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    • pumpkinatadesk
    • By pumpkinatadesk 6th Oct 17, 9:17 PM
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    pumpkinatadesk
    pay cut for regular homeworkers
    • #1
    • 6th Oct 17, 9:17 PM
    pay cut for regular homeworkers 6th Oct 17 at 9:17 PM
    I wonder if anyone can advise me on my position and how to proceed?

    I have worked for a company for several years. My contract states my working hours and that one day will be from home. In reality my hours and working from home day change regularly to fit around my job but I try to keep to schedule because of childcare issues and a lack of desk space!

    The company has just published a new policy stating that if you work from home regularly you will have your pay decreased by the percentage of your working week you are working from home. This applies to the London weighting part of pay only and also only if it's a regular thing. So adhoc working from home will not prompt a pay reduction.

    Can I refuse a reduction to my pay? What happens if they just start reducing my pay?
    Isn't there a discrimination factor here for people who request a regular homeworking arrangement due to childcare or disability?
    thanks for reading!
Page 1
    • jobbingmusician
    • By jobbingmusician 6th Oct 17, 9:34 PM
    • 18,728 Posts
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    jobbingmusician
    • #2
    • 6th Oct 17, 9:34 PM
    • #2
    • 6th Oct 17, 9:34 PM
    OK, first I found this confusing to read. You are saying that your London Weighting is being reduced by the percentage of time you spend at home, yes?

    I suppose their thinking is that you don't have to pay to travel in to work on the days when you work from home. I doubt it is discriminatory because they will (still?) respond to requests for flexible working.

    You seem to be asking two different questions: 1. Can they make this affect me, and 2. Is it discriminatory. I think you have a good argument against having your wages cut if you change your day regularly to suit them. But, more to the point, I don't see (morally) how they can have things both ways. If they are not providing you with a desk, how can they also expect to save money on your wages?

    IS THERE A UNION?
    I'm the Board Guide on the Matched Betting; Referrers and Jobseeking & Training boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge posts there. Board guides are not moderators and don't read every post. If you spot an illegal or inappropriate post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com (it's not part of my role to deal with this). Any views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.com.

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    • pumpkinatadesk
    • By pumpkinatadesk 6th Oct 17, 9:52 PM
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    pumpkinatadesk
    • #3
    • 6th Oct 17, 9:52 PM
    • #3
    • 6th Oct 17, 9:52 PM
    Sorry it's confusing.
    Yes they say the London weighting will be reduced by the percentage of hours that are regularly worked from home.
    So if you work from home every week the pay will be reduced. But if you work from home randomly (e.g because boiler breaks and gas man is visiting, or you have a special delivery etc) the pay will not be reduced.
    There is no corresponding reduction in travel costs as you can't ask Transport for London or National Rail to refund a proportion of your travel card for working from home.
    They say they will definitely find space in the building for all workers who decide against working from home to avoid the pay cut.
    My point around discrimination is that it is significantly more likely that people with childcare responsibilities will request a regular working pattern and that therefore this impacts more on women who typically have greater childcare responsibilities? They don't seem to be taking issue with the value of work done from home as it is only regular homeworkers being singled out for the reduction.
    Unfortunately our Union are not very active or interested in the issue.
    • jobbingmusician
    • By jobbingmusician 6th Oct 17, 10:04 PM
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    • #4
    • 6th Oct 17, 10:04 PM
    • #4
    • 6th Oct 17, 10:04 PM
    I thnk they should be. LW was negotiated for a reason, and the reason is NOT simply travel. After all, in an ideal world lots of people would choose to live next door to their work (wouldn't they?) - the additional costs of working in London are NOT simply to do with the iniquitous cost of travel, but with additional costs of living anywhere where you can access an inner or outer London job. If your company is happy for you to work from home all the time, and to pay your travel in to work when you are needed for meetings, then you could live in Pendle (which Google tells me is cheap), Poland or India. In that case it would be perfectly reasonable to reduce your LW. If they still expect you to work in London, then they need to maintain your contract and pay the agreed rate.
    Last edited by jobbingmusician; 06-10-2017 at 10:07 PM.
    I'm the Board Guide on the Matched Betting; Referrers and Jobseeking & Training boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge posts there. Board guides are not moderators and don't read every post. If you spot an illegal or inappropriate post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com (it's not part of my role to deal with this). Any views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.com.

    The good folk of the matched betting board are now (I hope!) supporting Macmillan, in memory of Fifigrace. Visit
    https://www.gofundme.com/running-the-leeds-10k-for-macmillan
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 6th Oct 17, 10:47 PM
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    sangie595
    • #5
    • 6th Oct 17, 10:47 PM
    • #5
    • 6th Oct 17, 10:47 PM
    Unless the OP can state otherwise, London Weighting is an allowance - it is not a legal right. Getting pay which relates to place of residence/ travel is not a legal right. Otherwise all wages would directly local economy.

