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  • FIRST POST
    • Bama88
    • By Bama88 6th Oct 17, 11:57 PM
    • 17Posts
    • 3Thanks
    Bama88
    Second county court claim form from gladstones!
    • #1
    • 6th Oct 17, 11:57 PM
    Second county court claim form from gladstones! 6th Oct 17 at 11:57 PM
    Hi Everyone,

    Please help, I'm at breaking point with these cowboys! I recently received a county court claim form from Gladstones about a month ago. Unfortunately I had to pay it as I am currently working 12 hour shifts 6 days a week and didn't have the time or energy to fight it. I work in the financial industry so can not afford to get a CCJ as it could affect my employment. I had to pay them £241 in total £160 for the ticket and the rest their costs. It killed me to pay it but I panicked. The original ticket was issued by UK Car Parking Management and was for parking in a private car park outside work, there was a new sign that I didn't notice before parking there that day. This is part of the reason I paid it as I didn't think I had a strong defence. Anyway after paying them and requesting confirmation of payment, I received nothing, 2 further calls later, I lost my temper with the rude girl on the phone. I eventually got the confirmation of payment a few weeks ago, after being hung up on! Then much to my dismay and horror, I arrived home a couple of weeks ago to another LBC from them, I didn't think much of this as I've heard they do this - send out further correspondence once cases have been closed. Due to their total incompetence. I decided to ignore this, thinking they'd realise their error, plus I didn't want to speak to them again. However today, I've arrived home to another County Claim from from Northampton for what I thought was an older ticket I had from UK Car Parking Management that I thought I'd never hear about again, as it was for parking on a road where there was absolutely no signage at all (for which I have photographic evidence) the date corresponds with this older ticket from 2016 but looking at the particulars of claim on the Claim form the offence apparently occurred in Watford..I have never even been to Watford. I'm assuming I have a pretty good defence! Any advice on how to proceed will be greatly appreciated. Please ignore all punctuation errors as I am typing this on my phone after yet another extremely long shift I refuse to pay these b****rds another penny!
Page 1
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 7th Oct 17, 6:09 AM
    • 1,815 Posts
    • 3,205 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    • #2
    • 7th Oct 17, 6:09 AM
    • #2
    • 7th Oct 17, 6:09 AM
    Unfortunately I had to pay it as I am currently working 12 hour shifts 6 days a week and didn't have the time or energy to fight it.
    Puts you on the "suckers" list if you don't fight so you'll need to start to learn now.

    You have to acknowledge to get an extra 14 days to prepare a defence,but you can acknowledge online.
    Life's for living, get on with it rather than worrying about these. If they hassle, counter claim.

    Send them that costs schedule though, 24 hours before the hearing, and file it with the court. Take with you evidence that you have sent the costs schedule to them and when.
    LoC
    • beamerguy
    • By beamerguy 7th Oct 17, 8:04 AM
    • 6,470 Posts
    • 8,292 Thanks
    beamerguy
    • #3
    • 7th Oct 17, 8:04 AM
    • #3
    • 7th Oct 17, 8:04 AM
    Tell me Bama88, what is the date on the claim form you
    have just received

    And, due to the hassle you had after paying the previous one,
    have you checked your credit file recently.

    Unfortunately, you are dealing with very ignorant people
    Last edited by beamerguy; 07-10-2017 at 8:11 AM.
    RBS - MNBA - CAPITAL ONE - LLOYDS

