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  • FIRST POST
    • Maccy99
    • By Maccy99 3rd Oct 17, 11:50 PM
    • 2Posts
    • 0Thanks
    Maccy99
    Massive E-on closing bill (£2000)
    • #1
    • 3rd Oct 17, 11:50 PM
    Massive E-on closing bill (£2000) 3rd Oct 17 at 11:50 PM
    I and three others lived at a property for 18 months: Feb '16 - Aug '17. When settling all our finals bills to close various accounts, everything was as expected, until we gave our final meter reading to E-on. Basically, we had given a reading (the estate agent did) when we moved in, and been sent estimates for our gas and electric. We ended up with £500CR on the electric, but a whopping £2000 debt for the gas.

    It turns out they had greatly underestimated our gas usage. This has been a learning experience and I will not be paying estimated fees ever again, but I have a few questions.

    Would the back-billing principle apply in anyway here? From what I can garner, to calculate our debt, our final quarterly statement has been amended to show the additional gas usage. So in essence it's as if we used all the additonal gas over two or three months. But of course the estimates have been off for 18 months, so realistically, at least a third of the bill should (could) be expected to be dropped?

    E-on have admitted to making a mistake with the estimates, and didn't once contact us about reading the meter; besides, it's located in the basement of the shop below us which is open 9-5.30 five days a week.

    I do understand we were stupid not keeping a closer eye on this, but it is 1) a huge amount of money and 2) annoying that E-on haven't even queried what we have been paying for all this time.

    Any advice from someone more in the know than me would be very helpful. Thanks!
Page 1
    • molerat
    • By molerat 4th Oct 17, 7:55 AM
    • 17,483 Posts
    • 11,717 Thanks
    molerat
    • #2
    • 4th Oct 17, 7:55 AM
    • #2
    • 4th Oct 17, 7:55 AM
    The back billing code only applies if they have not been billing you. If they have been billing you on estimates, as the bill will clearly show, and you have not bothered to check the readings, as the bill will encourage you to do, then they are not required to do anything.
    Last edited by molerat; 04-10-2017 at 8:00 AM.
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    • matelodave
    • By matelodave 4th Oct 17, 8:35 AM
    • 3,188 Posts
    • 1,905 Thanks
    matelodave
    • #3
    • 4th Oct 17, 8:35 AM
    • #3
    • 4th Oct 17, 8:35 AM
    As Molerat says, as they have been billing you the back billing rules dont apply.

    You should have checked the meters when the bills came in and got them corrected so you paid the right amount at the time. You would then not have ended up with a ginormous catch-up bill. You haven't lost out, infact you've had a very large interest free loan so dont expect compensation or something to get written off because you didn't put any effort in yourself.

    E-on or any other supplier can only estimate (guess) what they think you might use - it's up to you to put them right if their guess is wide of the mark.

    They can't know how many are in the flat or when or how you are using energy. Most energy companies only read the meter every couple of years, it's five for British Gas so it's really easy to rack up arrears.

    I'm guessing that 90% or more of the whinges on these forums is because people havent bothered to check & correct their bills and feel aggrieved that they've got a big bill when someone does eventually read the meter.

    Hopefully you've learnt a very valuable lesson. The other benefit of checking your bills and readings at least once a month is that you get to know how much you are using and you can then do something about trying to reduce your consumption and saving yourself some money.
    Last edited by matelodave; 04-10-2017 at 8:39 AM.
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  • E.ON Company Representative: Malc
    • #4
    • 4th Oct 17, 9:47 AM
    E.ON Final Bill
    • #4
    • 4th Oct 17, 9:47 AM
    I and three others lived at a property for 18 months: Feb '16 - Aug '17. When settling all our finals bills to close various accounts, everything was as expected, until we gave our final meter reading to E-on. Basically, we had given a reading (the estate agent did) when we moved in, and been sent estimates for our gas and electric. We ended up with £500CR on the electric, but a whopping £2000 debt for the gas.

    It turns out they had greatly underestimated our gas usage. This has been a learning experience and I will not be paying estimated fees ever again, but I have a few questions.

    Would the back-billing principle apply in anyway here? From what I can garner, to calculate our debt, our final quarterly statement has been amended to show the additional gas usage. So in essence it's as if we used all the additonal gas over two or three months. But of course the estimates have been off for 18 months, so realistically, at least a third of the bill should (could) be expected to be dropped?

    E-on have admitted to making a mistake with the estimates, and didn't once contact us about reading the meter; besides, it's located in the basement of the shop below us which is open 9-5.30 five days a week.

    I do understand we were stupid not keeping a closer eye on this, but it is 1) a huge amount of money and 2) annoying that E-on haven't even queried what we have been paying for all this time.

    Any advice from someone more in the know than me would be very helpful. Thanks!
    Originally posted by Maccy99
    Morning Maccy99 and welcome to the Forums.

