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  • FIRST POST
    • silvercar
    • By silvercar 2nd Oct 17, 8:55 AM
    • 36,205Posts
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    silvercar
    0 WOW
    Monarch Airlines stops trading - latest info and your rights
    • #1
    • 2nd Oct 17, 8:55 AM
    0 WOW
    Monarch Airlines stops trading - latest info and your rights 2nd Oct 17 at 8:55 AM
    Official MoneySavingExpert article:

    Monarch Airlines help

    We're updating this guide throughout the day with answers to new questions when we get them. If you have a question not answered in that guide post it below and we'll do our best to help.

    Huge thanks to silvercar for starting this discussion thread as Monarch news has been changing so quickly. Also see our Section 75 refunds and Visa, Mastercard & Amex Chargeback guides.

    Watch Martin's tips for fighting your corner if your chargeback request is rejected:

    Last edited by MSE Andrea; 11-10-2017 at 10:33 AM.
    I'm a Board Guide on the Debate House Prices & the Economy, House Buying, Renting & Selling, Mortgages and Endowments, In My Home incl DIY, Overseas Holidays & Student boards.
    I volunteer to help get your forum questions answered and keep the forum running smoothly.
    Board guides are not moderators and don't read every post. If you spot an abusive or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com. Any views are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com.
Page 15
    • leylandsunaddict
    • By leylandsunaddict 5th Oct 17, 5:04 PM
    • 1,536 Posts
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    leylandsunaddict
    Personally I am surprised just how many ways you can reclaim your loss in such cases if you have put it on a debit or credit card especially (even via Paypal). We are told to look out for ATOL when booking packages, so why would you pay extra for something that should already be covered?

    Trying to have the right insurance product when something like this happens is expensive. A lot of us have the travel insurance that comes with our current account and personal experience says you think you're covered, but aren't.

    I'm not saying don't buy travel insurance, the medical cover can be invaluable, but remember just how many times in your life you have had a holiday cancelled due to insolvency verses the amount of successful holidays you've had with no glitches.
    Originally posted by N4t4lie
    Credit card yes. Debit card isn't a given whether you'll get a refund or not. Personally, as I don't book package holidays, I prefer to buy insurance that covers. By the amount of complaints around already about not being able to get accommodation costs back, I reckon they'll be more people wish they had bought the appropriate cover for independent travel.
    • silvercar
    • By silvercar 5th Oct 17, 5:06 PM
    • 36,205 Posts
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    silvercar
    I'm pretty sure it is a worldwide policy applied by Visa and definitely by Visa Europe, plenty of info online about it. It may be worth getting a translation of the standard template letter done and sending it to the bank with supporting paperwork to avoid any confusion.
    Originally posted by N4t4lie
    This was outside Europe and he definitely does not have a chargeback option, but agree that anyone should try their visa issuer for their options.
    • leylandsunaddict
    • By leylandsunaddict 5th Oct 17, 5:11 PM
    • 1,536 Posts
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    leylandsunaddict
    It may well be correct. Although Visa is fairly international the cards issued do have different T&Cs. I know of someone due to fly into the UK with Monarch who was told there was no chargeback available on his overseas issued Visa and the CAA won't fly him into the UK on a single flight as he is based overseas so doesn't qualify for repatriation.
    Originally posted by silvercar
    Chargeback within the EU/EEA is covered by yet another EU regulation. Bankruptcy is one reason that is covered, however Monarch isn't bankrupt. They have money in the bank, so maybe some issuers are interpreting it as not being necessary?

    If the issuing bank is outside the EU/EEA it may well be completely different.
    • haggis_muncher
    • By haggis_muncher 5th Oct 17, 9:03 PM
    • 95 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    haggis_muncher
    So even though i have ATOL cover I have to claim back on my Sainsburys credit card.

    Should I use Section 75 or Chargeback as I dont understand the difference and have never done either.

    Fortunately I managed to book another holiday but it cost extra - can I claim the difference.

