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  • FIRST POST
    • Button_Moon
    • By Button_Moon 21st Oct 17, 8:54 AM
    • 55Posts
    • 28Thanks
    Button_Moon
    LPS - Parking Charge Notice - Stratford On Avon
    • #1
    • 21st Oct 17, 8:54 AM
    LPS - Parking Charge Notice - Stratford On Avon 21st Oct 17 at 8:54 AM
    Hi All, hopefully you can help - not sure if this can be appealed or a slam dunk by myself:

    Parking board had usual prices on an a note saying "An evening charge of £2.00 applies between 16:00-08:00 - I waited a few minutes till it got to that time and then paid the £2. when it printed out it said departure time 17:59 - not really thinking i assumed this would be ok as the £2 paid took the parking duration into the "overnight period" anyway but I guess that would be classed as an additional charge to what I paid?

    I don't recall if there was a time display on the ticket machine.

    Returned later to receive the Parking Charge Notice from LPS - invoice was times at 18:51.

    Do I have a chance of an appeal?

    Cheers
Page 3
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 7th Dec 17, 8:23 PM
    • 16,644 Posts
    • 26,008 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    would this read better?

    Parking for Rother Street - Stratford upon Avon is 24 hours. Parking is £1 per hour with exception to an "evening charge" of £2 which applies for 16:00-08:00 hours.

    The parking ticket was purchased just after at 16:00 at the sum of £2 (photo attached) with clear intent for "evening rate". The physical printed ticket time shows a "departure time" of 17:59 hours, this means that the ticket was purchased at 15:59 hours according to the ticket machine.

    There is no proof to show that the machine is calibrated to Greenwich Mean Time (GMT), and machine /LCD display/ printed ticket are of identical values time wise. Proof needs to be shown that on the day and time of the PCN, the machine that processed and printed the ticket was indeed calibrated.
    Originally posted by Button_Moon
    I would say something to the effect that clearly the machine is not in sync with your smartphone (which is accurately calibrated to UK time and which you checked at the time) and was used by you as the measured, accurate time in the day for the basis of purchasing an evening ticket.

    The difference between 17:59 and 18:00 is so minimal, that there are significant questions about the accuracy of the PPCs machine’s time calibration to cause the assessor sufficient doubt, and should find for the appellant on the balance of probability. Or are they going to side with a PPC showing absolutely no inclination to recognise the marginality of the case?
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Button_Moon
    • By Button_Moon 7th Dec 17, 9:00 PM
    • 55 Posts
    • 28 Thanks
    Button_Moon
    Trying not to copy and paste but it is worded well Is it fine to mention 'my' in regards to smart phone etc?

    Parking for Rother Street - Stratford upon Avon is 24 hours. Parking is £1 per hour with exception to an "evening charge" of £2 which applies for 16:00-08:00 hours.

    The parking ticket was purchased just after at 16:00 at the sum of £2 (photo attached) with clear intent for "evening rate". The physical printed ticket time shows a "departure time" of 17:59 hours, this means that the ticket was purchased at 15:59 hours according to the ticket machine.

    Clearly the machine is not in sync with the smartphone (which is accurately calibrated to UK time and which was checked at the time) and was used by as the measured, accurate time in the day for the basis of purchasing an evening ticket. The difference between 17:59 and 18:00 is so minimal, that there are significant questions about the accuracy of the PPCs machine!!!8217;s time calibration.

    There is no proof to show that the machine is calibrated to Greenwich Mean Time (GMT), and machine /LCD display/ printed ticket are of identical values time wise. Proof needs to be shown that on the day and time of the PCN, the machine that processed and printed the ticket was indeed calibrated.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 7th Dec 17, 9:15 PM
    • 16,644 Posts
    • 26,008 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    I!!!8217;d use !!!8216;the Smartphone that was used to check the time before the purchase of the ticket!!!8217;.

    Are you anywhere close by where you might be able to show the time on your phone against the time on the ticket machine via a photograph.

    Unless you were born like an octopus, you might need someone with you to provide enough hands and arms to deal with it!
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Button_Moon
    • By Button_Moon 9th Dec 17, 6:24 AM
    • 55 Posts
    • 28 Thanks
    Button_Moon
    I won't be able to get photos this weekend and the deadline is Monday, so will have to make do with what I have. Are there any other areas to tidy up or include on the letter?
    • Button_Moon
    • By Button_Moon 19th Dec 17, 4:39 PM
    • 55 Posts
    • 28 Thanks
    Button_Moon
    Document submitted last week and at stage 2 'Operator information and evidence'. Does this mean they haven't found enough information to rejected it, or standard for any appeal? Is there a deadline for the information to be received from the operator?
    • Loadsofchildren123
    • By Loadsofchildren123 19th Dec 17, 4:58 PM
    • 1,905 Posts
    • 3,129 Thanks
    Loadsofchildren123
    standard I think - the PPC now gets to respond to your appeal documents
    Although a practising Solicitor, my posts here are NOT legal advice, but are personal opinion based on limited facts provided anonymously by forum users. I accept no liability for the accuracy of any such posts and users are advised that, if they wish to obtain formal legal advice specific to their case, they must seek instruct and pay a solicitor.
    • Button_Moon
    • By Button_Moon 10th Jan 18, 5:23 PM
    • 55 Posts
    • 28 Thanks
    Button_Moon
    DecisionSuccessful

    Assessor Name *** ***

    Assessor summary of operator case

    The operator has failed to provide any evidence in relation to this Parking Charge Notice (PCN).

    Assessor summary of your case

    The appellant states that a compliant Notice to Keeper was never served, the operator has not shown that the individual who it is pursuing is in fact the driver who was liable for the charge, the signs in this car park are not prominent, clear or legible from all parking Spaces, there is no evidence of calibrated machinery and that they do not believe that the operator has authority from the landowner is issue PCNs on site.

    Assessor supporting rational for decision

    I note the appellant’s grounds of appeal in relation to this PCN. However, the operator has failed to provide any evidence for my consideration. Because of this, the operator has failed to prove that it issued the PCN correctly. Therefore, I am satisfied that the appellant’s grounds of appeal do not require any further consideration.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 10th Jan 18, 11:27 PM
    • 53,945 Posts
    • 67,633 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Yay, well done!

    Please also post this in the POPLA Decisions sticky thread, with a link back here and stating that the success was versus 'LPS' at Stratford Upon Avon.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

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