    Our estimated bills are based on what's been used at a property over the previous 12-18 months. I do understand, this can lead to difficulties when estimating what's being used for new customers who have just moved in. Usage varies depending on the number of occupants, lifestyles, appliances etc. At this point, though, we've no option but to base estimates on past usage as we won't know how much energy will be used going forward. As others have said, giving us regular meter readings takes away the need for estimates and lets us bill accurately.

    It looks as though you used less electricity than indicated by the previous history we held but a lot more gas leading to the catch up bill once we had accurate readings. Totally appreciate the shock of receiving a catch up bill like this. If you have a chat with us, we'll be happy to look at setting up a payment arrangement to spread this over a longer period of time.

    Although we only need to see meters every two years, in most areas, we try to read them every six months. With your meter being in the basement of a shop, this possibly stopped us from reading it.

    Each bill/statement we issue states on the front page if it's estimated and, if it is, asks for readings so it can be re-billed accurately. We're always keen to have actual meter readings and provide various ways for customers to send them. This includes online through our website, phone app or Live Chat service, by phone or text, email or letter. The more readings we have, the more accurate accounts are.

    As molerat and matelodave say, as we've been sending bills, I wouldn't expect the Billing Code to apply. This usually applies where we're at fault for not sending a bill.

    Hope this explains Maccy99 but please let me know if you need any more information.

    Malc
    ďOfficial Company Representative
    I am an official company representative of E.ON. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to queries about the company, so that I can help solve issues. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. I am not allowed to tout for business at all. If you believe I am please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com This does NOT imply any form of approval of my company or its products by MSE"
    • Maccy99
    • By Maccy99 4th Oct 17, 11:20 AM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Maccy99
    • #5
    • 4th Oct 17, 11:20 AM
    • #5
    • 4th Oct 17, 11:20 AM
    OK all. We had assumed we'd have to suck it up and pay, but just wanted to check we hadn't been shafted. Of course it's our own fault. You live and learn; it won't happen again. Thanks guys.
    • Sam Hain
    • By Sam Hain 4th Oct 17, 11:41 AM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Sam Hain
    • #6
    • 4th Oct 17, 11:41 AM
    • #6
    • 4th Oct 17, 11:41 AM
    The next property you live at, get a Smart Meter. No estimated bills then and you can see exactly how much your gas / electricity costs.


    At the end of each month, I check to see how much I've spent, then put that towards the bill.


    So when my quarterly bill comes in, I've got the money already, so no nasty surprises.
    • vuvuzela
    • By vuvuzela 4th Oct 17, 11:47 AM
    • 3,222 Posts
    • 3,742 Thanks
    vuvuzela
    • #7
    • 4th Oct 17, 11:47 AM
    • #7
    • 4th Oct 17, 11:47 AM
    The next property you live at, get a Smart Meter. No estimated bills then and you can see exactly how much your gas / electricity costs.


    At the end of each month, I check to see how much I've spent, then put that towards the bill.


    So when my quarterly bill comes in, I've got the money already, so no nasty surprises.
    Originally posted by Sam Hain
    Alternatively, and if you're one of the type of people who regularly check prices and switch suppliers to get the best deal, DON'T get a smart meter. There are several kinds and not all suppliers can get proper data from all of them. Simply as said above, regularly read your meter and never rely on estimates on bills.

    Just another way that privatisation of utilities, rail etc have been to the detriment of the consumer.
    • Magerit
    • By Magerit 4th Oct 17, 12:05 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Magerit
    • #8
    • 4th Oct 17, 12:05 PM
    • #8
    • 4th Oct 17, 12:05 PM
    The last time I moved, I did it like this
    first I let myself be estimated and after one month I give my meter reading and then I can compare the estimate with the current state and adjust the guideline. I repeat this again after 3-4 months and then it usually fits.
    • Daveahare99
    • By Daveahare99 4th Oct 17, 12:10 PM
    • 49 Posts
    • 20 Thanks
    Daveahare99
    • #9
    • 4th Oct 17, 12:10 PM
    • #9
    • 4th Oct 17, 12:10 PM
    Smart Meters are brilliant. I don't know how I got by without one. I can't recommend them enough.
    • mart6
    • By mart6 4th Oct 17, 12:54 PM
    • 39 Posts
    • 26 Thanks
    mart6
    Maybe the case but i was considering having one fitted
    E.on then told me if i changed suppliers they would not be able to read it remotely
    Looks like another ill thought out rushed installment program by the gov to try and stop
    the continues price hike backlash

    I am having a similar problem to OP does anyone know how reliable ISKRA meters are
    non digital type mine still has dials like a mileometer
    Last edited by mart6; 04-10-2017 at 1:10 PM.
    • pooch
    • By pooch 4th Oct 17, 1:38 PM
    • 716 Posts
    • 341 Thanks
    pooch
    ...
    Looks like another ill thought out rushed installment program by the gov to try and stop the continues price hike backlash...
    Originally posted by mart6
    I think it was as a result of an EU diktat.

    It had been hoped following the Brexit decision, and the subsequent invoking of Article 50, we would be free of such crazy rules imposed on us by others.

