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  • FIRST POST
    • fooby1
    • By fooby1 9th Oct 17, 9:48 AM
    • 18Posts
    • 2Thanks
    fooby1
    TV Licensing - Do I Need to Remove Antenna Cables from room?
    • #1
    • 9th Oct 17, 9:48 AM
    TV Licensing - Do I Need to Remove Antenna Cables from room? 9th Oct 17 at 9:48 AM
    I had a threatening letter from TV licensing informing me that my property is "under investigation" as I haven't applied for a TV license. I don't watch live TV and decided when they brought in the iPlayer catch up requirements that a subscription to BBC iPlayer isn't worth £147 a year.

    I only watch Netflix, YouTube and very rarely 4od catchup. No antenna is plugged in to my TV, however there is a regular TV antenna and Sky satellite cable coming in through the wall. It's a rental, so I'd rather not chop the cables, but if they wanted to, could I be fined for having cables coming into my living room that could produce a live TV signal?
Page 1
    • Owain Moneysaver
    • By Owain Moneysaver 9th Oct 17, 11:26 AM
    • 7,516 Posts
    • 7,933 Thanks
    Owain Moneysaver
    • #2
    • 9th Oct 17, 11:26 AM
    • #2
    • 9th Oct 17, 11:26 AM
    No.

    (ten characters)
    A kind word lasts a minute, a skelped erse is sair for a day.
    • mickthemikeman
    • By mickthemikeman 9th Oct 17, 12:32 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    mickthemikeman
    • #3
    • 9th Oct 17, 12:32 PM
    • #3
    • 9th Oct 17, 12:32 PM
    To be on the safe side I would advise you to detune your TV ,if you have one, putting your TV on search for channels with no connection to an ariel will do this. Remove all aeriel cables from the room or tie them up in a bundle so they cannot reach your TV/Monitor You will get Goons from Capita claiming they want to come inside your property and check that you are legal. Dont let them in they have no authority to do so. Once you find out they are from Capita do not speak to them and for God sake dont give them your name. The Goons are on bonus schemes for getting people to court and where there is money there can be dishonesty. They give up after a couple of visits. You are now LLF (Legally Licence Free) The money you saved will pay for your Netflix/ Amazon video service
    Last edited by mickthemikeman; 09-10-2017 at 12:36 PM. Reason: correcting information
    • cajef
    • By cajef 9th Oct 17, 3:38 PM
    • 4,528 Posts
    • 3,594 Thanks
    cajef
    • #4
    • 9th Oct 17, 3:38 PM
    • #4
    • 9th Oct 17, 3:38 PM
    Just as important whatever you do don't sign anything at all that they ask you sign.
    I used to have a handle on life, but it broke.
    • HWW
    • By HWW 10th Oct 17, 5:24 PM
    • 23 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    HWW
    • #5
    • 10th Oct 17, 5:24 PM
    • #5
    • 10th Oct 17, 5:24 PM
    Never let them in, "Not today thank you I do not deal with cold callers" sign & say nothing else, & shut the door. If the scum persist, it's Harassment & you can call the police to eject them.
    • Cornucopia
    • By Cornucopia 10th Oct 17, 10:25 PM
    • 9,272 Posts
    • 8,769 Thanks
    Cornucopia
    • #6
    • 10th Oct 17, 10:25 PM
    • #6
    • 10th Oct 17, 10:25 PM
    I had a threatening letter from TV licensing informing me that my property is "under investigation"...
    Originally posted by fooby1
    They send these letters out in their millions. They are meaningless, and receipt of one (or more likely many of them) is nothing to be concerned about.

    TV Licensing Glossary of terms:-

    "This property is under investigation" - we know that you don't have a Licence, and we've ticked the box on the computer that says we know.

    "The property is under official investigation" - we know that you don't have a Licence, and we've ticked the box on the computer that says we know... and we did it in our office.

    "You have 10 days to get properly Licensed" - we have no right to require you to do anything, and we are not giving you 10 days not to do it.

    "Your property is scheduled for a visit" - we know that you don't have a Licence, and we've ticked the box on the computer that says we know.

    And so on. It is an exercise in misinformation - a national scandal.
    I'm a Board Guide on the Phones & TV, Techie Stuff, In My Home,
    The Money Savers Arms and Food Shopping boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge threads there. Any views (especially those on the UK TV Licence) are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com.

