy shoes because my old ones are falling apart and so on.....

    His argument is that we are doing fine all the bills are being met and as we are in our own home for the first time he is enjoying it just being us (subtext – he likes this routine is not a people person and doesn’t want the hassle even though I will run the whole thing) never mind it was one of the main reasons for buying this style of house!

    Mine is, bully for you your second job is doing a few extra hours home working for your employer – I work my day job, go off and do a evening job and a small weekend cleaning role so I am doing more effing hours than a junior doctor (no offense to Dr's I know your job is harder)

    So the current state of play after a major major row last night..

    He thinks I am being Me,Me,Me and hording money – unfair as every penny of his money is contributed

    I think he’s being unreasonable, reduced the household in effect by £600 so this is my money.
Page 6
    • WibblyGirly
    • By WibblyGirly 19th Nov 17, 5:46 PM
    • 235 Posts
    • 460 Thanks
    WibblyGirly
    Doesn't he understand that your third job is paying for your spending money?! Your using your time to earn it so you can get basic stuff that shouldn't even need a conversation about.
    • NeilCr
    • By NeilCr 19th Nov 17, 6:08 PM
    • 1,098 Posts
    • 1,213 Thanks
    NeilCr
    To be honest it sounds like two people talking at each other rather than to each other

    I agree with Pollycat. This doesn’t sound anything like the relationship you’ve described before. You need to get back to that.
    • CruisingSaver
    • By CruisingSaver 19th Nov 17, 6:20 PM
    • 366 Posts
    • 1,030 Thanks
    CruisingSaver
    If Mr is so intent on overpaying would he compromise to reducing the overpayment so that you both have spending money?

    Life is for living not being miserable whilst you make overpayments you don't need to.
    • krlyr
    • By krlyr 19th Nov 17, 8:49 PM
    • 5,816 Posts
    • 11,995 Thanks
    krlyr
    It’s been a while – oddly, I’ve been busy

    Just thought I would update. Even it’s not a major one as basically it had fallen to a frosty stalemate.

    Mr. still wants to overpay, it was the plan all along (we have had lodgers before with no issue) – feels that we just need to keep on as we are scrimping making all the bills/overpayments meaning lodger is not needed.

    I am still unhappy that we both have to make up £300 each in shortfall and just be getting by the skin of our teeth. So having to justify any outgoing however small.

    So I started the new job to stony silence and a deliberate stance to make things awkward for me. As I get paid weekly and had my first pay - I have already had my hair cut and nails done, bought some clothes off eBay and got some much needed makeup. I felt so much better! (All budget, second hand unused but good makes)

    Then this morning Mr. withdrew exactly the same amount as I spent out of the joint account.

    And that’s where we are.
    Originally posted by Elinore
    I would sit him down and ask him to explain to you why he feels you need to work three jobs to contribute more money to the household (because his withdrawal suggests he views your third wage as household money) vs his two.

    I would also be tempted to ask why he gets to decide what the money is spent on (e.g. overpayments) yet you can't budget for spend on haircuts or new clothes. This is not an equal relationship in terms of finance, and I would want justification on why.

    I'd be tempted to say quit the third job and see what he says when you start using the joint account to pay for essentials like a haircut, but given your latest posts, that third job may be useful if things go that south..
    • esmy
    • By esmy 19th Nov 17, 11:03 PM
    • 865 Posts
    • 2,840 Thanks
    esmy

    Then this morning Mr. withdrew exactly the same amount as I spent out of the joint account.

    And that’s where we are.
    Originally posted by Elinore
    I'm curious to know how he knows what you spent - not what it was spent on as that might be obvious, but the amount. Do all your moneys from all your various jobs go into the joint account??
    Sorry just seen that your third job money goes into your personal account - so how does he know?
    Last edited by esmy; 19-11-2017 at 11:06 PM.
    • Pollycat
    • By Pollycat 20th Nov 17, 9:05 AM
    • 18,538 Posts
    • 47,726 Thanks
    Pollycat
    It’s been a while – oddly, I’ve been busy

    Just thought I would update. Even it’s not a major one as basically it had fallen to a frosty stalemate.

    Mr. still wants to overpay, it was the plan all along (we have had lodgers before with no issue) – feels that we just need to keep on as we are scrimping making all the bills/overpayments meaning lodger is not needed.

    I am still unhappy that we both have to make up £300 each in shortfall and just be getting by the skin of our teeth. So having to justify any outgoing however small.

    So I started the new job to stony silence and a deliberate stance to make things awkward for me. As I get paid weekly and had my first pay - I have already had my hair cut and nails done, bought some clothes off eBay and got some much needed makeup. I felt so much better! (All budget, second hand unused but good makes)

    Then this morning Mr. withdrew exactly the same amount as I spent out of the joint account.