    Thankyou
    • Caz007
    • By Caz007 5th Oct 17, 10:02 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Caz007
    I booked 2 one way flights from Lisbon for next Year on the 30th Sept with Halifax mastercard credit card, when the news broke I phoned Halifax to try to cancel payment, but because it was pending they said they couldn't stop it and to phone back when it went on my statement, I was hoping the payment would of been void,but now it has gone through, I have to claim it back,but because I haven't actually parted with any money yet, shouldn't Halifax just credit my account back and if they don't, the flight was only £158 for two of us, so would I have to claim chargeback instead of S75. Thanks.
    • Gloomendoom
    • By Gloomendoom 5th Oct 17, 10:27 PM
    • 13,252 Posts
    • 17,468 Thanks
    Gloomendoom
    the flight was only £158 for two of us, so would I have to claim chargeback instead of S75. Thanks.
    Originally posted by Caz007
    Presumably, you made a single payment of £158. If so, S75 applies.
    Advice; it rhymes with mice. Advise; it rhymes with wise.
    • bagand96
    • By bagand96 5th Oct 17, 11:02 PM
    • 2,777 Posts
    • 1,721 Thanks
    bagand96
    Personally I am surprised just how many ways you can reclaim your loss in such cases if you have put it on a debit or credit card especially (even via Paypal). We are told to look out for ATOL when booking packages, so why would you pay extra for something that should already be covered?
    by N4t4lie
    They each provide a slightly different cover though. ATOL is excellent protection... if you are on holiday when your airline or tour operator goes bust, ATOL protection means you can complete your holiday and be flown home.

    Section 75 may cover this, but you’d probably have to fight for it as most card companies would try and just refund you your original payment. Debit card offers no such protection and would only do a chargeback.

    Remember, the Monarch failure had a curious quirk in repatriation.... they are repatriating everyone up until 15tn October. The only people actually entitled to repatriation are those who are ATOL protected, which is the minority. Anybody who booked a flight only is not entitled to it, and is getting a freebie, and a very good one at that!

    It seems the Department for Transport and CAA took the decision to repatriate all. I believe this is unprecedented. It’s not been stated why this decision was taken .... the main theory being the timing coincided with the Conservative Party Conference. It’s also unclear as to who will foot the cost. It’s likely that the trustees of the Air Travel Trust (ATOL) will only authorise payment for those actually ATOL protected, which is the minority, and will leave a huge shortfall in the reported £60million cost of “Air CAA”
    • Wayne h
    • By Wayne h 6th Oct 17, 7:37 AM
    • 4 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Wayne h
    Does anyone have the PayPal phone number complaint still not registering on website
    • N4t4lie
    • By N4t4lie 6th Oct 17, 9:50 AM
    • 131 Posts
    • 80 Thanks
    N4t4lie
    I booked 2 one way flights from Lisbon for next Year on the 30th Sept with Halifax mastercard credit card, when the news broke I phoned Halifax to try to cancel payment, but because it was pending they said they couldn't stop it and to phone back when it went on my statement, I was hoping the payment would of been void,but now it has gone through, I have to claim it back,but because I haven't actually parted with any money yet, shouldn't Halifax just credit my account back and if they don't, the flight was only £158 for two of us, so would I have to claim chargeback instead of S75. Thanks.
    Originally posted by Caz007
    Call them and initiate a chargeback; under £100 per person means you can't use Section 75, as you haven't had a statement yet they should ringfence as if it were a fraudulent transaction (I am not saying it is fraudlent, just that they use the same process) and then recredit your account. Hope that helps.
    • N4t4lie
    • By N4t4lie 6th Oct 17, 9:57 AM
    • 131 Posts
    • 80 Thanks
    N4t4lie
    So even though i have ATOL cover I have to claim back on my Sainsburys credit card.

    Should I use Section 75 or Chargeback as I dont understand the difference and have never done either.

    Fortunately I managed to book another holiday but it cost extra - can I claim the difference.

    Thankyou
    Originally posted by haggis_muncher
    There is a letter on the Monarch CAA web page now saying that if you paid on credit card to go to the provider for a refund.

    If the purchase price of the holiday is over £100 then you can use Section 75 to reclaim. Although this can cover incidental costs it may not cover the increased cost of a new holiday, but it's worth while trying. When Low Cost went under S75 covered the increased cost of the hotel for instance (people still had flights in that case though).