    Board guides are not moderators. If you spot an inappropriate or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com
    • silverwhistle
    • By silverwhistle 11th Oct 17, 12:04 AM
    • 1,603 Posts
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    silverwhistle
    • #7
    • 11th Oct 17, 12:04 AM
    • #7
    • 11th Oct 17, 12:04 AM
    "Or, tell us you don't need one.
    We may check this with a visit."

    So I won't bother then..
    • Cornucopia
    • By Cornucopia 11th Oct 17, 9:00 AM
    • 9,272 Posts
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    Cornucopia
    • #8
    • 11th Oct 17, 9:00 AM
    • #8
    • 11th Oct 17, 9:00 AM
    "visit" - a search of your living room for AV equipment, and subsequent examination, that you are under no obligation to allow us to do, and which is not in your best interests.

    "you did not respond to our previous letters" - you don't need to respond to our letters.

    "the enforcement officer will be ... polite and fair" - the salesperson is paid commission based on the outcome of their visit which mitigates against politeness or fairness, and there is little supervision to support that promise.
    Last edited by Cornucopia; 11-10-2017 at 9:03 AM.
    I'm a Board Guide on the Phones & TV, Techie Stuff, In My Home,
    The Money Savers Arms and Food Shopping boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge threads there. Any views (especially those on the UK TV Licence) are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com.

    Board guides are not moderators. If you spot an inappropriate or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com
    • silverwhistle
    • By silverwhistle 11th Oct 17, 1:10 PM
    • 1,603 Posts
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    silverwhistle
    • #9
    • 11th Oct 17, 1:10 PM
    • #9
    • 11th Oct 17, 1:10 PM
    I'm mischievously inclined to admit to them that I do watch football on television. Watch their eyes light up..

    Not sure at what stage to tell them it's down The Kings Arms* where I'm a known regular for certain games..

    *Not actual pub name.
    • Cornucopia
    • By Cornucopia 11th Oct 17, 1:47 PM
    • 9,272 Posts
    • 8,769 Thanks
    Cornucopia
    I'm not sure that MSE would want people to mess TVL around unnecessarily (despite the fact that they want to do that to you).

    There are lots of legitimate legal strategies that can be used if you want to assert your noble & historic rights as a UK citizen.

    For example: I probably mentioned before that BBC/TVL banned themselves from my address after I told them that I did not consent to being interviewed under caution using their paper form (which I asserted was not PACE-compliant).
    Last edited by Cornucopia; 11-10-2017 at 1:52 PM.
    I'm a Board Guide on the Phones & TV, Techie Stuff, In My Home,
    The Money Savers Arms and Food Shopping boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge threads there. Any views (especially those on the UK TV Licence) are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com.

    Board guides are not moderators. If you spot an inappropriate or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com
    • silverwhistle
    • By silverwhistle 11th Oct 17, 3:38 PM
    • 1,603 Posts
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    silverwhistle
    Well, the 'inclined' was probably a giveaway. I might have written 'minded' :-).

    But wry amusement aside, how can an interview under caution be justified? I'm not going to allow any such nonsense anyway, but surely there must be some prior evidence? As I haven't got or watch TV on what grounds would they justify asking?
    • Cornucopia
    • By Cornucopia 11th Oct 17, 4:01 PM
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    Cornucopia
    I think that the combination of not having a TV Licence and answering "Yes" to the question: "Do you have a TV?" are deemed sufficient basis to begin further questioning.

    Although the form has been tweaked to allow for the possibility that someone has a TV but does not use it for live broadcasts or iPlayer, it still lacks sufficient detail in that area, IMHO.

    OTOH, TVL acknowledge themselves that interview under caution can be declined, although how that would work in practice, I don't know. Even though the "No Comment" interview seems to be well known amongst the Public, I've never heard of one in the TVL context, which seems strange.
    Last edited by Cornucopia; 11-10-2017 at 4:03 PM.
    I'm a Board Guide on the Phones & TV, Techie Stuff, In My Home,
    The Money Savers Arms and Food Shopping boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge threads there. Any views (especially those on the UK TV Licence) are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com.

    Board guides are not moderators. If you spot an inappropriate or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com
    • silverwhistle
    • By silverwhistle 11th Oct 17, 6:49 PM
    • 1,603 Posts
    • 2,116 Thanks
    silverwhistle
    And if I answer 'No' as is the case? I presume they ask to come in or ask if you use a phone or tablet etc.

