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    • Blondetotty
    • By Blondetotty 11th Oct 17, 3:05 PM
    • 122Posts
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    Blondetotty
    Landlord Selling - Viewing confusion
    • #1
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:05 PM
    Landlord Selling - Viewing confusion 11th Oct 17 at 3:05 PM
    Hi, I'm on a periodic month to month tenancy and I've been told that my landlord is now going to sell the property so will be issuing a section 21.


    I'm assuming if my rent period is 1st to the 31st then he can issue this on 1st November and I'll need to leave on the 1st January or can he issue this at any time?


    Can I also check what his rights are with regards to entering the property for viewings during the notice period?


    They've not been particularly helpful with repairs etc. over the period of the tenancy so I'm not feeling particularly enamoured with the thought of them traipsing people in an out over the next 2 months.
Page 1
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 11th Oct 17, 3:10 PM
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    Comms69
    • #2
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:10 PM
    • #2
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:10 PM
    HE can issue at any point, it's just two calendar months.


    You don't NEED to leave, you can stay for pretty much upto 40 weeks (that's on avg how long eviction takes)


    Regarding viewings, what does your tenancy say?
    • Blondetotty
    • By Blondetotty 11th Oct 17, 3:17 PM
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    Blondetotty
    • #3
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:17 PM
    • #3
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:17 PM
    Thanks for clarifying the notice


    Not sure about tenancy agreement, it was lost in a written off car (long story!) so I haven't had a copy since about the time I moved in.
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 11th Oct 17, 3:19 PM
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    Comms69
    • #4
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:19 PM
    • #4
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:19 PM
    Thanks for clarifying the notice


    Not sure about tenancy agreement, it was lost in a written off car (long story!) so I haven't had a copy since about the time I moved in.
    Originally posted by Blondetotty


    Ask for a copy. It's impossible to say without it
    • m0bov
    • By m0bov 11th Oct 17, 3:19 PM
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    m0bov
    • #5
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:19 PM
    • #5
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:19 PM
    You dont need to allow viewings, its your home. You might be able to get a discount on your rent if you do, really your LL should be selling with vacant possession.
    I would change the locks in case you discover photos of your home online or muddy foot prints.
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 11th Oct 17, 3:21 PM
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    Comms69
    • #6
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:21 PM
    • #6
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:21 PM
    You dont need to allow viewings, its your home. You might be able to get a discount on your rent if you do, really your LL should be selling with vacant possession.
    I would change the locks in case you discover photos of your home online or muddy foot prints.
    Originally posted by m0bov


    Whilst I agree, there's little benefit in arguing the case at the minute. The viewings could be perfectly reasonable.


    If it becomes too much or done without notice, then change the locks.
    • Blondetotty
    • By Blondetotty 11th Oct 17, 3:35 PM
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    Blondetotty
    • #7
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:35 PM
    • #7
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:35 PM
    From memory I don't recall anything in the lease about viewings but could be wrong I guess.


    Even if something is in there it doesn't make it an automatic does it? I mean the landlord could put something in there about being allowed entrance monthly with 12 dancing girls herding cats but just because it's in the lease doesn't mean it's above board.


    I'm just wondering if there is anything legal or whathaveyou that says I have to or don't have to allow viewings (such as rules on deposit protection, notice periods etc.)
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 11th Oct 17, 3:40 PM
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    Comms69
    • #8
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:40 PM
    • #8
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:40 PM
    From memory I don't recall anything in the lease about viewings but could be wrong I guess.


    Even if something is in there it doesn't make it an automatic does it? - well you signed it didn't you? I mean the landlord could put something in there about being allowed entrance monthly with 12 dancing girls herding cats but just because it's in the lease doesn't mean it's above board. - it's about reasonableness ....


    I'm just wondering if there is anything legal or whathaveyou that says I have to or don't have to allow viewings (such as rules on deposit protection, notice periods etc.)
    Originally posted by Blondetotty


    No, there is no statutory policy on viewings.
    • Blondetotty
    • By Blondetotty 11th Oct 17, 3:58 PM
    • 122 Posts
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    Blondetotty
    • #9
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:58 PM
    • #9
    • 11th Oct 17, 3:58 PM
    Thank you. The statutory policy was what I was wondering.


    Yes I signed this lease but without getting into a disagreement over it, I've known some landlords to put all sorts of crap into leases and whether the tenant signed or not was irrelevant. It wasn't enforceable. You can't enforce what isn't 'legal'. If there was something in some legislation that said I had to allow the landlord access whenever for whatever I'd stick to it. My question was whether there was or not.


    I'm not planning on being unreasonable but I wanted something in my hand to make sure they're not going to be unreasonable either. They've not been particularly helpful, or reasonable during the 3 years I've been with them and I can see this situation becoming particularly difficult hence wanting whatever "ammunition", for lack of a better word, in my arsenal.


    I don't want to be swinging from the chandeliers with a fire whip while my gimp crawls around the floor singing Hi Ho Dandy and the landlord stroll in with prospective buyers in tow.
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 11th Oct 17, 4:07 PM
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    Comms69
    Thank you. The statutory policy was what I was wondering.


    Yes I signed this lease but without getting into a disagreement over it, I've known some landlords to put all sorts of crap into leases and whether the tenant signed or not was irrelevant. It wasn't enforceable. - very true. But you must consider the reasonableness of the request. The law for example does not cover every aspect of a tenancy, and there a many enforceable things that can be added. You can't enforce what isn't 'legal'. - Yes you can If there was something in some legislation that said I had to allow the landlord access whenever for whatever I'd stick to it. My question was whether there was or not.