    They can refund using chargeback, but that would only be cover the cost of the original holiday.

    Have a read of Martin's articles on the main web page to familiarise yourself with the details, there are standard letters and guidance on there too.
    • N4t4lie
    • By N4t4lie 6th Oct 17, 10:05 AM
    • 131 Posts
    • 80 Thanks
    N4t4lie
    Does anyone have the PayPal phone number complaint still not registering on website
    Originally posted by Wayne h
    0800 358 7911

    Previous experience says Paypal is in discussion with the administrators and is gathering the information it needs in order to process refunds. If you look at it from their point of view, they have no idea if you have taken the holiday or flight yet (even in their 180 day cut off) and will need this information to verify all claims. If you have put in a dispute be patient. When Low Cost went under all those with valid claims were paid out within a month of the collapse but it took a couple of weeks for them to start processing repayments.

    I agree not knowing is frustrating, but if my previous experience can give you any reassurance I hope it helps.
    • danielson81
    • By danielson81 6th Oct 17, 10:24 AM
    • 124 Posts
    • 30 Thanks
    danielson81
    Just got this from LastMinute, was meant to be flying in a week. Had Monarch flights, and hotel with ATOL protection.

    Might be useful for other LastMinute.com customers:

    Dear Daniel,

    With reference to your reservation , we are sorry to inform you that due to the Monarch airline insolvency annunced in the last few days, your flight has been cancelled.

    We are not able to offer you any suitable alternative plan. As consequence of this we are proceeding to cancel your trip and making the refund of the total amount.

    We are very sorry for the inconvenience.


    Best regards,
    Customer Service Team
    • utigers
    • By utigers 6th Oct 17, 10:40 AM
    • 220 Posts
    • 52 Thanks
    utigers
    Last minute are saying they are going to try and claim flight only refunds with the CAA. So I wonder how successful this will be?


    Bizarrely they cannot tell me the breakdown costs of my flight (Easyjet outbound & Monarch inbound).
    • Caz007
    • By Caz007 6th Oct 17, 10:47 AM
    • 3 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Caz007
    Call them and initiate a chargeback; under £100 per person means you can't use Section 75, as you haven't had a statement yet they should ringfence as if it were a fraudulent transaction (I am not saying it is fraudlent, just that they use the same process) and then recredit your account. Hope that helps.
    Originally posted by N4t4lie
    I have already been in touch with Halifax, all they said was they would send a form out for me to put a claim in, I will state I want chargeback on it, I still think they could of done something before it went on my statement.
    • N4t4lie
    • By N4t4lie 6th Oct 17, 11:05 AM
    • 131 Posts
    • 80 Thanks
    N4t4lie
    I have already been in touch with Halifax, all they said was they would send a form out for me to put a claim in, I will state I want chargeback on it, I still think they could of done something before it went on my statement.
    Originally posted by Caz007
    I'm inclined to agree with you, but bitter experience with banks says you can speak to two people and get two different responses. In this case you have to bear in mind that they may need to verify that it wasn't for a flight or holiday you could have taken; slim possibility you could have purchased on the 30th and have gone away before they went under. It's not always as clear cut as it would first appear.
    • N4t4lie
    • By N4t4lie 6th Oct 17, 2:20 PM
    • 131 Posts
    • 80 Thanks
    N4t4lie
    I can empathise, Tesco's help pages say if it was a package with Monarch then you need to use ATOL and I'm inclined to agree with them else what is the point of having ATOL protection (unless you are stranded abroad, the repatriation is worth the £2.50 per booking in this case). I am a bit baffled that ATOL are sending people to card companies in the first instance, I assume there is a reason, but it's not clear.

    Have you been able to speak to Tesco to see if they are aware the CAA is sending ATOL protected people to them first?

    Maybe wait till you see if you get the CAA form, I'd always assume that insurance pays out and S75 and chargeback are a last resort to get a refund. Remember someone has to pick up the bill in the end.
    Originally posted by N4t4lie
    *UPDATE TO ORIGINAL POST*

    CAA has now issued a letter which can be found on the Monarch CAA page saying that even if you have ATOL you should go to your credit card provider for a refund.