    Anyway, thanks for your reply. If they ever do visit whilst I'm in I'll try and remember the questions! Must dash - online language lesson to give..
    • Cornucopia
    • By Cornucopia 11th Oct 17, 8:27 PM
    • 9,272 Posts
    • 8,769 Thanks
    Cornucopia
    And if I answer 'No' as is the case? I presume they ask to come in or ask if you use a phone or tablet etc.
    Originally posted by silverwhistle
    Yes.

    One of the cliches of TVL is: "You need a Licence for that" (whatever "that" is).
    I'm a Board Guide on the Phones & TV, Techie Stuff, In My Home,
    The Money Savers Arms and Food Shopping boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge threads there. Any views (especially those on the UK TV Licence) are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com.

    Board guides are not moderators. If you spot an inappropriate or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com
    • HWW
    • By HWW 12th Oct 17, 1:17 PM
    • 23 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    HWW
    The real truth about CRAPITA is they rely on half truths or even lies to enforce the TV licence.
    In Law, using half truths or lies should be an utterly no-go area, otherwise it MUST bring the law itself into disrepute ?
    • Cornucopia
    • By Cornucopia 12th Oct 17, 1:33 PM
    • 9,272 Posts
    • 8,769 Thanks
    Cornucopia
    In principle, yes.

    However, BBC/TV Licensing seem to have decided (or worse obtained advice) that because this is an adversarial situation, almost anything goes. Couple that with their endemic refusal to accept the full rigours of PACE and HRA, and I cannot recommend that anyone has anything to do with them - they are simply too much of an unknown quantity. And that's at the HQ/Policy level - the ill-discipline and poor supervision of some of their workforce comes on top of that.

    I'm not sure which is worse, the fact that TV Licensing cannot be trusted, or the fact that the law appears to accept it.

    One thing I would say is that I have seen no evidence to support the notion that the issues are solely or mainly about Capita. Certainly, an outsource arrangement does not help, and Capita has a poor reputation generally. However, the key staff in TV Licensing are BBC employees, and the BBC remains in control of policy and direction of the pseudo-organisation. Even if Capita were out of control, it would still be the BBC's responsibility to monitor and control them, ultimately sacking them if necessary.
    Last edited by Cornucopia; 12-10-2017 at 1:37 PM.
    I'm a Board Guide on the Phones & TV, Techie Stuff, In My Home,
    The Money Savers Arms and Food Shopping boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge threads there. Any views (especially those on the UK TV Licence) are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com.

    Board guides are not moderators. If you spot an inappropriate or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com
    • robti
    • By robti 19th Oct 17, 10:11 AM
    • 128 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    robti
    Ok I’m lost I have seen “PACE” mentioned on this thread but despite doing a search I can’t find what it means in context to this thread, any help ?

    Thanks
    • Tom99
    • By Tom99 19th Oct 17, 10:59 AM
    • 270 Posts
    • 133 Thanks
    Tom99
    You do not need a licence nor do you need to remove any leads or cables.

    The Communications (Television Licensing) Regulations 2004 (as amended), states that you need to be covered by a TV Licence if you: - watch or record live TV programmes on any channel, or - download or watch BBC programmes on iPlayer This could be on any device, including a TV, desktop computer, laptop, mobile phone, tablet, games console, digital box or Blu-ray/DVD/VHS recorder.
    • robti
    • By robti 19th Oct 17, 11:05 AM
    • 128 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    robti
    Do I need a license to listen to the radio through the airwaves or online, eg bbc radio 2 tuned normally or through the net radio on my av receiver
    • Cornucopia
    • By Cornucopia 19th Oct 17, 11:09 AM
    • 9,272 Posts
    • 8,769 Thanks
    Cornucopia
    Do I need a license to listen to the radio through the airwaves or online, eg bbc radio 2 tuned normally or through the net radio on my av receiver
    Originally posted by robti
    No.

    However, beware that Radio iPlayer now asks for an ID registration, so you may want to change your online Radio service to:-

    - http://www.radioplayer.co.uk/

    - https://tunein.com/

    Other radio services may be available.
    I'm a Board Guide on the Phones & TV, Techie Stuff, In My Home,
    The Money Savers Arms and Food Shopping boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge threads there. Any views (especially those on the UK TV Licence) are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com.

    Board guides are not moderators. If you spot an inappropriate or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com
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