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Parking charge on my own parking bay

Hi All, need some help dealing with private parking company and housing association to appeal or complain against parking charge issued for my car being parked in my own bay (I am a leaseholder of a flat and a parking space).

I have written several times to housing association and PPC demanding the ticket to be cancelled on the grounds that I am a landowner. They claim the valid permit has not been displayed. It was displayed but expired by several months. There is nothing about permits in my lease agreement, however it has some generic "fits all situations" statement that can be used against me (I can post it if required).

I find all this situation absurd and am not willing to pay anything to PPC for my parking space that cost me 10% of the property value when I purchased a flat.

Could you please provide some advice how to deal with them? Shall I go straight to POPLA or deal with housing association and ignore the PPC?
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Comments

  • Quentin
    Quentin Posts: 40,405 Forumite
    First do as everyone is politely asked to do before starting a new thread


    Read up on this in the newbies faq thread near the top of the forum


    There you will see advice to do both!


    Then read up on own space threads till you understand the game you are involved in
  • safarmuk
    safarmuk Posts: 648 Forumite
    1. What PPC are you dealing with?
    2. What date did you receive your ticket?
    3. Have you appealed to the PPC using the template in the Newbies thread via the timelines advised (if your PPC is a member of the BPA that is the way you get your POPLA code)
    4. Are other residents experiencing these problems in your estate?
  • Quitto
    Quitto Posts: 62
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    Thanks Quentin, I did read plenty of posts and I am still reading. I did not follow the recommendations here, as I did not expect it to be such a painful process for landowners. The notice that was issued is several months old, and I have written to PPC several times through appeal form explaining that I am the owner of the bay.
  • Quitto
    Quitto Posts: 62
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    safarmuk wrote: »
    1. What PPC are you dealing with?
    2. What date did you receive your ticket?
    3. Have you appealed to the PPC using the template in the Newbies thread via the timelines advised (if your PPC is a member of the BPA that is the way you get your POPLA code)
    4. Are other residents experiencing these problems in your estate?

    1. CPP
    2. Several months ago, following by several letters.
    3. No, I have not, I did write to them through their "appeal form" explaining the ownership of the bay however. They keep asking for "valid permit" or offering POPLA number.
    4. Yes. Some of them have paid the ticket, some refused.

    Thank you!
  • safarmuk
    safarmuk Posts: 648 Forumite
    1) Car Parking Partnership - BPA member so at least POPLA is indeed available to you
    2) Ideally you can try and see this off at POPLA and then deal with the Housing Association
    3) I would take the POPLA code and then construct a winning appeal, if you win this is then done and dusted and you can turn your attention to bringing the Housing Association into line - with the back up of a POPLA appeal success in your back pocket
    4) You need to round them up and complain as a group to the Housing Association. They (probably) contracted the PPC and therefore they should have control over them and should cancel tickets for genuine, authorised users of the car park

    The reason CPP are bleating about a permit is because they - like most PPCs - believe the only contract in place is the contract as specified on the signs they have erected and you have breached that contract by not displaying a permit. They have conveniently forgotten that:
    a) There is a pre-existing contract (the lease) between you and the landowner that (hopefully) defines your right to park clearly and;
    b) They are there to deter unauthorised car parking not authorised car parking (e.g. residents).
  • Quitto
    Quitto Posts: 62
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    Thank you! Do you think the template in the Coupon-mad's post (I cannot post a link unfortunately) is applicable to my case? Can I use that and submit as my POPLA appeal?
  • Redx
    Redx Posts: 38,084
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    unless you have a valid popla code then you cannot appeal to popla

    so any historical ticket will not have a popla option as it will have expired long ago

    if you do get a pcn , appeal it and get a popla code, post #3 of her NEWBIES thread deals with popla appeals
  • If you own your space under your lease and have exclusive rights in relation to it, then unless there's a clause in your lease which permits the introduction of new regulations concerning, inter alia, the car parking space, nobody has the power to introduce rules about how you can use it beyond those in the lease.


    Even if there is such a clause which covers parking regulations, it will most certainly not allow the freeholder to impose upon you a contractual relationship with a 3rd party pursuant to which the 3rd party can recover charges - the only money that can be obtained from you pursuant to your lease is ground rent/service charge.


    You need to get a copy of your lease.




    I am assuming that the introduction of the PPC was AFTER you had bought your leasehold title.


    How was the introduction of parking regs communicated to you? How did you get your original permit? Were you supposed to have renewed it or were they supposed to provide you with a new one? Were you told how to get a new one? Was it drawn to your attention that it would expire, or was this obvious?


    You need to think this through logically.
    Read hairray's thread where I drafted LBCs to be sent to the freeholder, the management company and the parking company threatening proceedings against them for damages for trespass, breach of the covenant of quiet enjoyment and DPA breaches. You need to look at your lease terms as well. If you haven't got a copy of your lease, you can get it from the solicitor who did your conveyancing, or from Land Registry (latter will charge a fee of c.£15)
    Although a practising Solicitor, my posts here are NOT legal advice, but are personal opinion based on limited facts provided anonymously by forum users. I accept no liability for the accuracy of any such posts and users are advised that, if they wish to obtain formal legal advice specific to their case, they must seek instruct and pay a solicitor.
  • Quitto
    Quitto Posts: 62
    First Anniversary Combo Breaker First Post
    Forumite
    If you own your space under your lease and have exclusive rights in relation to it, then unless there's a clause in your lease which permits the introduction of new regulations concerning, inter alia, the car parking space, nobody has the power to introduce rules about how you can use it beyond those in the lease....

    Yes, I own my space, as per lease agreement and land registry entry. There is nothing in my lease about parking permits, however there is a generic clause you are referring to. The housing association employed the CPP, I believe around the same time or shortly after the lease was signed. I do have a hard copy of my lease.

    All communication was done via mail from HA, first permit was issued by HA free of charge, after they informed that if the permit is not renewed the bay will not be monitored, I renewed the permit. After that there were no reminders or explanation as to how and if we need to renew a permit, so it is obviously lapsed. Based on that communication I was under impression that CPP are no longer monitor my bay if I do not renew. To my surprise they issued me a ticket. It seems like they are blackmailing and force us to purchase their permit for the land we own (under lease).
  • after they informed that if the permit is not renewed the bay will not be monitored
    I don't suppose you kept that?


    a generic clause
    Can you post the clause here for us to see?
    Although a practising Solicitor, my posts here are NOT legal advice, but are personal opinion based on limited facts provided anonymously by forum users. I accept no liability for the accuracy of any such posts and users are advised that, if they wish to obtain formal legal advice specific to their case, they must seek instruct and pay a solicitor.
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