    DISGUSTING BEHAVIOUR
    • Bama88
    • By Bama88 7th Oct 17, 2:09 PM
    • 17 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Bama88
    • #4
    • 7th Oct 17, 2:09 PM
    • #4
    • 7th Oct 17, 2:09 PM
    Yes, I'm going to do this as soon as I get home from work👍🏼
    • Bama88
    • By Bama88 7th Oct 17, 2:11 PM
    • 17 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Bama88
    • #5
    • 7th Oct 17, 2:11 PM
    • #5
    • 7th Oct 17, 2:11 PM
    I'll check the date as soon as I get home from work, it was received yesterday. I have checked my credit report and there's no CCJ. I have kept the receipt of the payment to them. I so wish I had not paid that one either! Surely they can't still try for CCJ once you've paid them?! 😡
    • safarmuk
    • By safarmuk 7th Oct 17, 2:21 PM
    • 613 Posts
    • 1,125 Thanks
    safarmuk
    • #6
    • 7th Oct 17, 2:21 PM
    • #6
    • 7th Oct 17, 2:21 PM
    the date corresponds with this older ticket from 2016 but looking at the particulars of claim on the Claim form the offence apparently occurred in Watford.
    What site location in Watford have they given (we can look on Google Maps/Street View)? If you have never been there and can prove that you were somewhere else on the date in question then you have a very strong defence.
    • beamerguy
    • By beamerguy 7th Oct 17, 2:23 PM
    • 6,470 Posts
    • 8,292 Thanks
    beamerguy
    • #7
    • 7th Oct 17, 2:23 PM
    • #7
    • 7th Oct 17, 2:23 PM
    I'll check the date as soon as I get home from work, it was received yesterday. I have checked my credit report and there's no CCJ. I have kept the receipt of the payment to them. I so wish I had not paid that one either! Surely they can't still try for CCJ once you've paid them?! 😡
    Originally posted by Bama88
    OK, let us know.

    The reason I asked you to check your credit file was just in
    case it went to court without your knowledge.
    NO, once you paid thats the end.

    Understand that these unregulated companies can and
    do get up to all sorts of tricks
    RBS - MNBA - CAPITAL ONE - LLOYDS

    DISGUSTING BEHAVIOUR
    • Bama88
    • By Bama88 8th Oct 17, 9:47 PM
    • 17 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Bama88
    • #8
    • 8th Oct 17, 9:47 PM
    • #8
    • 8th Oct 17, 9:47 PM
    Ok, so I've fished out the original ticket from UK Car Park Management and that had the incorrect address on it too. I didn't notice this at the time as I just looked at the picture of my car, parked where I expected it to be - by my work in Cardiff. The address however is for a place in Watford and this is the address that was on the DRP letter, the lbc from Gladstones and now it's also on the claim form..idiots. I can easily prove that I was at work that day, plus the pictures they have prove this. I shouldn't have had a ticket for parking in that spot anyway as there were no signs at all, for which I have photographic evidence. So I'd say without their complete !!!! up with the address, I'd have had a pretty strong defence anyway. How should I proceed at this stage? Advice much appreciated. I've never been to court before ��
    • safarmuk
    • By safarmuk 9th Oct 17, 12:06 PM
    • 613 Posts
    • 1,125 Thanks
    safarmuk
    • #9
    • 9th Oct 17, 12:06 PM
    • #9
    • 9th Oct 17, 12:06 PM
    The address however is for a place in Watford
    What is the address in Watford? If you give us it we can check to see if it is even an address this PPC operate at.

    Also are the pictures of your car definitely of your car in Cardiff and do this PPC operate at this car park in Cardiff? Is there a possibility someone has cloned your plates and is using them somewhere else on the same model car.

    If the PPC do operate at your site in Cardiff and the pictures are of your car then this is likely just an administrative error on the part of the PPC and I wouldn't put that much weight on it being a slam dunk winning point.
    • Bama88
    • By Bama88 9th Oct 17, 3:33 PM
    • 17 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Bama88
    The address is Clarendon Road, Watford WD17 1JR this PPC company were operating in the area, however it isn't actually a car park, just a private road on an industrial type place that runs along the side of my work building. A lot of people I work with have had issues with these companies as there is very little parking in the area. A few colleagues went to court with another company and one the case as there were no signs or where there were they were very old and outdated and mentioned claiming, rather than ticketing. Especially where I was parked that day, they are privately rented spaces but there were no signs anywhere in sight.
    • Bama88
    • By Bama88 9th Oct 17, 3:34 PM
    • 17 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Bama88
    Won the case even!
    • safarmuk
    • By safarmuk 9th Oct 17, 4:21 PM
    • 613 Posts
    • 1,125 Thanks
    safarmuk
    Looking at Google Street View - the sign is for UKPC not UK CPM. See below:

    https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Clarendon+Rd,+Watford+WD17+1JR/@51.6573777,-0.3979924,3a,75y,206.72h,91.51t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1saVPoSK7EPWFLpisd-7nOcg!2e0!3e11!7i13312!8i6656!4m5!3m4!1s0x48766ac1 43f0222d:0x36f07dd0a7dfdc1b!8m2!3d51.6574028!4d-0.3977596