    So best go to Tesco with that. Joys of an unfolding situation, but glad they have at least clarified something for people.
    • leylandsunaddict
    • By leylandsunaddict 6th Oct 17, 2:41 PM
    • 1,536 Posts
    • 1,045 Thanks
    leylandsunaddict
    Maybe wait till you see if you get the CAA form, I'd always assume that insurance pays out and S75 and chargeback are a last resort to get a refund. Remember someone has to pick up the bill in the end.
    Insurance won't pay out for anything that is claimable elsewhere.
    • nkkingston
    • By nkkingston 6th Oct 17, 3:07 PM
    • 446 Posts
    • 505 Thanks
    nkkingston
    0800 358 7911

    Previous experience says Paypal is in discussion with the administrators and is gathering the information it needs in order to process refunds. If you look at it from their point of view, they have no idea if you have taken the holiday or flight yet (even in their 180 day cut off) and will need this information to verify all claims. If you have put in a dispute be patient. When Low Cost went under all those with valid claims were paid out within a month of the collapse but it took a couple of weeks for them to start processing repayments.

    I agree not knowing is frustrating, but if my previous experience can give you any reassurance I hope it helps.
    Originally posted by N4t4lie
    The problem a lot of users are having is we can't even raise a dispute. Paypal say you already have but doesn't show anything (including the first time of trying, so it's not just that you can't see it in the resolution centre). I'm very doubtful paypal will refund anyone who hasn't raised a dispute (why give back more money than necessary?) which makes the fact they're getting closer to having all the information they need more worrying rather than less!
    Mortgage
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    • N4t4lie
    • By N4t4lie 6th Oct 17, 4:01 PM
    • 131 Posts
    • 80 Thanks
    N4t4lie
    The problem a lot of users are having is we can't even raise a dispute. Paypal say you already have but doesn't show anything (including the first time of trying, so it's not just that you can't see it in the resolution centre). I'm very doubtful paypal will refund anyone who hasn't raised a dispute (why give back more money than necessary?) which makes the fact they're getting closer to having all the information they need more worrying rather than less!
    Originally posted by nkkingston
    Hmmm, sounds like they have ringfenced all transactions to Monarch. Wondering after Low Cost that it messed with their metrics so they have decided a different approach.

    In the end Paypal doesn't actually end up out of pocket, not entirely sure how it works, but if you are within 180 days and they haven't amended their user agreement (as far as I am aware, I checked it when they did last year thinking they'd exclude holidays, but didn't) you should get a refund.

    Now if you are ATOL protected you may end up in a discussion (a bit like with insurance companies who won't pay out if anyone else is liable to pay) with Paypal about who pays.

    Let's hope they make an announcement soon as the waiting is horrid. It took them a couple of weeks to work out how to deal with Low Cost, but at least we had communication and open disputes. I know it's hard, but try to bear with them they will be doing what they can behind the scenes to get this resolved and are probably avoiding making statements till they 100% know what is happening.
    • silvercar
    • By silvercar 6th Oct 17, 7:57 PM
    • 36,205 Posts
    • 153,031 Thanks
    silvercar
    4 Tweets from NatWest in the last hour highlighting their position:

    1. check natwest.com/monarch
    2. If you are still due to travel you can claim for flights and packaged holidays booked with monarch if you paid with a NatWest credit card.
    3. If you paid by debit card, you can claim for flight only bookings with us.
    4.Speak to ATOL on packaged holiday bookings paid with your NatWest debit card.

    Twitter handle is @NatWest_Help

    (Not me, I'm just repeating in the hope it can help anyone.)
    I'm a Board Guide on the Debate House Prices & the Economy, House Buying, Renting & Selling, Mortgages and Endowments, In My Home incl DIY, Overseas Holidays & Student boards.
    I volunteer to help get your forum questions answered and keep the forum running smoothly.
    Board guides are not moderators and don't read every post. If you spot an abusive or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com. Any views are mine and not the official line of moneysavingexpert.com.
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