    In terms of discrimination - every employee in the country has a right to ask for flexible working, which may include home working. So there is no discrimination due purely to childcare arrangements, or lack of them. Yoy would need more to evidence discrimination.

    An employer always has the right to vary terms anyway. Soon if they wish to enforce the change, they can. There may be a claim to unfair dismissal - but there may also be no claim. There is insufficient knowledge to give even a good guess.

    The union is you. The person not interested is you. And your colleagues. If your elected officials are not doing as you wish, then remove then. And stand yourself or support a better candidate.
    • pumpkinatadesk
    • By pumpkinatadesk 6th Oct 17, 11:12 PM
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    pumpkinatadesk
    • #6
    • 6th Oct 17, 11:12 PM
    • #6
    • 6th Oct 17, 11:12 PM
    Well London weighting is in my contractual pay and as explained the exception around the payment of this allowance is only being made for a specific type of flexible worker.
    Sangie595 if you have relevant expertise what additional info would help?
    And yes I am my own union hence taking an interest in the facts around the situation lol
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 6th Oct 17, 11:33 PM
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    • #7
    • 6th Oct 17, 11:33 PM
    • #7
    • 6th Oct 17, 11:33 PM
    Well London weighting is in my contractual pay and as explained the exception around the payment of this allowance is only being made for a specific type of flexible worker.
    Sangie595 if you have relevant expertise what additional info would help?
    And yes I am my own union hence taking an interest in the facts around the situation lol
    Originally posted by pumpkinatadesk
    It is likely an allowance, not pay - that is the norm. And allowances have conditions. There is nothing, per se, in law, to stop the employer rewriting policies, or even pay. The employer can rewrite any part of the contract they like. That gives them the right to "offer" you that rewrite and ask if you wish to accept it. You can refuse. They can enforce it by terminating your employment and asking if you want to accept the new terms - accept the terms and you have a job, refuse and you don't. That MAY allow you to claim unfair dismissal. It doesn't mean you would win. There is very little information you could offer that would suggest which way such a decision would go as tribunals make that decision - but either way you are unemployed (and probably without a reference,

    Whether I have "relevant expertise" to tell you that or not - well you can take it or leave it. Or pay for a lawyer, who may have relevant expertise. A good lawyer will tell you what I have said. There are no guarantees here - but either way you can guarantee being out of work. Sorry, but that is the way is works. And I am afraid that having children doesn't change that. Whilst I can understand your argument, I can haul a couple of hundred people out of the woodwork who have children and would never work from home as they would never get any work done due to the children! So nobody can really tell you how this would pan out. It depends what the employer is prepared to negotiate. But in the end you can only go to a tribunal AFTER you have protested and lost your job. How good is your evidence that anything unlawful is happening here, Because I am currently not seeing it.,
    • pumpkinatadesk
    • By pumpkinatadesk 6th Oct 17, 11:46 PM
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    pumpkinatadesk
    • #8
    • 6th Oct 17, 11:46 PM
    • #8
    • 6th Oct 17, 11:46 PM
    That is interesting thanks. Are you saying my employer can change my contractural pay just like that and there are no laws about how they should go about it? if that's the case what is the point of a contract?
    I think the sticking point for me is that they are distinguishing between regular homeworking and irregular homeworking. I can't see the rationale for this and I feel sure it creates an inequality.
    BTW I don't work from home with children around... perhaps there is a similar misunderstanding about the impact of regular and irregular flexible arrangements at the office.
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 7th Oct 17, 9:24 AM
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    sangie595
    • #9
    • 7th Oct 17, 9:24 AM
    • #9
    • 7th Oct 17, 9:24 AM
    Yes they can change it and yes there are laws - for what they are worth. If it is a policy - which i suspect it is - then they must inform you of the change. From their point of view it is then done with. If it is contractual, then they must tell you and you have the right to refuse to agree. They will then impose it and offer you the term - if you still refuse then you are resigning and at the end of your notice period your job terminates. You could go to a tribunal, but I wouldn't hold my breath on you winning. They aren't reducing your pay. They are terminating home working for everyone because it does not suit their business model any longer. You are reducing your pay by continuing to work from home under these conditions. In other words, by continuing to work from home you are agreeing to the new terms- unless you immediately work under protest and launch an employment tribunal claim to that effect for breach of contract. That's assuming it is, and that you would win. Which you can't assume.

    I can understand your argument about discrimination, but I think it's weak. Your guess that parents would prefer home working is not easy to substantiate.

    And as for the rationale- well it may not be logical (To you). But it doesn't need to be. The law doesn't require that.
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