    And that’s where we are.
    Originally posted by Elinore
    I think this is petty in the extreme.

    It sounds like he is deliberately goading you.
    • FBaby
    • By FBaby 20th Nov 17, 10:50 AM
    • 16,111 Posts
    • 39,993 Thanks
    FBaby
    Then this morning Mr. withdrew exactly the same amount as I spent out of the joint account.
    How did he know how much you'd spent? Unless you told him in which case, what was the purpose to do so except to wind him up?

    I think you are both stuck in wanting to prove the other one wrong and not listening to each other.

    Someone's going to make the first move to hold their hands up or you stay stuck where you are until things are so bad, you break up an otherwise healthy marriage.
    • gettingtheresometime
    • By gettingtheresometime 20th Nov 17, 11:22 AM
    • 3,125 Posts
    • 7,287 Thanks
    gettingtheresometime
    How did he know how much you'd spent? Unless you told him in which case, what was the purpose to do so except to wind him up?

    I think you are both stuck in wanting to prove the other one wrong and not listening to each other.

    Someone's going to make the first move to hold their hands up or you stay stuck where you are until things are so bad, you break up an otherwise healthy marriage.
    Originally posted by FBaby


    In fairness to my hubby, he may notice I've had my hair cut but he doesn't ask how much it cost, so it sounds like the husband asked with the sole intention of withdrawing the same amount.


    I'd agree with you that the situation needs defusing and compromise shown by both the OP & her hubby
    Lloyds OD / Natwest OD / PO CC / Wescott / Argos Card cleared thanks to the 1 debt v 100 day challenge


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    • Malthusian
    • By Malthusian 20th Nov 17, 11:43 AM
    • 3,421 Posts
    • 5,237 Thanks
    Malthusian
    That's what happens when two normally levelheaded people mix money and large doses of righteous indignation.
    Originally posted by Elinore
    Every household decision involves money, whether implicitly or explicitly. If you're only levelheaded when there's nothing to disagree on then you're not levelheaded. The measure of levelheadedness is in how you resolve problems and disagreements. This is not how levelheaded adults behave.

    I find it absolutely amazing that anyone would be happy for their spouse to be working three jobs, day, evening and weekend. In any circumstances, let alone where there are two perfectly good alternatives (1. get a lodger 2. stop overpaying the mortgage). Just so he can have a bit of extra space in the house. (I say "he" - you don't benefit from the extra space in the house as you're never in it.)

    This argument is only going to be resolved one way. Firstly, quit one or two of your jobs. Secondly, make it clear to your husband that working three jobs is not an option, because stress, fatigue and bitterness will destroy your marriage. And that between you, you have to decide between stopping the overpayments and taking in a lodger.
    • fairy lights
    • By fairy lights 20th Nov 17, 11:53 AM
    • 8,325 Posts
    • 27,941 Thanks
    fairy lights

    Mr. still wants to overpay, it was the plan all along
    Originally posted by Elinore
    It was also the plan all along that you would get a lodger to help make those overpayments.
    Doesn't he understand that by changing his mind about half of the original plan, the rest of it isn't going to work?
    Either you can have a lodger and overpay, or decide you don't want a lodger after all, and not overpay.
    Trying to make overpayments without having the lodger is quite literally trying to have his cake and eat it.
    • FBaby
    • By FBaby 20th Nov 17, 4:12 PM
    • 16,111 Posts
    • 39,993 Thanks
    FBaby
    I'd agree but it wasn't just a haircut, but also the nails, make-up and clothes on ebay (so not even able to really guess the cost).

    So either he pestered OP to tell him how much she spent and she told him or she told him to make a point.
    • badmemory
    • By badmemory 20th Nov 17, 5:07 PM
    • 1,050 Posts
    • 1,105 Thanks
    badmemory
    I'd agree but it wasn't just a haircut, but also the nails, make-up and clothes on ebay (so not even able to really guess the cost).

    So either he pestered OP to tell him how much she spent and she told him or she told him to make a point.
    Originally posted by FBaby
    Or he has access to all her accounts!
    • karcher
    • By karcher 20th Nov 17, 8:08 PM
    • 1,515 Posts
    • 12,737 Thanks
    karcher
    I think him withdrawing the money from the joint account was petty, insulting and unreasonable.

    OP you only took on the 3rd job so you could pay for your haircut etc yourself so you didn't touch any joint finances. Sorry but he is being an !!!!. He doesn't want a lodger but wants to carry on over paying the mortgage reneging on the original plan whilst pilfering joint money to make up for your extra earnings...