    But now May appears to to be planning come April 2019, although we will be out of the EU, we will be in a 'transitional state', so still paying the EU £billions, still being governed by rules passed overseas (and presumably without any of our own representation by then), still allowing uncrontrolled immigration from other EU member states, still being coerced into having smart meters, ... in fact just as it is today except we can all proudly proclaim we are no longer part of the EU.
    Last edited by pooch; 04-10-2017 at 1:40 PM.
  • E.ON Company Representative: Malc
    E.ON Smart Meters
    Maybe the case but i was considering having one fitted
    E.on then told me if i changed suppliers they would not be able to read it remotely
    Looks like another ill thought out rushed installment program by the gov to try and stop
    the continues price hike backlash

    I am having a similar problem to OP does anyone know how reliable ISKRA meters are
    non digital type mine still has dials like a mileometer
    Originally posted by mart6
    At the moment mart6, yes, this is the case. Following a change of supplier, our smart meters will revert to a classic/traditional/dumb type and will need to be read manually.

    This is only temporary until all suppliers use a centralised database, the Data Communications Company (DCC). The DCC will look after the Smart network for all suppliers and pass meter readings to the current supplier.

    Not sure when this will be fully up and running The aim is for customers to be able to switch supplier without losing smart capability. To help with this, we're also looking at a new type of smart meter.

    Malc
    ďOfficial Company Representative
    I am an official company representative of E.ON. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to queries about the company, so that I can help solve issues. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. I am not allowed to tout for business at all. If you believe I am please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com This does NOT imply any form of approval of my company or its products by MSE"
    • mart6
    • By mart6 4th Oct 17, 2:34 PM
    • 39 Posts
    • 26 Thanks
    mart6
    Thanks for the reply E.ON
    Looks like the best option may be hold back on the smart meter till all the gremlins are ironed out
    Firmware fixs ect . Think i will wait for smart meter .2
    Have to say impressed with response time on here.
    Its a bit off topic but when you advise people to phone in
    Have you actually tried yourself ?
    I have on numerous occasions over the last two years the average time to get through was 1 -2 hours
    thats not counting the times i was cut off. Then when you get through and vent your frustration
    unprecedented demand.
    When you ring up and are placed in a que most systems tell you a approx wait time, just maybe its time
    some of those vast profits were spent updating your system
    People just give up trying imo

    And the web site , when its running, see it crashed the other day for a considerable time
    Maybe updating the 2010 software would help the up time
    Last edited by mart6; 04-10-2017 at 2:40 PM.
  • E.ON Company Representative: Malc
    E.ON Call Waiting Times
    Thanks for the reply E.ON
    Looks like the best option may be hold back on the smart meter till all the gremlins are ironed out
    Firmware fixs ect . Think i will wait for smart meter .2
    Have to say impressed with response time on here.
    Its a bit off topic but when you advise people to phone in
    Have you actually tried yourself ?
    I have on numerous occasions over the last two years the average time to get through was 1 -2 hours
    thats not counting the times i was cut off. Then when you get through and vent your frustration
    unprecedented demand.
    When you ring up and are placed in a que most systems tell you a approx wait time, just maybe its time
    some of those vast profits were spent updating your system
    People just give up trying imo

    And the web site , when its running, see it crashed the other day for a considerable time
    Maybe updating the 2010 software would help the up time
    Originally posted by mart6
    You're welcome mart6. Glad to help.

    On the call waiting times, you're right, these haven't been good enough for quite a time now. No excuses. We're aware of the issues and are working to put things right. This includes taking on more staff to help plug the gaps. We also opened a new Call Centre in Glasgow last month to help ease the pressure. New advisors are going through training now but this is quite lengthy as there's a lot to learn. I'd expect to see a gradual improvement over the coming weeks/months.

    Don't know if you've tried them but there are alternative ways to contact us to save the hassle of waiting on the phone. For instance, there's our relatively new online Live Chat service. Advisors are online from 8am to 8pm Monday to Friday and between 8am and 6pm Saturdays.

    On the same website page, there's a link to our email service. There are our social media channels too. Advisors are on our twitter and Facebook feeds at similar times to the Live Chatters. Both twitter and Facebook have private messaging services to protect sensitive information.

    Totally understand, if you need a specialist area of the business, phone might still be the best way. There are a number of different phone numbers on our website in the 'contact us' section. Although there are still lengthy wait times on some of these numbers, it's not necessarily the case with them all.

    Then there's always Helena and I.

    Definitely agree with your suggestions to give details of where you are in the queue and approximate wait times. I raised both ideas earlier this year as formal service improvement requests. They've been taken on board but are on the back burner whilst we work through other priorities.

    Among these priorities is our website. As you say, it was down for quite a time the other day. A large part of this downtime was due to improvements and upgrades we've been putting in place.

    Thanks for the suggestions and your patience mart6.

    Malc
    ďOfficial Company Representative
    I am an official company representative of E.ON. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to queries about the company, so that I can help solve issues. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. I am not allowed to tout for business at all. If you believe I am please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com This does NOT imply any form of approval of my company or its products by MSE"
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