    I'm also confused, I thought you said you had never been to Watford in your original post?
    • Bama88
    • By Bama88 9th Oct 17, 4:35 PM
    • 17 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Bama88
    No never been to Watford. I meant they were operating in the area in Cardiff. Where the car was actually parked that day.
    • Bama88
    • By Bama88 9th Oct 17, 4:36 PM
    • 17 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Bama88
    So it's clearly just an admin error then? I'd have thought that making such a big mistake on court paperwork would mean the case should be thrown out for that alone? Or am I being niaive?
    • safarmuk
    • By safarmuk 9th Oct 17, 4:57 PM
    • 613 Posts
    • 1,125 Thanks
    safarmuk
    Well, it is interesting.

    Without seeing your paperwork, it appears the claim is from UK CPM, with pictures of your car in Cardiff, but with a site address in Watford which appears to be operated by UKPC ...

    I doubt this is "fatal", but it isn't good for them IMO. What is the basis given for the PCN?
    • Bama88
    • By Bama88 9th Oct 17, 5:30 PM
    • 17 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Bama88
    The initial PPC claims that "the pcn has been issued due to my vehicle being parked in a manner whereby the driver became liable for a pcn at Clarendon Road where we are authorised to manage on the said date"

    It also falsely claims that "The terms and conditions of parking on this private land are clearly set out on the signage installed within the car park"

    "By parking within this car park you are bound to these terms and conditions and liable to pay a charge if you breach these t&c's"

    As I've said, this is a private road, not an actual car park that you enter. And there were no signs at all. So even if they had put the correct address or even the correct country on the pcn - the facts are still incorrect.
    • Johnersh
    • By Johnersh 9th Oct 17, 6:20 PM
    • 742 Posts
    • 1,378 Thanks
    Johnersh
    It could be fatal (but they could reissue a claim for the correct site if they want).

    If they haven't pleaded that you are in breach of terms at Cardiff, but terms in Watford, I think you can safely deny that. The pleading is the only case you have to answer. Indeed, they haven't even said what the parking terms are. You cannot be criticised for responding to the case put to you. It is not for you to gift them a claim.

    Accuracy as to location is critical if one considers that cars may be parked in different locations several times per day. It is fundamental to the alleged contract that entitled them to ticket too.

    I would resist expressing any view on their photo evidence certainly for now. Obviously you must adduce evidence to prove that you (and preferably your car) were in Wales on the day/date/time in question. the witness evidence may need careful handling.
    • Bama88
    • By Bama88 9th Oct 17, 11:52 PM
    • 17 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Bama88
    So you think I should just proceed with my evidence that I and my car were in Cardiff on the date and time of offence, not Watford and make no reference to knowin the original ticket has the wrong address on it?
    • safarmuk
    • By safarmuk 10th Oct 17, 9:45 AM
    • 613 Posts
    • 1,125 Thanks
    safarmuk
    So just to clarify:
    * The car was parked in Wales
    * The photos show a car parked in Wales
    * The address of the infringement on the claim is in Watford
    * The driver nor the registered keeper have ever been to Watford and were not in Watford on that day
    * The address in Watford actually for all intents and purposes (due to current Google Street Maps) seems to be managed by a different PPC (UKPC not UK CPM whom the claim is from)

    Am I right in my summary?
    • Johnersh
    • By Johnersh 10th Oct 17, 10:16 AM
    • 742 Posts
    • 1,378 Thanks
    Johnersh
    The ticket you paid (the work ticket) is irrelevant to this claim. This is a new matter.

    My understanding is that there was no windscreen ticket for this one or that it was not retained. Is that correct?

    It seems to me that you can recall once getting a ticket on the road (the Cardiff road ticket) but you have no way of knowing if this is the same or different given the description of it being in Watford and the passage of time does hinder further investigation.

    Indeed if this ticket was issued at your place of work, thats would be a third potential site.

    It's defensible but the risk lies with the potential for a pyrrhic victory - if you win at court only for the evidence elicited there to be used to pursue a new claim correctly issued.
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