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    • fapfapfapfapfap
    • By fapfapfapfapfap 8th Oct 17, 11:52 AM
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    fapfapfapfapfap
    Council Housing?
    • #1
    • 8th Oct 17, 11:52 AM
    Council Housing? 8th Oct 17 at 11:52 AM
    I don't understand council housing.

    Why is it you can get council housing when you earn enough to afford something off the private rental market? Yes, there's a wait and you can have your reasons. But shouldn't council housing only be available to the needy, not those who 'meet' the criteria but could reasonably afford private rented accommodation. I don't get why they don't mean test this aspect of the applicant?
Page 2
    • seven-day-weekend
    • By seven-day-weekend 9th Oct 17, 6:53 AM
    • 29,853 Posts
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    seven-day-weekend
    Why should not someone on a decent income benefit from security of tenure?
    To love someone is to learn the song in their heart and to sing it to them when they have forgotten it
    'I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen. Not only because I see it, but because I see everything by it': C.S. Lewis
    'Let me tell you this one thing. When you fall out, as you will, don't get blaming each other. Look inside yourself first'. - Hilda Ogden, to Sally on her wedding day to Kevin, Coronation Street 1986. '
    • 00ec25
    • By 00ec25 9th Oct 17, 8:27 AM
    • 5,572 Posts
    • 4,973 Thanks
    00ec25
    Why should not someone on a decent income benefit from security of tenure?
    Originally posted by seven-day-weekend
    no reason at all that they shouldn't, but in the same vein, why should they get such security at a discounted rent?

    rent paid should be means tested, then "we" will get a better idea of who are the genuinely needy and who are merely benefit spongers unwilling to work and expecting the state to feed and house them
    • pogofish
    • By pogofish 9th Oct 17, 1:21 PM
    • 7,936 Posts
    • 8,055 Thanks
    pogofish
    no reason at all that they shouldn't, but in the same vein, why should they get such security at a discounted rent?
    Originally posted by 00ec25
    They don't.

    Council housing in England and Wales covers its feet commercially and since the 1980s when the bulk of the treasury bonds that financed it were paid-up and councils were forced to account excess income to Westminster, it has proved a nice little money earner - Ring fenced for "Ministerial Projects" last time I looked, it was sitting at around two billion a year and set to rise further over the next few years.
    • theartfullodger
    • By theartfullodger 9th Oct 17, 1:24 PM
    • 9,117 Posts
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    theartfullodger
    Why should not someone on a decent income benefit from security of tenure?
    Originally posted by seven-day-weekend
    Indeed: It's called owning your own home, Mother Theresa's answer to all housing problems
    • 00ec25
    • By 00ec25 9th Oct 17, 1:33 PM
    • 5,572 Posts
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    00ec25
    They don't.
    Originally posted by pogofish
    they do

    perhaps you misunderstand what is being said in this thread?

    here is a clue:
    I live in a maisonette. Its a bit larger than the smaller terraced houses that abound here. The rent is £400 a month. Private rents are disproportionately high as only 12 miles from London with quick transport links - private rental on a 3 bed terrace house now is around £1,100 . I couldn't begin to pay that as LHA when I last looked is around £750 pm.
    Originally posted by deannatrois
    perhaps you failed to read post #5

    lets look at some figures shall we:

    average monthly rent in housing association property (all stock is now with RSLs) Bromley Kent 2016: source Govt data per post #5

    average monthly rent £512

    average private sector rent Bromley Kent 2016: Source: Valuation Office Agency biennial survey https://data.london.gov.uk/dataset/average-private-rents-borough
    no of properties sampled: 1,340 average rent £1,241 bottom quartile rent: £950 median £1,195 upper quartile £1,400

    so as stated "council" housing is still heavily "subsided" in terms of being way below market rate and yet occupied by people who are thus coining it in comparison to others who are unable to access such housing. Id you look back to the history of deannatrois you will see that she is precisely the type of person for whom social housing is intended to help. She needs and deserves it, yet she has had to go through hel l to get it because so much of it is "blocked" by those who don't need it any longer
    Last edited by 00ec25; 09-10-2017 at 1:52 PM.
    • seven-day-weekend
    • By seven-day-weekend 9th Oct 17, 4:03 PM
    • 29,853 Posts
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    seven-day-weekend
    Indeed: It's called owning your own home, Mother Theresa's answer to all housing problems
    Originally posted by theartfullodger
    Renting a social house is the securest form of housing, unless the homebuyer has paid off their mortgage or paid cash.
    To love someone is to learn the song in their heart and to sing it to them when they have forgotten it
    'I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen. Not only because I see it, but because I see everything by it': C.S. Lewis
    'Let me tell you this one thing. When you fall out, as you will, don't get blaming each other. Look inside yourself first'. - Hilda Ogden, to Sally on her wedding day to Kevin, Coronation Street 1986. '
    • theartfullodger
    • By theartfullodger 10th Oct 17, 1:48 PM
    • 9,117 Posts
    • 12,084 Thanks
    theartfullodger
    Renting a social house is the securest form of housing, unless the homebuyer has paid off their mortgage or paid cash.
    Originally posted by seven-day-weekend
    Rarely: There are at least 10 types of council or housing association tenancies/licenses - counting council & HA separately - see...
    https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/council_housing_association
    Council tenancies

    Secure council tenancies
    Introductory council tenancies
    Flexible council tenancies
    Demoted council tenancies
    Temporary council accommodation


    Housing association tenancies

    Assured tenancies with housing associations
    Housing association starter tenancies
    Assured shorthold tenancies with housing associations
    Demoted housing association tenancies
    Secure housing association tenancies
    Only the "Secure" tenancies are I think what you refer to: All others have fewer, weaker, rights and indeed for council temporary accommodation you can be pretty much evicted with a couple of days notices.

    The Conservatives are planning or reducing the availability of secure tenancies for new tenants & if they could withdrawing them from existing tenants.
    • Red-Squirrel
    • By Red-Squirrel 10th Oct 17, 1:52 PM
    • 2,031 Posts
    • 5,540 Thanks
    Red-Squirrel
    There's no reason why they can't keep their council tenancy but have their ability to pay a market rent assessed.

    I know people who got a council house when they were young couples with young children with only one full wage coming into the house. Now there are three or four adults working full-time in the same house but they are still paying the lower council rent.
    Originally posted by Mojisola
    I think that's because of the fundamental difference between the purpose of council housing and the purpose of private rental stock.

    Council housing exists to provide stable secure housing for people. Private renting exists to make profit for landlords.

    Its the same with anything that exists in both private and public sectors, you could ask why wealthy people aren't forced to pay for private medical care and free up the waiting lists for poorer people, or why well off parents aren't forced to send their kids to fee paying schools, it only comes up with social housing though because there's such a dire shortage of it.
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