    I'm not planning on being unreasonable but I wanted something in my hand to make sure they're not going to be unreasonable either. They've not been particularly helpful, or reasonable during the 3 years I've been with them and I can see this situation becoming particularly difficult hence wanting whatever "ammunition", for lack of a better word, in my arsenal.


    I don't want to be swinging from the chandeliers with a fire whip while my gimp crawls around the floor singing Hi Ho Dandy and the landlord stroll in with prospective buyers in tow.
    Originally posted by Blondetotty
    That's fair enough and again reasonable notice will be part of any clause, typically 24 hr.


    Or there may be no clause at all, in which case simply say no. But until you know....
    • martindow
    • By martindow 12th Oct 17, 10:40 AM
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    martindow

    I don't want to be swinging from the chandeliers with a fire whip while my gimp crawls around the floor singing Hi Ho Dandy and the landlord stroll in with prospective buyers in tow.
    Originally posted by Blondetotty
    Don't tell the agent this. It could encourage lots of viewings on the off chance.
    • AndyTails
    • By AndyTails 12th Oct 17, 12:21 PM
    • 58 Posts
    • 54 Thanks
    AndyTails
    HE can issue at any point, it's just two calendar months.
    Originally posted by Comms69

    No. He can issue at any point, but the notice must expire at the end of a period, and at least two months away. (Not sure "expire" is the right word, but I'm sure you get my meaning.)


    So, in the OP's case, anything issued before 31st October would expire 31st December (or 31st Jan, Feb, March etc. if the landlord worded it so); anything issued from 1st to 30th November would expire 31st Jan (or 28th Feb, 31st March etc.).


    Note that as the rental period is 1st to 31st, the notice would need to be issued by the 31st, and the day you would have to move out is the 31st. (Not as the OP suggests the 1st for both dates).
    Last edited by AndyTails; 12-10-2017 at 12:23 PM. Reason: clarify leaving date
    • Comms69
    • By Comms69 12th Oct 17, 12:23 PM
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    Comms69
    No. He can issue at any point, but the notice must expire at the end of a period, and at least two months away. (Not sure "expire" is the right word, but I'm sure you get my meaning.) - No, that is not true, and hasn't been for many years now.


    So, in the OP's case, anything issued before 31st October would expire 31st December (or 31st Jan, Feb, March etc. if the landlord worded it so); anything issued from 1st to 30th November would expire 31st Jan (or 28th Feb, 31st March etc.).
    Originally posted by AndyTails

    Seriously, if you're going to contradict something at least check it first.
    • saajan_12
    • By saajan_12 12th Oct 17, 12:25 PM
    • 1,010 Posts
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    saajan_12
    There is no statutory 'law' either way on viewings.
    * You do have the right to quiet enjoyment of your home
    * The LL may (read your contract) have a contractual right to viewings.

    These can be balanced if there is reasonableness. ie 2 dancing girls coming monthly would impact your quiet enjoyment (litterally) so an unenforceable term. However access for specific purposes (e.g. inspections / tenant viewings / buyer viewings) at reasonable times (e.g. 2 days a week / only daytime hours) and with reasonable notice (e.g. 24 hours) would be reasonable.

    Whether the LL can practically enforce this if you change the locks is another story.. he may be able to sue for losses due to you breaching a reasonable term.
    • Blondetotty
    • By Blondetotty 1st Nov 17, 8:40 AM
    • 122 Posts
    • 81 Thanks
    Blondetotty
    I'm not sure if anyone likes updates but I thought I'd give one.


    The landlord officially served my section 21 on 15th November and gave the date of 31st December as the date he would like me out. We spoke afterwards and he eventually agreed that he would be flexible and so would I on pretty much everything from leaving early, staying on, viewings and any problems arising. We just agreed to keep in touch and let the other know as things came up.


    Funnily enough 3 days later I found a place and he stuck true to his word and I'm moving out today with zero penalty. In the two weeks I've been planning the move I've had an estate agent in measuring and taking notes, an electrician to sort some work out and the landlord checking some bits but I've accommodated him as well.


    I know I'm lucky in that he's letting me leave early. Technically if I gave him a months notice it would have had to have been yesterday as my rent period runs from 1-31 and I couldn't have afforded two lots of rents this month plus deposit etc so I would have lost the lovely new place I'm moving into. I guess in the end we both ended up with what we wanted, but we were both polite and willing to compromise so it ends happily. Bit of a surprise to me if I'm honest!
    • G_M
    • By G_M 1st Nov 17, 11:41 AM
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    G_M
    I'm not sure if anyone likes updates but I thought I'd give one.


    The landlord officially served my section 21 on 15th November and gave the date of 31st December as the date he would like me out.
    Originally posted by Blondetotty
    Errr.... it's only 1st November today......

    Did you mean 15th October?

    However I'm glad it worked out for you.

    Just to be safe, I would write to him requesting confirmation that you can surrender the tenancy early on xx date.

    Otherwise there is a remote chance he could use your premature departure (notice-wise) to deduct rent from your deposit. Sounds like he woouldn't, but for the sake of a letter, or email.....
    Last edited by G_M; 01-11-2017 at 11:45 AM.
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