    Somebody/thing has to give here and in your shoes it wouldn't be me.

    Give up the 3rd job..life is too bloody short to work yourself in to the ground just for a little private spending money. Take what you need for the basics from the joint account. If he decides to follow suit then so be it but the over payments will be the sacrifice.

    He seems to be having it all his own way atm...that imbalance needs readjusting. Good luck OP x
    • karcher
    • By karcher 23rd Nov 17, 9:16 PM
    • 1,515 Posts
    • 12,737 Thanks
    karcher
    How's it going OP?

    I'm sure everyone who contributed to and read your thread would like to know how things turn/turned out
    • unholyangel
    • By unholyangel 27th Nov 17, 3:55 AM
    • 11,597 Posts
    • 8,734 Thanks
    unholyangel
    I agree, daft suggestion.

    She should tale ALL her income back, then pay her usual LESS £600 and give up the extra job,
    Originally posted by LeesArt
    I'm sure earlier you recognised the income from a lodger would be split. Which would mean OP paying £300 less, not £600.

    OP, personally I'd start a conversation that you're not willing to overwork to overpay, that they're not willing to have a lodger to give extra income and then suggest you both try to think of other solutions/compromises - only to suggest alternatives initially, going through them later to pro/con them separately then go over what you've both put down. And basically use that process to try and find something that you both might be happy with rather than just trying to push the idea only 1 of you is happy with.

    Speaking as someone who used to work 90+ hours a week (not for the money mind you), I realised that if I'm on my deathbed I won't be wishing I'd earned more money - I'll be wishing I had more time to spend with the people who matter to me.

    We never know what the future holds - how long we have left. Overpay if you can do so comfortably but don't overstretch yourself so that you're not able to enjoy the things that really matter.
    Money doesn't solve poverty.....it creates it.
    • Elinore
    • By Elinore 4th Dec 17, 7:02 AM
    • 94 Posts
    • 336 Thanks
    Elinore
    Update
    An update with a resolution – partly worked out and partly due to external circumstances.

    Almost at exactly the same time the SIL suddenly became very unwell, we were away on free holiday at a friend’s cottage and unbeknownst to me there had been a major scheduling error at work (evening job)

    Firstly the main issue to all this is the cottage. It is in the middle of nowhere. It was fab we had an epic time – the dog loved it and we were so chilled, it was just great. It’s also in the bottom of a valley so has a really poor signal. It was supposed to have a working land line which we had given the number to family/friends – but it turned out it was dead.

    Secondly I was on leave, have an email stating the leave was approved. However the manager who sent the approval didn’t log it and left the role in the meantime. The cover coordinator was livid as for all intents and purposes I just didn’t turn up for a weeks worth of shifts – caused mayhem then was awol and un contactable – she was angry, very very angry that as she believed, at the time, I had just walked out with no notice. Sadly and irrationally she’s not forgiven me for something totally out of my hands and I am currently being ‘punished’ with not being offered hours.

    SIL has become unwell – we feel really bad as during this time they were trying to get hold of us at the cottage and we caused unnecessary stress. There was a big meltdown as the family suddenly realised the reality of her illness. There had been a feeling from them all prior to this that they thought she was ‘not that ill’ and a weird vibe from them that it’ll be a few quick rounds of chemo, a drs appointment or two and ‘Bobs your uncle’ and she would be right as rain for the new year. (Yes, I appreciate this is a defence mechanism and I do understand – it just wasn’t really helpful for her)

    In light of this a family event has been organised – something along the lines of a wish fulfilment evening for her (now she’s feeling better) this has quite a significant outlay for everyone in the family and the Mr. was just going to take it out of the main account. We had a quite frank and sharp discussion about this and I think he suddenly saw my point that if it was something HE thought was important than it was ok to take money out if I thought it was important it really wasn’t in his eyes and could wait. I don’t think he entirely got why i had been so upset but as the outlay is too big to come from the main account we have both agreed to halt overpayments, The interest rate rise in mortgages has worked against us anyway.

    So it kind of fizzled out…….. thankfully.
    • Pollycat
    • By Pollycat 4th Dec 17, 10:05 AM
    • 18,538 Posts
    • 47,726 Thanks
    Pollycat
    Sorry to hear about your SIL.

    I think this is something that has maybe 'fizzled out' for now but will rear its head in the future.

    Are you still overpaying the mortgage?
    Is your OH still refusing to have a lodger?

    I think your manager is out of order in treating you as she is.
    If she wants to be angry at anyone, it should be the person who authorised your leave and didn't record it.
    I would be angry back and would be having a word with the manager at her totally unwarranted treatment.
    Do you have a HR section?
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